what needs to happen for us to advance?

[cmdub]

I cba to search and im sure its been mentioned but what needs to happen for us to advance out of the group besides us winning our next 2 games however unlikely that may seem?

and what about for 3rd place / europa league?

 

[Santiago Street]

We beat Madrid

Ajax beat Dortmund

We beat Dortmund

Real beat Ajax

We go through

Europa League I neither know nor care !!

 

[lancs blue]

Ajax beat Dortmund tomorrow and then Real beat Ajax in the last match is the most likely scenario to get us through - on head to head against Dortmund.

Less likely is Dortmund win or draw tomorrow and then Ajax draw with Real in the Bernabeu when we would hopefully pip Real on head to head courtesy of our 2 away goals at their place.

It's also possible for all 4 teams to finish on 8 points if Ajax draw in the Bernabeu and beat Dortmund tomorrow but that probably wouldn't help us much unless we win both games comfortably as our goal difference is a bit inferior.

I can't be arsed working out how we get into the Europa!

 

[BlueMooney]

It's also possible for all 4 teams to finish on 8 points if Ajax draw in the Bernabeu and beat Dortmund tomorrow but that probably wouldn't help us much unless we win both games comfortably as our goal difference is a bit inferior.

I can't get my head around this bit.

The deciding factor should be head-to-head results, but I don't know if they can use that when all teams have finished on equal points (should that happen, Dortmund would have to be above Madrid and City above Dortmund, but what if Madrid needed to be above City if we beat them 4-3 as they did better at City than City did at Madrid? It's impossible for that to happen...). So if we all finish on 8 points, is it goal difference rather than head to head?

In which case, that would make it still possible, however unlikely, for City to win the group?

 

[lancs blue]

It's also possible for all 4 teams to finish on 8 points if Ajax draw in the Bernabeu and beat Dortmund tomorrow but that probably wouldn't help us much unless we win both games comfortably as our goal difference is a bit inferior.

I can't get my head around this bit.

The deciding factor should be head-to-head results, but I don't know if they can use that when all teams have finished on equal points (should that happen, Dortmund would have to be above Madrid and City above Dortmund, but what if Madrid needed to be above City if we beat them 4-3 as they did better at City than City did at Madrid? It's impossible for that to happen...). So if we all finish on 8 points, is it goal difference rather than head to head?

In which case, that would make it still possible, however unlikely, for City to win the group?

If all teams are on equal points that IS the head to head table so as I read it goal difference then comes into play first. If two of the teams are then equal on GD and goals scored then it probably goes to head to head results between the 2 teams in question. I could be wrong though!

 

[BlueMooney]

It's also possible for all 4 teams to finish on 8 points if Ajax draw in the Bernabeu and beat Dortmund tomorrow but that probably wouldn't help us much unless we win both games comfortably as our goal difference is a bit inferior.

I can't get my head around this bit.

The deciding factor should be head-to-head results, but I don't know if they can use that when all teams have finished on equal points (should that happen, Dortmund would have to be above Madrid and City above Dortmund, but what if Madrid needed to be above City if we beat them 4-3 as they did better at City than City did at Madrid? It's impossible for that to happen...). So if we all finish on 8 points, is it goal difference rather than head to head?

In which case, that would make it still possible, however unlikely, for City to win the group?

If all teams are on equal points that IS the head to head table so as I read it goal difference then comes into play first. If two of the teams are then equal on GD and goals scored then it probably goes to head to head results between the 2 teams in question. I could be wrong though!

This is what it says in this season's Champions League regulations:

7.06
If two or more teams are equal on points on completion of the group matches, the following criteria are applied to determine the rankings (in descending order):
a) higher number of points obtained in the group matches played among the teams in question;
b) superior goal difference from the group matches played among the teams in question;
c) higher number of goals scored in the group matches played among the teams in question;
d) higher number of goals scored away from home in the group matches played among the teams in question;
e) if, after having applied criteria a) to d), two teams still have an equal ranking, criteria a) to d) are reapplied exclusively to the matches between the two teams in question to determine their final rankings. If this procedure does not lead to a decision, criteria f) to h) apply;
f) superior goal difference from all group matches played;
g) higher number of goals scored from all group matches played;
h) higher number of coefficient points accumulated by the club in question, as well as its association, over the previous five seasons (see paragraph 9.02)

===

So it would be goal difference under point b.

Which means we can win the group with two big wins and a bit of luck in the other games. ;o)

 

[Chippy_boy]

So realistically, we need Ajax to beat Dortmund. Because I can see no way on the planet that Real are not getting a draw from Ajax, at home, in a game where if they lose they fail to qualify. That is just not happening is it.

 

[alib]

a decent/fair draw next season will see us advance from the group stages

wont happen this year sadly

 

[LHarper]

Ideally we win tonight and in Dortmund.

Ajax beat Dortmund tonight and lose in Madrid.

We go through in second place.

If all teams finish on 8 points then if us and Ajax win our respective games tonight by more than 1 goal the group would look like this at the end:

Ajax
CITY
Dortmund
Madrid

If everyone finishes on 8 points but if ourselves and Ajax only won by 1 goal tonight then it depends on number of goals scored within each game.

 

[mcfcphil]

Option 1: city beat Madrid, ajax beat Dortmund, city beat Dortmund
Option 2: city beat Madrid 1-0, 2-1, or by two clear goals, city beat Dortmund, ajax get at least a draw in Madrid

Option 1 is obviously the much more likely scenario. Fingers crossed for an ajax win tonight