Shootings in Paris

[Tanzeylee]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-to-demand-apology-for-anti-semitic-netanyahu-cartoon/

Meanwhile israel is demanding an apology for nethanyahou cartoon
so much for freedom of speech isnt it ? wasnt he in the march for i quote "freedom of speech "

What's the problem? Their offended by a cartoon and asked for an apology, much better course of action than shooting the cartoonist...

nevermind

What no 5000 word essay now on double standards and conspiracy theories?...

 

[Citizen in Pakistan]

What's the problem? Their offended by a cartoon and asked for an apology, much better course of action than shooting the cartoonist...

nevermind

What no 5000 word essay now on double standards and conspiracy theories?...

No because its people like who believe in everything and let the war monglers do what they do,i am sure you dont find any guilt in the fact that iraq was bombed for wmds and they never found it ?and iraqis did get though was 2 million dead bodies

 

[blueinsa]

I see the british media are not publishing/showing/broadcasting the Charlie Hebdo edition today for fear of offending Muslims, I'm sorry but that's just bullshit, yet again this country is been ruled by fear. If they all agreed to do it then this would show they aren't afraid, if your offended don't watch or read that show/publication, the same applies to any made up cult worshipping a thing that doesn't exist. Religion I shit on it.

Agreed. All this does is give these lunatics the illusion that they are winning and have power over our way of life.

 

[scotty123]

Charlie sold out within minutes of going on sale in France this Morning, they are considering doing a second print run
Freedom of speech is alive and well in France.....for the moment

 

[Tanzeylee]

nevermind

What no 5000 word essay now on double standards and conspiracy theories?...

No because its people like who believe in everything and let the war monglers do what they do,i am sure you dont find any guilt in the fact that iraq was bombed for wmds and they never found it ?and iraqis did get though was 2 million dead bodies

People like "who" is that Dr who? But it's ok, you keep making generalisations about people like me if you want, it's your prerogative, I won't be offended...

 

[foxy]

I think we need to look at demographics. Jews and Christians have been pretty much settled in their respective areas across Europe for generations. That leads to a sense of security and acceptance.
If your environment is somewhat 'new' then you will feel less secure.

Fair dues to them after the last century or so then. All the ones fucking off to Israel from France this week might disagree with you though.

There were few communities who felt more secure and accepted than the German Jews prior to 1933. Even then, racial supremacists like Houston Stewart Chamberlain, were warning that Jews would corrupt the "noble" German character. This eerily reflects modern-day comments like "They're trying to force their beliefs on us", "They need to accept our values & culture" and "Multi-culturalism has been a failure."

Once the Nazis came to power, the main outlet for their anti-semitism was the newspaper Der Sturmer, which published crude, anti-semitic cartoons.

In 1938, a young Polish Jew walked into the German Embassy in Paris and shot dead Ernst vom Rath, a German diplomat, in protest at his parents being expelled from Germany. This was the catalyst for Kristallnacht, which was effectively the start of the Holocaust.

I'm sure that stirring up racial hatred on a huge scale wasn't in any way the intention of the Charlie Hebdo cartoonists but actions sometimes have unintended consequences.

No it doesn't one bit. Nobody is saying that Muslims should leave, nobody is suggesting they are forcing their beliefs on us, this argument is about how they are allowed to be offended and we should make exceptions and restrict our freedom of speech but it's fine to mock any other religion, group, political party etc..

Mocking/criticizing a religious belief and committing the holocaust are 2 completely different ball games... I don't have time to go in to it but the Nazi hatred for the jewish population stems from racism, jealousy and a horrible tradition of persecution. The argument today has nothing to do with any of those traits.

 

[Citizen in Pakistan]

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPK7t5B2UN4&feature=youtu.be" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPK7t5B2 ... e=youtu.be</a>

some people might disagree with Russel Brand, but this guy offers a little different perspective and some people may understand what the real problem is,

 

[SWP's back]

I like being called names on here. It shows I'm on the right track.
Please enlighten us as to what their thinking was?

You really believe this is about saying 'fuck you' to Muslims? Don't they also take the piss out of other religious figures? I'm still waiting for Jewish/Christian posters to come on here ranting about such offensive cartoons. I actually get the feeling you'd like your accusations to be true for some weird reason.

I think we need to look at demographics. Jews and Christians have been pretty much settled in their respective areas across Europe for generations. That leads to a sense of security and acceptance.
If your environment is somewhat 'new' then you will feel less secure.

Yeah, loads of expat Christian kids blowing themselves up and shooting people here in Qatar so totally agree....

 

[inbetween]

Fair dues to them after the last century or so then. All the ones fucking off to Israel from France this week might disagree with you though.

There were few communities who felt more secure and accepted than the German Jews prior to 1933. Even then, racial supremacists like Houston Stewart Chamberlain, were warning that Jews would corrupt the "noble" German character. This eerily reflects modern-day comments like "They're trying to force their beliefs on us", "They need to accept our values & culture" and "Multi-culturalism has been a failure."

Once the Nazis came to power, the main outlet for their anti-semitism was the newspaper Der Sturmer, which published crude, anti-semitic cartoons.

In 1938, a young Polish Jew walked into the German Embassy in Paris and shot dead Ernst vom Rath, a German diplomat, in protest at his parents being expelled from Germany. This was the catalyst for Kristallnacht, which was effectively the start of the Holocaust.

I'm sure that stirring up racial hatred on a huge scale wasn't in any way the intention of the Charlie Hebdo cartoonists but actions sometimes have unintended consequences.

No it doesn't one bit. Nobody is saying that Muslims should leave, nobody is suggesting they are forcing their beliefs on us, this argument is about how they are allowed to be offended and we should make exceptions and restrict our freedom of speech but it's fine to mock any other religion, group, political party etc..

Mocking/criticizing a religious belief and committing the holocaust are 2 completely different ball games... I don't have time to go in to it but the Nazi hatred for the jewish population stems from racism, jealousy and a horrible tradition of persecution. The argument today has nothing to do with any of those traits.

So if someone burns poppies are you happy to allow their right to free speech?

This whole thing has a worryingly high undertone of "yes, here is our chance to have a go at 'them'".

Free speech is a load of bollocks. Just because we do not care in this country about religion, does not mean people cannot be offended. Surely in a world of so called free speech, anyone can say anything but the opposite party ALSO has the right to be offended which is why this cartoon should not be published. What does publishing this cartoon say to the Muslim population in this country, basically we do not give a toss about you.

Again this is just another example of our so called hatred to people who have different views and a different way of life as though ours is perfect. I have some great Muslim friends and I would not offend them so why the hell should I agree this cartoon be published. Don't tell me free speech because that is bollocks. Everyone also has the right to be offended, if someone called you a twat in the street would you be offended, probably but they are surely expressing their right to free speech? Well Muslims will be offended because as a group of people, they just happen to care a lot about their religion, it is a way of life for many of them, of course they will be offended.

This doesn't change the fact though that only an extremely small minority of nutters actually go out and blow people up because of it, there is a very big distinction just like the holocaust/jewish example above with Germany.

It is all a load of tosh and going out to offend a lot of people for the sake of our so called given right to offend people is absolutely ridiculous.

 

[SWP's back]

I think we need to look at demographics. Jews and Christians have been pretty much settled in their respective areas across Europe for generations. That leads to a sense of security and acceptance.
If your environment is somewhat 'new' then you will feel less secure.

Fair dues to them after the last century or so then. All the ones fucking off to Israel from France this week might disagree with you though.

There were few communities who felt more secure and accepted than the German Jews prior to 1933. Even then, racial supremacists like Houston Stewart Chamberlain, were warning that Jews would corrupt the "noble" German character. This eerily reflects modern-day comments like "They're trying to force their beliefs on us", "They need to accept our values & culture" and "Multi-culturalism has been a failure."

Once the Nazis came to power, the main outlet for their anti-semitism was the newspaper Der Sturmer, which published crude, anti-semitic cartoons.

In 1938, a young Polish Jew walked into the German Embassy in Paris and shot dead Ernst vom Rath, a German diplomat, in protest at his parents being expelled from Germany. This was the catalyst for Kristallnacht, which was effectively the start of the Holocaust.

I'm sure that stirring up racial hatred on a huge scale wasn't in any way the intention of the Charlie Hebdo cartoonists but actions sometimes have unintended consequences.

Jews = race
Muslims are not a race.

A point I keep having to make.