Russian invasion of Ukraine

[roubaixtuesday]

it's not our choice to tell Ukraine to defend their country to the last Ukrainian

Yet here you are, telling everyone what that they should capitulate.

 

[BobKowalski]

....

And while I've not heard anyone here actually say it, it's not our choice to tell Ukraine to defend their country to the last Ukrainian.

No, it isn’t. Neither is it our place to tell the Ukrainians not to either. The West can provide the weapons the Ukrainians ask for, the decision to use those weapons and fight is entirely down to them.

 

[Vic]

Yet here you are, telling everyone what that they should capitulate.

I tell you what, I'll capitulate, because I don't want an argument with people who don't understand the argument.

 

[BlueAnorak]

I see the Russians are going to declare war on May the 9th. No change really - just so they can legally access the draft and poor the conscript foder into the Ukraine meat grinder.
I was reading that there have been 30% Russian casualties so far. That's more than the battle of the Somme.

 

[Octavian]

Rubbish.
If the US was an active participant then you might have a point about the benefits of having an inspirational leader. That requirement to be inspirational is what’s needed from Zelenskyy and he’s delivering in spades.

As it is, what’s needed from the US is a leader that has a deep understanding of what’s going on, the importance of a unified approach from the west and the ability to keep allies on board irrespective of petty differences. He’s doing a pretty good job at that whilst leading the effort to provide as much military supplies as the Ukrainians need.

Every time he opens his mouth there’s a risk he could escalate it to a world war. Telling the world press Putin shouldn’t be leader is what we’re all thinking but you don’t say it.

the whole west other than Germany is doing the exact same, Boris has looked ok which says it all really.

The bad thing is that he’s getting worse by seemingly every speech as well, lots of the things he says makes no sense and are the ramblings of a man with serious cognitive decline.

 

[Octavian]

Biden really has been pretty brilliant throughout this, which has annoyed his detractors no end.

He's not just secured the money and weapons and acted quickly, he's towed the line in the war or words absolutely perfectly, going hard when it's needed but not being drawn into unnecessary escalation.

Not really surprising given how long he's been around these things, but his staff, the white house, the military...whoever is plotting the course he's taking has done it well.

Apart from when he said Putin cannot remain in power and nearly risked escalating it to a NATO Russian conflict…

I suppose it could have been worse but Biden definitely isn’t and hasn’t been “brilliant”.

 

[Blue Mist]

I see the Russians are going to declare war on May the 9th. No change really - just so they can legally access the draft and poor the conscript foder into the Ukraine meat grinder.
I was reading that there have been 30% Russian casualties so far. That's more than the battle of the Somme.

The interesting thing is it also allows him to call on his allies to send men and weapons. Could this help these regions start their own uprising as the military move out ?
By the way, I ain't got a scooby so I am asking the question. If puppet regimes collapse the whole lot could?

 

[Octavian]

There was I, thinking nuclear winter to last a thousand years might be worse.

Putin's attitude to Donbas seems to be "In order to liberate the town, we had to destroy it".

"In order to defeat Putin, we had to blow up the world" doesn't sound too bright either. But with Liz Truss talking about forcing Russia to relinquish control of Crimea, I hope there are some cool heads in western governments.

Liz Truss is an idiot

 

[SWP's back]

Things clearly going well. From Eurasia Group...

‘A senior EU source: “Putin has now taken day-to day-control of the conflict and delegated the running of Russia to the Prime Minister’

Hitler did that towards the end. Worked out well I believe.

 

[mosssideblue]

Liz Truss is an idiot

She at least is prepared to say it is to Putin et Al.

Her comment also happened to be aligned with Zalensky