Taking fans for granted

Exeter Blue I am here

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Take a wild guess.......
It wouldn't be unreasonable, all things considered, to suggest that we have the best owners in world football. They've invested huge sums of money in the squad, bought out the club's debt, regenerated the local area, built a fabulous academy, and despite the best efforts of the rag and dipper filled media, who have been ever ready to sneer, successfully raised our profile the world over.
17 years ago I was traipsing out of the ground at Wycombe in the mist and rain, cursing a truly shit City defeat and farcical transport infrastructure that would see me stuck in traffic for what seemed like a lifetime on the only road in or out of a glorified industrial estate, and last week I was in the Bernabeu. Alright, we had to endure farcical access difficulties at the latter venue as well, and of course City were shit again, but you get the picture. What an overall journey.

What's starting to become a cause of concern though (and I'm an instinctive whinger, so feel free to have a pop if you think what follows is OTT), is the creeping sensation that as supporters we don't matter, and that there is an increasing disconnect between the fans, the team and the club. Undoubtedly things beyond City's control have served to fuel this feeling - the calculated last minute volte face by UEFA over the stadium ban in Kiev, which left most City fans, who would otherwise have gone to the game, unable to do so at such short notice, and those that could still go facing enhanced airfares, being one such example, and the behaviour of Franco's thugs last week being another (€110 for a match ticket, which entitled you to be beaten up and miss the start of the game courtesy of those supposedly entrusted with your safety).

There was a Deloitte Touché study in 2013 I think (although there probably is every year) which revealed that of the 20 teams in the Premier League, City fans had the 2nd lowest level of disposable income behind only Wigan, and whilst that study is not wholly relevant to the debate, it should perhaps serve as a guide/reminder to the club, that there is only so far that we, as a fanbase, can be pushed before economic necessity reveals itself in, dare I say, such things as empty seats.
Anyway, the little things that have pissed me off this season.
1. Club surveys including questions designed to establish what I would be prepared to pay for a season ticket/hospitality etc etc. The reasoning for such loaded questioning is obvious.
2. The £60 CL tickets for the PSG game. To a degree, I could understand the club's stance on this. It was the QF of the most prestigious club competition in world football, and they (our owners) are trying to make us a global brand. Setting the price at a level most (and I stress 'most', not 'all') fans could just about afford, guarantees a seat for 'most' of our traditional support, but with plenty left over for new overseas fans buying 'packages'. The problem though, and I refer back to the Deloitte Touché study, is that whilst 'most' people could afford it (QED, the ground was full), many could do so perhaps only with difficulty, and as such it left a bad taste.
3. City in the City. A great idea for long distance Blues like myself. A chartered train out of Euston for CL nights and a chartered train back after the match, which was marketed with an arrival time in London that would have enabled passengers just about sufficient time to make the last tubes home. Barely 3 days before the Kiev game though, the train's first running, passengers received an email notifying them that the arrival time back in London would be an hour later than advertised, long after the tube network had shut, leaving everyone with expensive taxis as virtually the only option to get home. Given that the train ticket was already £60 and included VAT that should only have been applicable to those who had purchased train AND hospitality packages, this wasn't exactly a welcome development. Even less welcome was the unjustifiable price rise to £72 for the Madrid game, and again with VAT levied when it should not have been.
4. The Madrid ticket debacle. Yes there was a short time frame for the sale, yes the logistics of hiring and training additional temporary staff and/or reconfiguring webpages to accommodate additional traffic, are probably more complex than people might imagine, but regardless it was a fucking shambles. Two windows open at the ground, a permanently frozen website, and an absurd wait on the phone. Whatever, it was the club's decision to make 2 tickets available to each CL scheme member, it was the club's decision not to set specific sale times in line with loyalty points and it was the club's decision to rig the phone lines so they could take up to 1000 callers on near permanent hold. This latter option cost me an additional £30 for the call on top of the price of the ticket, and nearly 5 hours on the phone. I wrote and complained, and duly received a generic 3 line response to the effect that there had been 'unprecedented demand', and, er, that's it. Again, it was the glib expectation that fans should have to shoulder this additional financial burden when the fiasco was not of their making, that rankled.
5. Having queued up to present my letter and get my wristband in Madrid, and been advised that I should not be admitted to the ground without both said wristband and my passport, I was duly allowed in with checks on neither, and found myself sat behind a group of well heeled Spaniards, who had no wristbands and probably no passports.
6. The decision to delay a lap of honour against Arsenal by 15 minutes after a shit season. Understandably everyone pissed off home, leaving the media free to portray us all as a bunch of spoiled ingrates.

Going back to the Wycombe game, at the end of that season, that group of players became legends. We loved them and they loved us. Kevin Horlock regularly attends City matches in London with his kids, as does Paul Dickov. Andy Morrison turned up in the Plaza de Real in Barcelona last year and was mobbed. The Goat is one of the greatest City heroes of all time. Maybe the passing of time is making me misty eyed, but I couldn't imagine them doing what the City players (bar Joe Hart and Jesus Navas) did at Leicester this Christmas when led by 'captain' (and I use the term in its least literal sense) Ya Ya they fucked off straight down the tunnel without so much as an acknowledgement to the travelling support.

Like I said at the start, I might be being over sensitive and I'm certainly conscious that I might also be guilty of making a mountain out of every little molehill, but I feel increasingly like we're being taken for mugs, and that gimmicky shite of the 'We play for you' variety is no substitute for genuine interaction. Maybe the visual debacle that was Pellers farewell speech will start to bring that home to the people running the club, who knows?
 
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I stayed for the presentation as the person I go with lives for everything City. I would have gone home had I been on my own. If they'd have come out straight at the end of the game a lot more would have stayed. As for the Madrid ticket fiasco nobody has convinced me it was anything other than a ploy to get people on the scheme.

I get what you're saying, I've never been as disconnected and part of it for me is Pellegrini. I never watch his press conferences, they are the same every week, boring. I loved Mancini, he was mischievous, witty and interesting. I'm not a Pellegrini basher, it's just his personality and he never connects or gives anything away which, in some ways, is what we wanted. To politely stick two fingers up to the press after their disgusting treatment of Mancini.

We'll be right next season, you'll see. Onwards and upwards.
 
I stayed for the presentation as the person I go with lives for everything City. I would have gone home had I been on my own. If they'd have come out straight at the end of the game a lot more would have stayed. As for the Madrid ticket fiasco nobody has convinced me it was anything other than a ploy to get people on the scheme.

I get what you're saying, I've never been as disconnected and part of it for me is Pellegrini. I never watch his press conferences, they are the same every week, boring. I loved Mancini, he was mischievous, witty and interesting. I'm not a Pellegrini basher, it's just his personality and he never connects or gives anything away which, in some ways, is what we wanted. To politely stick two fingers up to the press after their disgusting treatment of Mancini.

We'll be right next season, you'll see. Onwards and upwards.

Good point, I should have picked up on that.
 
My CL Ro16 ticket: £30...CL 1/4: £55

My SC prices:
2010-11 £450
2011-12 £500
2012-13 £550
2013-14 £625
2014-15 £700
2015-16 £750
(Inflation has been below 1% for a few years and hasn't topped more than 4% in those^ years)

I reckoned up last year that I've had 24 mates and family members fall away from our support since the takeover due to price increases. After those years/decades of loyalty, they're just forgotten about as they parade some foreign competition winners on the pitch at half time who won tickets for the game yesterday or the adverts on screen with Kompany saying "welcome to our visitors today from Malaysia".

People reckon it could be about 30% of our away allocations at United Liverpool Chelsea and Arsenal are now corporate and we only get 3000 as it is. A mate of mine went to Arsenal last season and said there were Arsenal fans in our away end.

I don't feel valued by the club, I just feel like some customer who they wouldn't care about if I didn't renew my SC this Summer as they could just replace me with someone else who might spend more than I do on food or in the club shop and they could charge more as the years go by. If my seat could go on some ticket website every week even better because it could be some tourist from some far flung country and it could go for £100 a game.

There's a real lack of "Manchester" about Manchester City Football Club. Everything's about the fucking Moon or aimed at a worldwide fanbase. And it's all about how much money they can make from anyone who'll pay it.
 
Big bollock dropped by the club IMHO.
Why couldn't the U18's and other teams come on immediately for their laps of honour and and then start to show the videos of Pellers time at City after 7 minutes with the team coming back on after about 15 mins with the League Cup, with some words by Pellers on 20 mins. Job done in 20-25 mins. The 20 odd thousand that drifted away in the 20 mins post games wouldn't have left leaving around 30,000 in the ground for the main event.

Whilst I admit the Pro/Anti Wenger Tarquin fans kicking off against each other was amusing it only raised a smile for a few minutes.
 
It wouldn't be unreasonable, all things considered, to suggest that we have the best owners in world football. They've invested huge sums of money in the squad, bought out the club's debt, regenerated the local area, built a fabulous academy, and despite the best efforts of the rag and dipper filled media, who have been ever ready to sneer, successfully raised our profile the world over.
17 years ago I was traipsing out of the ground at Wycombe in the mist and rain, cursing a truly shit City defeat and farcical transport infrastructure that would see me stuck in traffic for what seemed like a lifetime on the only road in or out of a glorified industrial estate, and last week I was in the Bernabeu. Alright, we had to endure farcical access difficulties at the latter venue as well, and of course City were shit again, but you get the picture. What an overall journey.

What's starting to become a cause of concern though (and I'm an instinctive whinger, so feel free to have a pop if you think what follows is OTT), is the creeping sensation that as supporters we don't matter, and that there is an increasing disconnect between the fans, the team and the club. Undoubtedly things beyond City's control have served to fuel this feeling - the calculated last minute volte face by UEFA over the stadium ban in Kiev, which left most City fans, who would otherwise have gone to the game, unable to do so at such short notice, and those that could still go facing enhanced airfares, being one such example, and the behaviour of Franco's thugs last week being another (€110 for a match ticket, which entitled you to be beaten up and miss the start of the game courtesy of those supposedly entrusted with your safety).

There was a Deloitte Touché study in 2013 I think (although there probably is every year) which revealed that of the 20 teams in the Premier League, City fans had the 2nd lowest level of disposable income behind only Wigan, and whilst that study is not wholly relevant to the debate, it should perhaps serve as a guide/reminder to the club, that there is only so far that we, as a fanbase, can be pushed before economic necessity reveals itself in, dare I say, such things as empty seats.
Anyway, the little things that have pissed me off this season.
1. Club surveys including questions designed to establish what I would be prepared to pay for a season ticket/hospitality etc etc. The reasoning for such loaded questioning is obvious.
2. The £60 CL tickets for the PSG game. To a degree, I could understand the club's stance on this. It was the QF of the most prestigious club competition in world football, and they (our owners) are trying to make us a global brand. Setting the price at a level most (and I stress 'most', not 'all') fans could just about afford, guarantees a seat for 'most' of our traditional support, but with plenty left over for new overseas fans buying 'packages'. The problem though, and I refer back to the Deloitte Touché study, is that whilst 'most' people could afford it (QED, the ground was full), many could do so perhaps only with difficulty, and as such it left a bad taste.
3. City in the City. A great idea for long distance Blues like myself. A chartered train out of Euston for CL nights and a chartered train back after the match, which was marketed with an arrival time in London that would have enabled passengers just about sufficient time to make the last tubes home. Barely 3 days before the Kiev game though, the train's first running, passengers received an email notifying them that the arrival time back in London would be an hour later than advertised, long after the tube network had shut, leaving everyone with expensive taxis as virtually the only option to get home. Given that the train ticket was already £60 and included VAT that should only have been applicable to those who had purchased train AND hospitality packages, this wasn't exactly a welcome development. Even less welcome was the unjustifiable price rise to £72 for the Madrid game, and again with VAT levied when it should not have been.
4. The Madrid ticket debacle. Yes there was a short time frame for the sale, yes the logistics of hiring and training additional temporary staff and/or reconfiguring webpages to accommodate additional traffic, are probably more complex than people might imagine, but regardless it was a fucking shambles. Two windows open at the ground, a permanently frozen website, and an absurd wait on the phone. Whatever, it was the club's decision to make 2 tickets available to each CL scheme member, it was the club's decision not to set specific sale times in line with loyalty points and it was the club's decision to rig the phone lines so they could take up to 1000 callers on near permanent hold. This latter option cost me an additional £30 for the call on top of the price of the ticket, and nearly 5 hours on the phone. I wrote and complained, and duly received a generic 3 line response to the effect that there had been 'unprecedented demand', and, er, that's it. Again, it was the glib expectation that fans should have to shoulder this additional financial burden when the fiasco was not of their making, that rankled.
5. Having queued up to present my letter and get my wristband in Madrid, and been advised that I should not be admitted to the ground without both said wristband and my passport, I was duly allowed in with checks on neither, and found myself sat behind a group of well heeled Spaniards, who had no wristbands and probably no passports.
6. The decision to delay a lap of honour against Arsenal by 15 minutes after a shit season. Understandably everyone pissed off home, leaving the media free to portray us all as a bunch of spoiled ingrates.

Going back to the Wycombe game, at the end of that season, that group of players became legends. We loved them and they loved us. Kevin Horlock regularly attends City matches in London with his kids, as does Paul Dickov. Andy Morrison turned up in the Plaza de Real in Barcelona last year and was mobbed. The Goat is one of the greatest City heroes of all time. Maybe the passing of time is making me misty eyed, but I couldn't imagine them doing what the City players (bar Joe Hart and Jesus Navas) did at Leicester this Christmas when led by 'captain' (and I use the term in its least literal sense) Ya Ya they fucked off straight down the tunnel without so much as an acknowledgement to the travelling support.

Like I said at the start, I might be being over sensitive and I'm certainly conscious that I might also be guilty of making a mountain out of every little molehill, but I feel increasingly like we're being taken for mugs, and that gimmicky shite of the 'We play for you' variety is no substitute for genuine interaction. Maybe the visual debacle that was Pellers farewell speech will start to bring that home to the people running the club, who knows?


I think we’ve all discussed this at some moment in time but I’m currently experiencing a general sense that the dream of success is far more enjoyable than the fleeting moments of sheer unadulterated joy that disappear almost as quickly as they arrived.
The reason why we cherish those misty eyed memories of Lincoln, Wycombe, and York, is that as City gradually turned the corner, those defeats became our badge of honour.
On a similar theme, do you remember that night match at Maine Road, when Arsenal raced into an early 4-0 lead?
The streakers?
The gallows humour?
The Football League is upside down?

Do you remember those patronising Arsenal fans after the game on 606?
“Man City are the real football fans from Manchester..."
“I really hope that one day they win something because they deserve it more than anyone”


Well, I’ve got news for Arsenal, because in the last decade, we’ve actually won more trophies than them
How ironic that yesterday, they were singing “Where were you when you were shit?”


However, your main point is right. We’ve opened Pandora’s Box, and sadly there’s no turning back.

Nothing will ever be the same, and this season I’ve missed more away games than the previous four seasons combined. I don’t feel the buzz anymore, and let’s be honest, City aren’t missing me.
Perhaps it’s just an age thing. I was also in Madrid last week, and at 51 years of age, I felt nothing, but disgust at being treated so badly, not just by the Spanish Police, but also by the whole Ticket Collection Fiasco.

Forget the York game. I was one of those supporters who attended 56 of our 60 games in 87-88, when City averaged less than 20,000. The Club doesn’t need me anymore,but as we celebrate our highest ever average attendance, I suspect that we’ve lost something far more important.
 
All of the above, by far the best tread I have read for many a year. Just relived its not just me
who feels this way.
 
Good post that John, can't disagree with how you feel mate. I almost started a thread a while back on how I felt about us becoming the corporate monster that we hated just like the rags have been for years. The sad thing is I genuinely feel the club know that loyal fans are being priced out year on year, but as long as some one with deeper pockets fills the seat, (despite having no genuine affection or affinity with the club) they are prepared to carry on pricing fans out whilst the camera clicking half n half scarf wearing tourists continue to swell the numbers, and I think this is affecting match day atmosphere.

Like yourself, I've been going many years well before the money came, when winning a trophy was a far distant dream. But hey, I like seeing us lifting the Premier league and winning cups, so for a few seasons more, I'll dig deeper for my s/c before I shuffle of the scene to be replaced by whoever fills my seat because they can afford it while I probably can't.
 

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