Religion

journolud said:
Nah, as long as there is religion there will be this thread as there will always be those invested in proving it to be false or the cause of all harm in the world
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religion isn't false it there for all to see sadly, its the deities they claim to worship
 
Marklr said:
Point out where in the New Testament that your god condemns slavery... where does it say "slavery is not allowed"? Nothing of what you've written mentions it. Or where does your god say; "you know all that endorsing of slavery I did in the OLD Testament? Well...sorry about this but...I got it wrong. You CAN'T have slaves". This all powerful, perfect, all knowing god.
Of course I'm morally superior to your god and to you. Satan is morally superior to your god.
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The Israelites were not to kidnap (this is the kind of slavery we in the West typically see). Stealing someone ( kidnapping) and selling or even buying him or her carried with it the death penalty (Exodus 21:16- He who kidnaps ( enslaves) a man and sells him, or if he is found in his hand, shall surely be put to death.
Deuteronomy 24:7- If a man is found kidnapping any of his brethren of the children of Israel, and mistreats him or sells him, then that kidnapper shall die; and you shall put away the evil from among you
In the New Testament (1 Timothy 1:9-10 -" understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, for SLAVE TRADERS , for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine"
i.e. those who kidnap , SLAVE TRADE others are included in a list of evil men. God takes human life seriously.
If a slave escaped from his master, the Israelites were not to turn him in, but he was to choose where he wanted to live and settle down in peace (Deuteronomy 23:15–16 " You shall not give back to his master the slave who has escaped from his master to you. He may dwell with you in your midst, in the place which he chooses within one of your gates, where it seems best to him; you shall not oppress him"
This made provision for those with harsh masters who, understandably, wanted to get away and start a new life. They could do so without fear of being handed back over.
The slave owner would be punished if he beat his slave to death. If the Mosaic Law is followed, this would include the death penalty for murder (Exodus 21:12- "He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death" Again, the law in this was proscriptive meant to make people think of the consequences of their actions and impose penalties on violation. To imply that this encourages masters to restrain their beating only to the point that the servant didn’t immediately die is nonsense.In the Western mindset, until quite recently, corporal punishment was the norm, even in the army for those who were insubordinate to authority.
But even in old Israel there was a severe incentive to make sure that people did not beat their slaves. Again, the law in this was proscriptive meant to make people think of the consequences of their actions and impose penalties on violation. This was in a time of the Old lex talionis law where eye for eye and tooth for tooth was practiced. Yet Jesus made this law complete, new and brought it to all cultures. "And as you wish that others would do to you, do so to them. "-Luke 6. Wish that that others wouldn't treat you like a slave you don't wish that they be treated like slaves. You can agree with that at least.
1Corinthians 7:21 - "Were you called while a slave? Do not be concerned about it; but if you can be made free, rather use it" in other words get free if you can and use that to bring others to Jesus Christ because the Roman authorities kept slavery going.
Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is NEITHER SLAVE nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Colossians 3:9 Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man with his deeds, and have put on the new man who is renewed in knowledge according to the image of Him who created him, where there is NEITHER Greek nor Jew, circumcised nor uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, SLAVE nor free, but Christ is all and in all" Every believer is equal now and it doesn't matter your Nationality, religion, people group or language you're all one in Christ.
He has done away with slavery ,yes even the Old Testament Law He has fulfilled it , made it complete, renewed it, finished it in His own life and body. Because it wasn't complete in Old Testament He had to become man , perfect sinless man. Literally GOD taking all the blame for your sins and mine.He said
"DO TO OTHERS WHAT YOU WOULD WANT THEM TO DO TO YOU ." " love one another as I have loved you " The Golden rule.
know what mate you've broken His law by setting up an idol for yourself .1st commandment says " I am the LORD your God you shall have no other gods before me" Your Idol is you yourself as it appears you think you do no wrong. You've no compass, no Ultimate with regard to morality as you've admitted your atheism and you judge God in Christ for wrongdoing when you havent even condemned murder ( in the womb ) or any other of His laws broken by humanity.

"But God be thanked that though you were slaves of sin, yet you obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine to which you were delivered" Faith in Jesus brings the spirit /soul /mind out of slavery and in touch with reality .
 
paulsimpson said:
The Israelites were not to kidnap (this is the kind of slavery we in the West typically see). Stealing someone ( kidnapping) and selling or even buying him or her carried with it the death penalty (Exodus 21:16- He who kidnaps ( enslaves) a man and sells him, or if he is found in his hand, shall surely be put to death.
Deuteronomy 24:7- If a man is found kidnapping any of his brethren of the children of Israel, and mistreats him or sells him, then that kidnapper shall die; and you shall put away the evil from among you
In the New Testament (1 Timothy 1:9-10 -" understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, for SLAVE TRADERS , for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine"
i.e. those who kidnap , SLAVE TRADE others are included in a list of evil men. God takes human life seriously.
If a slave escaped from his master, the Israelites were not to turn him in, but he was to choose where he wanted to live and settle down in peace (Deuteronomy 23:15–16 " You shall not give back to his master the slave who has escaped from his master to you. He may dwell with you in your midst, in the place which he chooses within one of your gates, where it seems best to him; you shall not oppress him"
This made provision for those with harsh masters who, understandably, wanted to get away and start a new life. They could do so without fear of being handed back over.
The slave owner would be punished if he beat his slave to death. If the Mosaic Law is followed, this would include the death penalty for murder (Exodus 21:12- "He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death" Again, the law in this was proscriptive meant to make people think of the consequences of their actions and impose penalties on violation. To imply that this encourages masters to restrain their beating only to the point that the servant didn’t immediately die is nonsense.In the Western mindset, until quite recently, corporal punishment was the norm, even in the army for those who were insubordinate to authority.
But even in old Israel there was a severe incentive to make sure that people did not beat their slaves. Again, the law in this was proscriptive meant to make people think of the consequences of their actions and impose penalties on violation. This was in a time of the Old lex talionis law where eye for eye and tooth for tooth was practiced. Yet Jesus made this law complete, new and brought it to all cultures. "And as you wish that others would do to you, do so to them. "-Luke 6. Wish that that others wouldn't treat you like a slave you don't wish that they be treated like slaves. You can agree with that at least.
1Corinthians 7:21 - "Were you called while a slave? Do not be concerned about it; but if you can be made free, rather use it" in other words get free if you can and use that to bring others to Jesus Christ because the Roman authorities kept slavery going.
Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is NEITHER SLAVE nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Colossians 3:9 Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man with his deeds, and have put on the new man who is renewed in knowledge according to the image of Him who created him, where there is NEITHER Greek nor Jew, circumcised nor uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, SLAVE nor free, but Christ is all and in all" Every believer is equal now and it doesn't matter your Nationality, religion, people group or language you're all one in Christ.
He has done away with slavery ,yes even the Old Testament Law He has fulfilled it , made it complete, renewed it, finished it in His own life and body. Because it wasn't complete in Old Testament He had to become man , perfect sinless man. Literally GOD taking all the blame for your sins and mine.He said
"DO TO OTHERS WHAT YOU WOULD WANT THEM TO DO TO YOU ." " love one another as I have loved you " The Golden rule.
know what mate you've broken His law by setting up an idol for yourself .1st commandment says " I am the LORD your God you shall have no other gods before me" Your Idol is you yourself as it appears you think you do no wrong. You've no compass, no Ultimate with regard to morality as you've admitted your atheism and you judge God in Christ for wrongdoing when you havent even condemned murder ( in the womb ) or any other of His laws broken by humanity.

"But God be thanked that though you were slaves of sin, yet you obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine to which you were delivered" Faith in Jesus brings the spirit /soul /mind out of slavery and in touch with reality .
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Christianity is quite different from islam, so there is no real advocacy for slavery unlike islam. But i think the problem is that religion creates a certain superiority complex and when doing that, you can do some barbaric things to people in the name of Christianity and Islam.
 
tonea2003 said:
you've not answered my question john's jesus proclaims to be god multiple times over and should of been stoned to death
where as the synoptic jesus do not, someone is telling porkies
which jesus are we having as you can't have both as they are completely different people

and whilst you waffle on about sin how do reconcile matt 10:33-35 pretty much a sinner there
and they'll be more
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tonea2003 said:
you've not answered my question john's jesus proclaims to be god multiple times over and should of been stoned to death
where as the synoptic jesus do not, someone is telling porkies
which jesus are we having as you can't have both as they are completely different people

and whilst you waffle on about sin how do reconcile matt 10:33-35 pretty much a sinner there
and they'll be more
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You present a false dilemma , false dichotomy where you try to make a person choose between two unrelated options. But in this case it so happens there exists a text where ,again, Jesus is proclaiming divinity.
Jesus is rejected at Nazareth Luke 6 saying that the "Scriptures are fulfilled today in your hearing ... a prophet is not welcome in his hometown etc etc " . The Messianic claim in Isaiah 61 was fulfilled and they got hold of Him they were so angry He " insulted" their town for its rejection of Him and brought him to a cliff to throw Him over and kill Him for blasphemy. Nazareth is on a hill ,plenty of cliffs. He escaped from the crowd and they were thwarted.
Any other false dilemmas ;-) ?
 
urban genie said:
Ha ha ha, you're crackers mate

But to indulge sure only refences to vegetarianism is verses 1 and 9, which contradict themselves as one says be veggie the other say eat what you like as long as its blood is drained.
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No contradiction, because the effects of sin of Adam were progressively getting worse as God withdrew His sustaining hand . No animal was hostile to man at the beginning.
Eh there was a beginning you know? And at the beginning All creatures were made perfect. No defects . Humans had the innumerable symbiotic complexities formed at once otherwise there would be no functionality.
But you'll get the cult in here of macro evolution miracle believers who think :
nothing created matter ,stars - uniformity ,order in nature came automatically just by chance without any mechanism
Life miraculously came from non life ; "
molecules turned into men over billions of years- great great great great..... grandfather was some sort of chemical soup ;
Who think the rock layers took millions of years to be laid down.Think , how does a jelly fish become fossilised ? Hint : fast sea water movement of sediment

1.5 billion atheists believe this nonsense. And they tell me I need a doctor?! :-) :-)
 
paulsimpson said:
No contradiction, because the effects of sin of Adam were progressively getting worse as God withdrew His sustaining hand . No animal was hostile to man at the beginning.
Eh there was a beginning you know? And at the beginning All creatures were made perfect. No defects . Humans had the innumerable symbiotic complexities formed at once otherwise there would be no functionality.
But you'll get the cult in here of macro evolution miracle believers who think :
nothing created matter ,stars - uniformity ,order in nature came automatically just by chance without any mechanism
Life miraculously came from non life ; "
molecules turned into men over billions of years- great great great great..... grandfather was some sort of chemical soup ;
Who think the rock layers took millions of years to be laid down.Think , how does a jelly fish become fossilised ? Hint : fast sea water movement of sediment

1.5 billion atheists believe this nonsense. And they tell me I need a doctor?! :-) :-)
Click to expand...

Yeah the begining was 13 billion years ago and we and all creatures on this planet (and others more likely) are just the latest in the lifecyle of the atoms that form us.

Everything singularly unique and random, not formed by some masterplan by a mystical celestrial.

And even if it was some omnipitent being(s) doimg we are nowt but a mere spec in an infinate universe and probably not evem in such a beings thoughts for millenia, hence why the world is so fucked up.
 
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