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West Ham post game....
- Thread starter Rammy Blue
- Start date
an utter headfuck of a season in that we're still in everything and yet you can't see us winning anything!! players are plainly off the boil and yet are within reaching distance of a wembley final, a CL quarter final and a few pts from the league summit, what's it all about?
even if the management are screwing things up, which is obviously keenly debated on here, shouldnt there be enough incentive for the players to self motivate?
even if the management are screwing things up, which is obviously keenly debated on here, shouldnt there be enough incentive for the players to self motivate?
marcoboogers
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No he won't. Kidd was here under Mancini and too charge for the handful of games we were without Mancini after the Wigan Cup Final.
Yes he would, straight from the horses mouth. He said he would retire
PrestwichPeteMcfc
Well-Known Member
Yaya rightly criticised for the first goal, but Delph was just as responsible and no one seems to care. As usual, it's bash Yaya and Pellergrini for playing him, despite it being obvious that we're a far better side with Yaya, especially when he plays DM in away games
Which players looked disinterested?You have called the changes spot on.
Big call to turf him right now though mate but yesterday saw several players looking disinterested for large parts and lacking any belief in what they where being asked to do.
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blueinsa
Guest
Which players looked disinterested?
Honestly, Silva, Yaya, KdB and Sterling when he came on. All 4 had absolute shockers for me yesterday.
Its not just form mate and the miss placed pass or wrong ball played, its their collective attitudes to our games right now, especially their defensive responsibilities to the team as a whole.
Not good enough from any of them and they need to sort their shit out.
Goater=Legend
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Otamendi is at fault as well for not staying in positionYaya rightly criticised for the first goal, but Delph was just as responsible and no one seems to care. As usual, it's bash Yaya and Pellergrini for playing him, despite it being obvious that we're a far better side with Yaya, especially when he plays DM in away games
jimbobblue
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Although I agree with you that Yaya isn't the only one to blame it is his initial mistake/lack of attempt to defend that causes the further mistakes. I also think otamendi should know better than to step up put he back line at that moment leaving his space clear for the attacker to run into to. But Delph is busting a gut to make the front post to prevent any cross/easy shot when the ball hits him. If he stays marking his man the attacker runs at how hart with no defender to block him and shoots... He's covers front post and leaves man in middle... Lose lose situation for him.Yaya rightly criticised for the first goal, but Delph was just as responsible and no one seems to care. As usual, it's bash Yaya and Pellergrini for playing him, despite it being obvious that we're a far better side with Yaya, especially when he plays DM in away games
Yaya got beat by a gut he actually tried to defend. Otamendi wrongly anticipated a pass and moved up to intercept, Kouyate beat Yaya and Otamendi was Late helping. Delph was caught ball watching and lost his man Valencia who scored. But since Yaya was involved in the play, the normal folks wee out for blood.Yaya rightly criticised for the first goal, but Delph was just as responsible and no one seems to care. As usual, it's bash Yaya and Pellergrini for playing him, despite it being obvious that we're a far better side with Yaya, especially when he plays DM in away games
It was comical to read theccimments from then on.
BluessinceHydeRoad
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I didn't think the Fernando sub was that bad in itself. We had no one in front of the back four and risked losing the game as much as winning it. But it's the thinking that left us short in the first place that annoyed me. He put Iheanacho on for Delph, who was providing some cover, yet left Silva and De Bruyne on, both of who had been completely ineffectual. That left Yaya as the only midfielder who might have provided some defensive cover but that's just not his game. Had he taken KDB off it wouldn't have altered the defensive shape at all. Yet after two changes he then realised that Song had the run of midfield and was a danger to the chance of us getting anything out of the game so had to counter it. But if he hadn't cocked up hi subs in the first place he wouldn't have needed to do that.
I actually believe he's costing us points and that we'd be better off getting rid and letting Kidd and the players run things for the rest of the season. They all look completely pissed off with him.
I think you hit several nails right on the head here, PB. I looked at the team and was immediately concerned by the central midfield combination of David and Ya Ya, which promised much when we had the ball but lacked any kind of solidity when we didn't. Delph is energetic but is not going to provide the kind of solidity we require on his own. Within a minute we had proof positive that Ya Ya does not have the tippy tappy feet to turn and stay with any but the slowest and clumsiest of forwards. Our central defenders then impersonated bees swarming to an imaginary honey pot leaving Antonio (?) a generous five metre radius circle to hammer home. We responded well, or at least Kun did, but it was still nevertheless clear that Pellers was playing Ya Ya in a screening/deep role, to which he is completely unsuited, so that he could find room for David, Kevin and Jesus (so Raheem could be rested for Wednesday?) and that, not only is David almost non-existent defensively, his distribution is also lamentable at the moment and he has little impact in attack. KdB was also of marginal importance (does the formation suit him away from home?) and the middle third of the field was a City free zone for much of the time. It is really frustrating that the problems we are having are the old ones from the start of the 2013-14 season which have never gone away; in 2013-14 Vinnie, Ya Ya Kun, and David managed to mask them but three of them are now showing the effects of age and long seasons, yet Pellers still chimes out that he's committed to attacking football! For the second goal...fast asleep.
West Ham are a good side, but they're not Barca or Bayern. That central midfield of ours does not compare with either of the latter when we don't have the ball. We got a point yeaterday, Kun could easily have won the game for us but we nearly lost because Pellers doesn't devote enough attention to how we play without the ball. We may still win the title (I think we will) but we are in a scrap we should be clear of and we don't compare with the "big three" of European football.
warringtonblue
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Otamendi gave the ball away 3 times in the build up to that goal, 2 stupid long balls to our giant striker and a misplaced headerOtamendi is at fault as well for not staying in position
PrestwichPeteMcfc
Well-Known Member
Both Aguero and Silva now have shook their heads in disbelieve on the substitutions Pellegrini has made.
Today was poor, the complete wrong set up.
Never seen a manager so tactically inept!
We need to start winning these games, but Pellers is due at least some credit for his subs. When losing with 15 minutes to go he changed to 4-1-4-1 and we scored. Once we had something to hold on to we brought on an extra midfielder for Silva who was poor. I don't think he did too much wrong in terms of subs. IMO his biggest mistake was not stating Fernando (an unpopular player but holds his defensive position better than both Yata and Delph). The defensive was also unorganised of course, and that starts on the training pitch.
Millwallawayveteran1988
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Otamendi gave the ball away 3 times in the build up to that goal, 2 stupid long balls to our giant striker and a misplaced header
Otamendi had a nightmare yesterday. Even worse than anything Mangala has shown and that takes some doing. Our defensive set up is a joke.
Yaya yesterday looked anything but disinterested. He busted a gut chasing down faster players. Silva was trying hard too. He moved around looked for space tried to make things happen but nothing came.Honestly, Silva, Yaya, KdB and Sterling when he came on. All 4 had absolute shockers for me yesterday.
Its not just form mate and the miss placed pass or wrong ball played, its their collective attitudes to our games right now, especially their defensive responsibilities to the team as a whole.
Not good enough from any of them and they need to sort their shit out.
This is not disinterest in my eye, just bad form. Same with DeBryune. Chased everything down, and was running all day. Maybe Sterling showed a little disinterest as he was not happy to not be a starter, but bar him, everyone else was fighting. Just wasn't working as well.
interesting debate on the first goal; Ya Ya, Ota and Delph all blamed.
I'd say Ya Ya was primarily at fault for being totally square on and not ushering the man towards the byline and slowing the attack. His mistake put Otamendi and Delph under pressure immediately. If you watch Valencia, Ota is stood with him until the man skins Ya Ya (Delph had passed him on if you watch the shape). Delph has seen this and is already on his way to intercept the cross (which he manages to do, sort of). VALencia moves away from Ota and, crucially, this is where it breaks down. Ota should have followed his man into the centre as Delph was coming across. Or do we not know all the facts? did someone tell Ota to go? and delph to stay? dunno. but on face value, ya ya put those two in a predicament which i think Ota failed to manage.
I'd say Ya Ya was primarily at fault for being totally square on and not ushering the man towards the byline and slowing the attack. His mistake put Otamendi and Delph under pressure immediately. If you watch Valencia, Ota is stood with him until the man skins Ya Ya (Delph had passed him on if you watch the shape). Delph has seen this and is already on his way to intercept the cross (which he manages to do, sort of). VALencia moves away from Ota and, crucially, this is where it breaks down. Ota should have followed his man into the centre as Delph was coming across. Or do we not know all the facts? did someone tell Ota to go? and delph to stay? dunno. but on face value, ya ya put those two in a predicament which i think Ota failed to manage.
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blueinsa
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Yaya yesterday looked anything but disinterested. He busted a gut chasing down faster players.
I completely disagree mate. He may have been disciplined positionally yesterday but that doesn't mean not moving out of the centre circle for the first 45 mins and barely tracking a runner. Watch him at set pieces and the amount of times he is stood still whilst runners come off him.
I dont buy the legs have gone bit im afraid, his head has gone, checked out already and looks like he cant be arsed half the time.
An all time great for us who is doing all he can to sully a hard earnt reputation.
Nothing to do with our defense set up. Just Otamendi making 2 costly error.Otamendi had a nightmare yesterday. Even worse than anything Mangala has shown and that takes some doing. Our defensive set up is a joke.
As I keep pointing out to anyone who'd listen, we give up the fewest chances a game in the league. That is not a typo. No team in the league concedes fewer shots than City. Not West Ham, not United, not Arsenal, not the gengenpressing Liverpool, or Tothenham or Leicester. No one.
Yep, the clueless Pelegrini defense concedes the fewest # of shots a game.
I was talking about yesterday. He played hard.I completely disagree mate. He may have been disciplined positionally yesterday but that doesn't mean not moving out of the centre circle for the first 45 mins and barely tracking a runner. Watch him at set pieces and the amount of times he is stood still whilst runners come off him.
I dont buy the legs have gone bit im afraid, his head has gone, checked out already and looks like he cant be arsed half the time.
An all time great for us who is doing all he can to sully a hard earnt reputation.
That's about accurate. Even though I'd c say Kouyate beat Yaya by faking an intent to pass to the middle then bolting Left as opposed to Yaya didn't defend.interesting debate on the first goal; Ya Ya, Ota and Delph all blamed.
I'd say Ya Ya was primarily at fault for being totally square on and not ushering the man towards the byline and slowing the attack. His mistake put Otamendi and Delph under pressure immediately. If you watch Valencia, Ota is stood with him until the man skins Ya Ya (Delph had passed him on if you watch the shape). Delph has seen this and is already on his way to intercept the cross (which he manages to do, sort of). VALencia moves away from Ota and, crucially, this is where it breaks down. Ota should have followed his man into the centre as Delph was coming across. Or do we not know all the facts? did someone tell Ota to go? and delph to stay? dunno. but on face value, ya ya put those two in a predicament which i think Ota failed to manage.
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blueinsa
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I was talking about yesterday. He played hard.
With respect mate i disagree.
Yaya, Silva and KdB offer the side nothing defensively, especially away from home.
Ive defended the players and Pellegrini all season and ever since he walked through the door but its all wrong right now and he shows no sign of knowing how to fix it and the players looked fucked off over it as well.