US Politics Thread

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Clearly - but you're steeped in MAGA Fox News Kool aide-think, so your opinion, is influenced by tribal, emotional, reasoning - and not based on a sober look at facts.

You like Trump - by your own admission.

A narcissist. A liar. A womanizer. A felon convicted of sexual assault. A con-man. A grifter. A demagogue.

Were a Democrat running for President with these same traits you'd be enraged and rightly so. But you give Trump a pass for this.

The worst aspect of Trump and his movement for me is not his policies per-se. It's his denial of fact. Whether crowd size at his events, or climate change, or vaccines, just to name a few. This is unacceptable from any politician, for me - and so it should be for you, but it's not - which means you're not thinking clearly. Trump is going to lead America into very dangerous actions during the next 4 years.

Lest you think that I'm some sort of left-wing nut hating on Trump just because he's a Republican - let me disabuse you of that misperception. I'd gladly have considered voting for Romney should he have run and would have weighed up each candidate's policy choices carefully before making a decision on whom to vote for.

Into the mix, there's the fact that Trump is a power-loving egomaniac with a stranglehold on US Republican politics. There's every chance that he'll rig voting to remain in power, two-term constitutional limit be damned. He'll find a way, by force if necessary - and time will tell if American institutions can stop him. And yeah I get that he's nearly 80 - but look at his parents and how long they both lived - there's a good chance that Trump is alive and kicking at 95 years old.
Good to see you're not blinded by hatred and incapable of rational thoughts....
Not sure where you get me liking trump or having any interest in maga/fox from? I still find it incredible that you managed as a nation of almost 370m people to whittle it down to Harris and trump as your best options.
 
Good to see you're not blinded by hatred and incapable of rational thoughts....
Not sure where you get me liking trump or having any interest in maga/fox from? I still find it incredible that you managed as a nation of almost 370m people to whittle it down to Harris and trump as your best options.
Dude - don't be disingenuous. By your own admission you stated that you like Trump.

On the second point - I like Harris. I like Biden. And I detest Trump. But I like Romney too - I'm a centrist.

If you somehow don't like either Harris or Trump (revisionist - you like Trump, that's clear) - what candidate would you have voted for instead - if you were a US citizen and were able to pick the perfect candidate of your own choosing?
 
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Dude - don't be disingenuous. By your own admission you stated that you like Trump.

On the second point - I like Harris. I like Biden. And I detest Trump.

If you somehow don't like either -you like Trump, that's clear - what candidate would you have voted for instead - if you were a US citizen and were able to pick the perfect candidate of your own choice?
I'm not arsed with any of them and I don't 'like' trump. I may have said I love him (and Hitler in the same post). This is called irony and sarcasm - there is a lot of it about on this side of the pond.
I think the discomfort you feel is that I don't agree with you. This is fine and all part of the human condition. This doesn't automatically mean I like trump, I'm a maga loon or I'm a rapist/ murderer etc. it just means that I think different things to you about some things.
 
I'm not arsed with any of them and I don't 'like' trump. I may have said I love him (and Hitler in the same post). This is called irony and sarcasm - there is a lot of it about on this side of the pond.
I think the discomfort you feel is that I don't agree with you. This is fine and all part of the human condition. This doesn't automatically mean I like trump, I'm a maga loon or I'm a rapist/ murderer etc. it just means that I think different things to you about some things.
I never said that you were a rapist or murderer.

I fail to see the "irony" in your posts in favor of Trump.

But let's for the moment give you a pass on your pro-Trump positions.

You still haven't disclosed the candidate whom you would have voted for were you a US citizen and were you magically able to make your candidate the Republican/Democratic nominee.

Disclosure - were I able to magically pick a candidate, I think I might have gone for Gavin Newsome.

From where I sit - you're a pretend-neutral. Let's weigh up the Trump side versus the other side. Which fucking amounts to - let's weight up fact free nonsense versus fact-based reasoning. You do this time and time again. It's fucking whataboutism carried to the next level.

Look - I'm more than willing to debate positions based on factual arguments. But I've no tolerance whatsoever for lies. And you, MSC, are all too willing to prop up Trump's bullshit lies as a counter to truth. And you've been emboldened to do so more and more often following Trump's election.

I've heard jack shit from you about Trump's character. Or his lies about climate change. Or his lies about vaccines. Or his lies about NATO. Or his alarming withdrawal from the WHO and from the climate accords. Not a fucking whit. And each of these positions have jack shit to do with Right vs Left. Instead it has to do with Lies vs Truth. And you're squarely in the camp of Lies.
 
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I never said that you were a rapist or murderer.

I fail to see the "irony" in your posts in favor of Trump.

But let's for the moment give you a pass on your pro-Trump positions.

You still haven't disclosed the candidate whom you would have voted for were you a US citizen and were you magically able to make your candidate the Republican/Democratic nominee.

From where I sit - you're a pretend-neutral. Let's weigh up the Trump side versus the other side. Which fucking amounts to - let's weight up fact free nonsense versus fact-based reasoning. You do this time and time again.

Look - I'm more than willing to debate positions based on factual arguments. But I've no tolerance whatsoever for lies. And you, MSC, are all too willing to prop up Trump's bullshit lies as a counter to truth. And you've been emboldened to do so more and more often following Trump's election.

I've heard jack shit from you about Trump's character. Or his lies about climate change. Or his lies about vaccines. Or his lies about NATO. Or his alarming withdrawal from the WHO and from the climate accords. Not a fucking whit. And each of these positions have jack shit to do with Right vs Left. Instead it has to do with Lies vs Truth. And you're squarely in the camp of Lies.
I don't care about trumps character and his position on climate change is so clear I don't think it merits any actual discussion. To be honest I just don't regard trump as a source of useful information. I realise it's easier to make complex problems a binary issue, but I don't think you can just carve humanity up into for and against trump. That argument doesn't even matter anymore. Trump has happened to you, it's history already.
 
Tbf MSG hasn't said he likes Trump and I've seen him still criticise him as well as the Democrat’s. I think it just doesn't go down well on here if you attack the Dems. I can't stand either party currently but would still prefer the Democrat’s policies to Trumps.
 
I don't care about trumps character and his position on climate change is so clear I don't think it merits any actual discussion. To be honest I just don't regard trump as a source of useful information. I realise it's easier to make complex problems a binary issue, but I don't think you can just carve humanity up into for and against trump. That argument doesn't even matter anymore. Trump has happened to you, it's history already.
A fucking unresponsive post. I asked a simple question - which candidate for US President would you magically place in office ahead of Trump were you able to do so?

Instead, you state that character in a leader doesn't matter to you (character is hugely important - as it reveals how a person feels and will act; we want empathetic leaders who place the nation and others above self!).

Lies about climate change - perhaps the most important issue of our time - doesn't matter to you.

And that yes, "there's good folks on both sides." Trump isn't so bad after all. Fuck that. Trump is the worst President we've ever, ever had and we'll be lucky if America is still a Democracy after he dies. But no matter - criticism of Trump is OK, but hey, let's debate that - whatabout XYZ. Jesus Christ on a stick.
 
A fucking unresponsive post. I asked a simple question - which candidate for US President would you magically place in office ahead of Trump were you able to do so?

Instead, you state that character in a leader doesn't matter to you. And that lies about climate change don't matter to you. And that yes, folks, there's good folks on both sides. Trump isn't so bad after all. Fuck that. Trump is the worst President we've ever, ever had and we'll be lucky if America is still a Democracy after he dies. But no matter - criticism of Trump is OK, but hey, let's debate that - whatabout XYZ. Jesus Christ on a stick.
I think you are fighting a battle in your head and on the internet that ended last November. You had two comedy candidates and the nation made it's comedy choice.
 
I think you are fighting a battle in your head and on the internet that ended last November. You had two comedy candidates and the nation made it's comedy choice.
You clearly have no concept of the importance of character, truth, and fact-based governance. And you're not alone - more than half of American voters are with you.

If I could place a magic curse to place on you - I would curse you to live under Trump-like regimes for the next 150 years or so. And be totally fucked by climate change, possibly seeing millions killed by emergent pathogens, and likely under attack from Russia or China after they carve up the rest of the world with no opposition from America.

For whatever reason this isn't getting through to you (it's tribal, though - your sources of "news" support this). You are entitled to your own position - you are not entitled to your own facts. I'm happy to debate fact-based reasoning. You, however, are in the fact-free camp, for which no amount of debate can ever, ever prevail.

Since you refuse to advance your choice for US President, let's pin you down on these positions:
* What's your position on climate change?
* What's your position on vaccination?
* How do you feel about emigrants and their role in an economy?
* Do you think that Russia under Putin is a territorially aggressive state that will forever pursue expansion of its borders?
* What do you think about China?

I'm more than happy to answer all of the above and more. You on the other hand, can't even fucking name your prefered US President.

And as a simple test of the importance of character - let's say you were running a restaurant. Would you hire a felon convicted of secual assault, a known liar and a grifter to manage your restaurant? Of course not - that would be insane! And yet you're more than happy to let such to run the most powerful nation on earth. It makes no fucking sense.
 
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You clearly have no concept of the importance of character, truth, and fact-based governance. And you're not alone - more than half of American voters are with you.

If I had a magic curse to place on you - I would curse you to live under Trump-like regimes for the next 150 years or so. And be totally fucked by climate change, possibly killed or your relatives killed by emergent pathogens, and likely under attack from Russia or China after they carve up the rest of the world with no opposition from America.

For whatever reason this isn't getting through to you (it's tribal, though - your sources of "news" support this). You are entitled to your own position - you are not entitled to your own facts. I'm happy to debate fact-based reasoning. You, however, are in the fact-free camp, for which no amount of debate can ever, ever prevail.
No, I just don't agree with you. I think different things about some stuff.
 
No, I just don't agree with you. I think different things about some stuff.
And still - no President whom you would have preferred. No position on all of the topics I outlined.

You sir, are simply a propaganda machine in service of Trump, until such time as you make clear where you stand on the numerous simple questions I've stated - WTF? You can't even state your position on issues which you debate. This is worse even than lying about facts - you're not taking a stand and then, not having stated your position, arguing against others willy-nilly on the basis of taking a "neutral" stance after considering "both sides."

Well fuck the both-sides-ism. The world is round - but there are those who believe it's flat. Perhaps we should reconsider whether or not the world is round.

The earth is approximately 4 billion years old. But there are those who think it's only a thousand years or so old. And that dinosaurs walked with men. Perhaps we should debate this - giving both sides a fair shake.

Evolution and the emergence of traits among creatures is universally accepted among scientists and has been proven with experiments. But intelligent design argues that a divine creator actually directs evolution. Perhaps we should debate this - or better yet, mandate the teaching of intelligent design in our classrooms to let students decide.

Yes - it's only fair. We need to be open to "both sides." Which fucking misses the essence of science. Science doesn't care about sides at all. Instead, it proceeds on the basis of hypotheses, experiments, and repeatable results. Ideas that don't comport with experiment are discarded - they can't be true. Ideas that comport with facts are, for the moment, accepted as likely true - subject of course to revision should further advances in experimental evidence prove otherwise.
 
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Bro, relax, no one is going to carve up the rest of the world. Just calm down.
With respect, I think you're off the mark.

China wants Taiwan. And will at some point invade. China's economy is on a house of cards so perhaps their government implodes before this. What happens next is anyone's guess.

Russia is expansionist. Clearly. And Ukraine isn't going to be the end of their ambitions. Even if Putin dies, their next leader is likely to be of the same ilk, or worse.

If you think otherwise - well, beats me why you think so. Because history is the best predictor of what's going to happen next.
 
he will be 84 if he runs for re-election in 2026


I detest McConnell's politics, placing the Republican party above all else.

At the same time, I feel sorry for him due to his illness. He's clearly suffering from dementia. Unfortunately, there's no cure for the disease. And it progresses rapidly at times, slowly at others. He may be dead of the disease in 2026; or may be only slightly worse than he is now.

At any rate, I very much doubt that Mitch will be mentally able to run in 2026.
 
And still - no President whom you would have preferred. No position on all of the topics I outlined.

You sir, are simply a propaganda machine in service of Trump, until such time as you make clear where you stand on the numerous simple questions I've stated - WTF? You can't even state your position on issues which you debate. This is worse even than lying about facts - you're not taking a stand and then, not having stated your position, arguing against others willy-nilly on the basis of taking a "neutral" stance after considering "both sides."

Well fuck the both-sides-ism. The world is round - but there are those who believe it's flat. Perhaps we should reconsider whether or not the world is round.

The earth is approximately 4 billion years old. But there are those who think it's only a thousand years or so old. And that dinosaurs walked with men. Perhaps we should debate this - giving both sides a fair shake.

Evolution and the emergence of traits among creatures is universally accepted among scientists and has been proven with experiments. But intelligent design argues that a divine creator actually directs evolution. Perhaps we should debate this - or better yet, mandate the teaching of intelligent design in our classrooms to let students decide.

Yes - it's only fair. We need to be open to "both sides." Which fucking misses the essence of science. Science doesn't care about sides at all. Instead, it proceeds on the basis of hypotheses, experiments, and repeatable results. Ideas that don't comport with experiment are discarded - they can't be true. Ideas that comport with facts are, for the moment, accepted as likely true - subject of course to revision should further advances in experimental evidence prove otherwise.
Precisely BMATP.
This is why I believe that in countless trials Trump has proven conclusively beyond doubt that he is indeed a gobshite. An amoral gobshite at that.
Now personally I think that is a bad fit for leader of a nation and most definitely the free world, but there are those that feel further trials are required on that issue.
Ultimately if he gets the further time he desires, say maybe a third term or more, I personally would think that in itself would be incontrovertible evidence that he indeed is a coniving amoral gobshite. But you would still have those that would deny the empirical evidence put before them.

Personally if I had a vote it would be like being an ABU, when it comes to football.
I’d fall into the ABT camp as a default until an opponent that’s proven themselves worse presented themselves.
 
he will be 84 if he runs for re-election in 2026


Poor **** should be in care not in power. My dad has altzheimers and is still ok, but we have to even check he turns the cooker ring off after use. Mitch gets to make major political decisions. Ridiculous
 
With respect, I think you're off the mark.

China wants Taiwan. And will at some point invade. China's economy is on a house of cards so perhaps their government implodes before this. What happens next is anyone's guess.

Russia is expansionist. Clearly. And Ukraine isn't going to be the end of their ambitions. Even if Putin dies, their next leader is likely to be of the same ilk, or worse.

If you think otherwise - well, beats me why you think so. Because history is the best predictor of what's going to happen next.
It's all about the "world view". Maybe you should try to read or see some positive aspects of China? You are , I don't know how to say, worrying too much?

China did not undergo the Age of Exploration or engage in global colonial expansion. The Chinese mindset is fundamentally akin to that of farmers; we simply labor in our own land for our own survival, even in today's industrialized era. Does this make sense to you?
 
It's all about the "world view". Maybe you should try to read or see some positive aspects of China? You are , I don't know how to say, worrying too much?

China did not undergo the Age of Exploration or engage in global colonial expansion. The Chinese mindset is fundamentally akin to that of farmers; we simply labor in our own land for our own survival, even in today's industrialized era. Does this make sense to you?

Does Tibet not count?
 
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