The Post General Election Thread

[tony coleman]

This talk of savage public sector cuts is dramatic at best. Of the 12 billion - 40 percent will come from tax evasion, significant amounts from housing benefit reform. How many under 25s do you know are able to buy a house? And yet the single mum from Rochdale can have 3 kids by 23 and get a 3 bedroom council house. That option in life has to be eradicated. It is unfair on working people for that type of thing to be happening. Working people have to make choices like living with parents until mid twenties, renting, house sharing, delaying having children and paying there way. We have to still somehow provide the safety net for genuine cases but the safety net is too full. Even if you do not like it - a lot of this is due to uncontrolled immigration and millions of people especially in London getting a ridiculous amount of"free money" I will happily debate this with Damocles, ducado, pb or anyone in a civil manner. I maintain my stance in my post the other day (where ducado called me idiotic) that the Labour Party now largely represent public sector workers, those on benefits, immigrants and people like my dad who is a dinosaur Union man. The plasterer, bricklayer, white collar man is best off voting Tory. In work yesterday the vast majority of professionals had voted Tory and we're of exactly the same opinion. In fact someone said these people on the extreme left who want doctors to earn the same as shelf stackers should be shot! ( I am not going that far!!!) My mrs in the public sector said very much the opposite and that the mood was down. This supports my opinion. There were literally thousanfs of people in the public sector who contributed nothing for years and years. Quite rightly they have been streamlined. At the peak of the recession they had the audacity to talk about strikes when they got offered a one percent pay rise. Meanwhile the bricklayer has seen his pay halfed in that time and that is even if he was in work.

This utter nonsense about stripping the public sector a la thatcher and having to spend more to rebuild it is quite simply that.

Harsh decisions have to be made to make people realise if you want to get on in this country you have to work hard. Cameron says it repeatedly and it seems fair to me.

Ps my kids came home last night and the ten year old had been told by her teacher that it was a sad day as cameron had got in and was going to close down the nhs!!!!

Looking forward to parents evening.

I like this post Mr. W W. As for the teacher he or she needs to be sacked. They should not preaching their political views to primary school children.

 

[EalingBlue2]

*sigh*

I don't see 'English' or 'Scot' or any of that shite, just people.

You play your game I'll play mine.

Spot on! Anyone who thinks someone's interests are determined purely by their race or nationality misses the point of humanity. the idea that any economic policy is in all the interests of England or Scotland is utterly farcical. As with everything any policy will be in the interests of some north and south of the border and not in others.

Also the talk of English and scots is made even more farcical when you actually think how many people in both countries are not English or scots or indeed are scots in England or English in Scotland.

Keep seeing people for who they are.......

Once again you totally misunderstand the point.

The Scots want financial autonomy. They want to be able to decide their own levels of income tax and corporation tax. They want to be able to decide how much they use for public spending. They will now get that. It will save the English a few quid.

It's kind of an important point, your post was literally just words without any meaning.

I am at a loss as to how you can post so much and miss the point each and every time.

My meaning is very simple the interests of individuals are determined by wealth, ability, age, the constituency they live in, what their profession is etc far more than their nationality. I am fed up with nationalist English or scots thinking they can solve their problems through nationalism rather than by tackling the real issues. I actually think that the SNP have many of the simplistic attitudes that UKIP do. Unfortunately sAlmond like Farage is a very very able politician, unfortunately able politicians are not always great leaders.

You seem to always talk about a collection of individuals with different needs as one bloc of people with one interest that isn't true. Scottish nationalism is just people who feel they have a raw deal wanting more with able politicians exploiting this , not as different to UKIP as they would want everyone to believe, both want to divide to suit self interest!

 

[worsleyweb]

This talk of savage public sector cuts is dramatic at best. Of the 12 billion - 40 percent will come from tax evasion, significant amounts from housing benefit reform. How many under 25s do you know are able to buy a house? And yet the single mum from Rochdale can have 3 kids by 23 and get a 3 bedroom council house. That option in life has to be eradicated. It is unfair on working people for that type of thing to be happening. Working people have to make choices like living with parents until mid twenties, renting, house sharing, delaying having children and paying there way. We have to still somehow provide the safety net for genuine cases but the safety net is too full. Even if you do not like it - a lot of this is due to uncontrolled immigration and millions of people especially in London getting a ridiculous amount of"free money" I will happily debate this with Damocles, ducado, pb or anyone in a civil manner. I maintain my stance in my post the other day (where ducado called me idiotic) that the Labour Party now largely represent public sector workers, those on benefits, immigrants and people like my dad who is a dinosaur Union man. The plasterer, bricklayer, white collar man is best off voting Tory. In work yesterday the vast majority of professionals had voted Tory and we're of exactly the same opinion. In fact someone said these people on the extreme left who want doctors to earn the same as shelf stackers should be shot! ( I am not going that far!!!) My mrs in the public sector said very much the opposite and that the mood was down. This supports my opinion. There were literally thousanfs of people in the public sector who contributed nothing for years and years. Quite rightly they have been streamlined. At the peak of the recession they had the audacity to talk about strikes when they got offered a one percent pay rise. Meanwhile the bricklayer has seen his pay halfed in that time and that is even if he was in work.

This utter nonsense about stripping the public sector a la thatcher and having to spend more to rebuild it is quite simply that.

Harsh decisions have to be made to make people realise if you want to get on in this country you have to work hard. Cameron says it repeatedly and it seems fair to me.

Ps my kids came home last night and the ten year old had been told by her teacher that it was a sad day as cameron had got in and was going to close down the nhs!!!!

Looking forward to parents evening.

I like this post Mr. W W. As for the teacher he or she needs to be sacked. They should not preaching their political views to primary school children.

I like it too but ducado says it's not worthy of debate - well at least 50 percent of the country feel like me so he has better get used to it.

 

[scotty123]

*sigh*

I don't see 'English' or 'Scot' or any of that shite, just people.

You play your game I'll play mine.

The Scots say otherwise , good luck with your Utopia.

Cheers :) I can't look at things any other way, I'd go utterly potty if I did. Just cos we live in a dog eat dog world doesn't mean we have to subscribe to it. But, whatever makes you feel good.

You never learn you lefties/socialist eutopia World dreamers do you?

 

[EalingBlue2]

This talk of savage public sector cuts is dramatic at best. Of the 12 billion - 40 percent will come from tax evasion, significant amounts from housing benefit reform. How many under 25s do you know are able to buy a house? And yet the single mum from Rochdale can have 3 kids by 23 and get a 3 bedroom council house. That option in life has to be eradicated. It is unfair on working people for that type of thing to be happening. Working people have to make choices like living with parents until mid twenties, renting, house sharing, delaying having children and paying there way. We have to still somehow provide the safety net for genuine cases but the safety net is too full. Even if you do not like it - a lot of this is due to uncontrolled immigration and millions of people especially in London getting a ridiculous amount of"free money" I will happily debate this with Damocles, ducado, pb or anyone in a civil manner. I maintain my stance in my post the other day (where ducado called me idiotic) that the Labour Party now largely represent public sector workers, those on benefits, immigrants and people like my dad who is a dinosaur Union man. The plasterer, bricklayer, white collar man is best off voting Tory. In work yesterday the vast majority of professionals had voted Tory and we're of exactly the same opinion. In fact someone said these people on the extreme left who want doctors to earn the same as shelf stackers should be shot! ( I am not going that far!!!) My mrs in the public sector said very much the opposite and that the mood was down. This supports my opinion. There were literally thousanfs of people in the public sector who contributed nothing for years and years. Quite rightly they have been streamlined. At the peak of the recession they had the audacity to talk about strikes when they got offered a one percent pay rise. Meanwhile the bricklayer has seen his pay halfed in that time and that is even if he was in work.

This utter nonsense about stripping the public sector a la thatcher and having to spend more to rebuild it is quite simply that.

Harsh decisions have to be made to make people realise if you want to get on in this country you have to work hard. Cameron says it repeatedly and it seems fair to me.

Ps my kids came home last night and the ten year old had been told by her teacher that it was a sad day as cameron had got in and was going to close down the nhs!!!!

Looking forward to parents evening.

I think the trouble is too many people don't respect the fact that the only reason they live in a civilised society is because of a backbone of public servants who do everything from looking after the sick, keeping the country healthy, saving us from fires or crime, fighting for our freedom, educating the kids etc. they are the backbone of society.

The Murdoch right has for 30 years tried to portray these people as slackers and blusters etc and created this sense of entitlement In elements of the population where they believe only work in pursuit of money is worthy and that they deserve more.

You always talk about hard work deserving reward yet constantly imply those working to teach our kids, protect our streets, working in casualty at night are less deserving and u assume less hard working.

I work as a CFO for a sub region in a multi national and I work hard but I don't work as hard as some nurses , doctors and police I know who do much more stressful and hard work for a lot less money!

I would also love to understand how you morally think punishing children is a good way to improve society as you constantly talk about taking benefits from people with kids. Many find the protection of vulnerable kids more important than punishing adults.

To clarify I don't disagree with you that a welfar culture is not good, I don't disagree that women having three kids on benefits before 20 is not good for them, the kids or society I just think that punishing them and their kids is not the answer, better support, better education and giving people role models is a much better way.

 

[worsleyweb]

This talk of savage public sector cuts is dramatic at best. Of the 12 billion - 40 percent will come from tax evasion, significant amounts from housing benefit reform. How many under 25s do you know are able to buy a house? And yet the single mum from Rochdale can have 3 kids by 23 and get a 3 bedroom council house. That option in life has to be eradicated. It is unfair on working people for that type of thing to be happening. Working people have to make choices like living with parents until mid twenties, renting, house sharing, delaying having children and paying there way. We have to still somehow provide the safety net for genuine cases but the safety net is too full. Even if you do not like it - a lot of this is due to uncontrolled immigration and millions of people especially in London getting a ridiculous amount of"free money" I will happily debate this with Damocles, ducado, pb or anyone in a civil manner. I maintain my stance in my post the other day (where ducado called me idiotic) that the Labour Party now largely represent public sector workers, those on benefits, immigrants and people like my dad who is a dinosaur Union man. The plasterer, bricklayer, white collar man is best off voting Tory. In work yesterday the vast majority of professionals had voted Tory and we're of exactly the same opinion. In fact someone said these people on the extreme left who want doctors to earn the same as shelf stackers should be shot! ( I am not going that far!!!) My mrs in the public sector said very much the opposite and that the mood was down. This supports my opinion. There were literally thousanfs of people in the public sector who contributed nothing for years and years. Quite rightly they have been streamlined. At the peak of the recession they had the audacity to talk about strikes when they got offered a one percent pay rise. Meanwhile the bricklayer has seen his pay halfed in that time and that is even if he was in work.

This utter nonsense about stripping the public sector a la thatcher and having to spend more to rebuild it is quite simply that.

Harsh decisions have to be made to make people realise if you want to get on in this country you have to work hard. Cameron says it repeatedly and it seems fair to me.

Ps my kids came home last night and the ten year old had been told by her teacher that it was a sad day as cameron had got in and was going to close down the nhs!!!!

Looking forward to parents evening.

I think the trouble is too many people don't respect the fact that the only reason they live in a civilised society is because of a backbone of public servants who do everything from looking after the sick, keeping the country healthy, saving us from fires or crime, fighting for our freedom, educating the kids etc. they are the backbone of society.

The Murdoch right has for 30 years tried to portray these people as slackers and blusters etc and created this sense of entitlement In elements of the population where they believe only work in pursuit of money is worthy and that they deserve more.

You always talk about hard work deserving reward yet constantly imply those working to teach our kids, protect our streets, working in casualty at night are less deserving and u assume less hard working.

I work as a CFO for a sub region in a multi national and I work hard but I don't work as hard as some nurses , doctors and police I know who do much more stressful and hard work for a lot less money!

I would also love to understand how you morally think punishing children is a good way to improve society as you constantly talk about taking benefits from people with kids. Many find the protection of vulnerable kids more important than punishing adults

i constantly talk about taking benefits from people with kids do ?I! Here's one huge saving idea - make final salary pensions in the public sector not include the calculation of overtime hours in the last two years of service. Would save billions and billions! Biggest fiddle of all time.

Anyway without wishing to sound like ducado - I am not debating with you as I will loose by death by waffle as per the ched evans thread and the kids have just told me I have to rescue a hedgehog stuck and drowningin our drain. May debate later when I have done my bit for the animal kingdom.

 

[CityStu]

I understand the Left's point that restricting child benefits will harm the child rather than the parent.

However, can you not concede that there is a huge problem when someone can be given a decent 'salary' and is put up in a house out of the price range of their working peers just because they've had a few kids? It's totally unfair on the working frugal who wait until they can financially support a family before they start one.

The issue then is how you solve it. Surely there is a middle ground option between giving these people nothing, causing children to suffer, and giving them what they receive now.

 

[Lucky13]

I understand the Left's point that restricting child benefits will harm the child rather than the parent.

However, can you not concede that there is a huge problem when someone can be given a decent 'salary' and is put up in a house out of the price range of their working peers just because they've had a few kids? It's totally unfair on the working frugal who wait until they can financially support a family before they start one.

The issue then is how you solve it. Surely there is a middle ground option between giving these people nothing, causing children to suffer, and giving them what they receive now.

 

[jimharri]

This talk of savage public sector cuts is dramatic at best. Of the 12 billion - 40 percent will come from tax evasion, significant amounts from housing benefit reform. How many under 25s do you know are able to buy a house? And yet the single mum from Rochdale can have 3 kids by 23 and get a 3 bedroom council house. That option in life has to be eradicated. It is unfair on working people for that type of thing to be happening. Working people have to make choices like living with parents until mid twenties, renting, house sharing, delaying having children and paying there way. We have to still somehow provide the safety net for genuine cases but the safety net is too full. Even if you do not like it - a lot of this is due to uncontrolled immigration and millions of people especially in London getting a ridiculous amount of"free money" I will happily debate this with Damocles, ducado, pb or anyone in a civil manner. I maintain my stance in my post the other day (where ducado called me idiotic) that the Labour Party now largely represent public sector workers, those on benefits, immigrants and people like my dad who is a dinosaur Union man. The plasterer, bricklayer, white collar man is best off voting Tory. In work yesterday the vast majority of professionals had voted Tory and we're of exactly the same opinion. In fact someone said these people on the extreme left who want doctors to earn the same as shelf stackers should be shot! ( I am not going that far!!!) My mrs in the public sector said very much the opposite and that the mood was down. This supports my opinion. There were literally thousanfs of people in the public sector who contributed nothing for years and years. Quite rightly they have been streamlined. At the peak of the recession they had the audacity to talk about strikes when they got offered a one percent pay rise. Meanwhile the bricklayer has seen his pay halfed in that time and that is even if he was in work.

This utter nonsense about stripping the public sector a la thatcher and having to spend more to rebuild it is quite simply that.

Harsh decisions have to be made to make people realise if you want to get on in this country you have to work hard. Cameron says it repeatedly and it seems fair to me.

Ps my kids came home last night and the ten year old had been told by her teacher that it was a sad day as cameron had got in and was going to close down the nhs!!!!

Looking forward to parents evening.

That needs to be reported to the headmaster/mistress. Seriously. That teacher has no right to be airing his/her political views.

 

[Blue Maverick]

This talk of savage public sector cuts is dramatic at best. Of the 12 billion - 40 percent will come from tax evasion, significant amounts from housing benefit reform. How many under 25s do you know are able to buy a house? And yet the single mum from Rochdale can have 3 kids by 23 and get a 3 bedroom council house. That option in life has to be eradicated. It is unfair on working people for that type of thing to be happening. Working people have to make choices like living with parents until mid twenties, renting, house sharing, delaying having children and paying there way. We have to still somehow provide the safety net for genuine cases but the safety net is too full. Even if you do not like it - a lot of this is due to uncontrolled immigration and millions of people especially in London getting a ridiculous amount of"free money" I will happily debate this with Damocles, ducado, pb or anyone in a civil manner. I maintain my stance in my post the other day (where ducado called me idiotic) that the Labour Party now largely represent public sector workers, those on benefits, immigrants and people like my dad who is a dinosaur Union man. The plasterer, bricklayer, white collar man is best off voting Tory. In work yesterday the vast majority of professionals had voted Tory and we're of exactly the same opinion. In fact someone said these people on the extreme left who want doctors to earn the same as shelf stackers should be shot! ( I am not going that far!!!) My mrs in the public sector said very much the opposite and that the mood was down. This supports my opinion. There were literally thousanfs of people in the public sector who contributed nothing for years and years. Quite rightly they have been streamlined. At the peak of the recession they had the audacity to talk about strikes when they got offered a one percent pay rise. Meanwhile the bricklayer has seen his pay halfed in that time and that is even if he was in work.

This utter nonsense about stripping the public sector a la thatcher and having to spend more to rebuild it is quite simply that.

Harsh decisions have to be made to make people realise if you want to get on in this country you have to work hard. Cameron says it repeatedly and it seems fair to me.

Ps my kids came home last night and the ten year old had been told by her teacher that it was a sad day as cameron had got in and was going to close down the nhs!!!!

Looking forward to parents evening.

I think the trouble is too many people don't respect the fact that the only reason they live in a civilised society is because of a backbone of public servants who do everything from looking after the sick, keeping the country healthy, saving us from fires or crime, fighting for our freedom, educating the kids etc. they are the backbone of society.

The Murdoch right has for 30 years tried to portray these people as slackers and blusters etc and created this sense of entitlement In elements of the population where they believe only work in pursuit of money is worthy and that they deserve more.

You always talk about hard work deserving reward yet constantly imply those working to teach our kids, protect our streets, working in casualty at night are less deserving and u assume less hard working.

I work as a CFO for a sub region in a multi national and I work hard but I don't work as hard as some nurses , doctors and police I know who do much more stressful and hard work for a lot less money!

I would also love to understand how you morally think punishing children is a good way to improve society as you constantly talk about taking benefits from people with kids. Many find the protection of vulnerable kids more important than punishing adults

i constantly talk about taking benefits from people with kids do ?I! Here's one huge saving idea - make final salary pensions in the public sector not include the calculation of overtime hours in the last two years of service. Would save billions and billions! Biggest fiddle of all time.

Anyway without wishing to sound like ducado - I am not debating with you as I will loose by death by waffle as per the ched evans thread and the kids have just told me I have to rescue a hedgehog stuck and drowningin our drain. May debate later when I have done my bit for the animal kingdom.

Can you tell me what jobs in public sector get their overtime include in their calculations because it certainly doesn't happen in the fire service, and I for one am glad that final salary pensions have gone in the service what a con that was, but you cant blame people for taking advantage of a flawed system. Many of the waste/wasters to me are in the higher echelons of the public service there are some outrageous salaries for middle management and higher, I mean how can some chief execs get paid more than the PM? Yet it's constantly the people on the ground that get the brunt, look at a soldier in Afghanistan get a redundancy notice while he's on the frontline, that's not the sort of government I want, life maybe not fair but have some fucking dignity and compassion about how you go about your business.