Liverpool Thread - 2023/24
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An absolute classic from the Guardian minute by minute:
66 min: Alexander-Arnold replaces Nunes. It’s staggering how much world class talent Klopp has assembled without the help of oil money.
George Tyrrell emails in:
“It’s just lazy journalism,” he says of my comment concerning Klopp’s lack of oil money.
“He’s had as much money available to him as most top world clubs. They haven’t been stuck for a pound , and it’s not like the entire Liverpool team are academy results. Change the record. The guardians [sic] love in with Klopp is embarrassing.”
Our esteemed journalist replies:
The amount of money is not the topic here, George. I’m talking about the the source of that money. And for me, that does change the narrative.
-----
How does the source of the money a manager spends affect the quality of the players he can buy?
I assume he got the job as a journalist because he forgot to send off his application for village idiot.
66 min: Alexander-Arnold replaces Nunes. It’s staggering how much world class talent Klopp has assembled without the help of oil money.
George Tyrrell emails in:
“It’s just lazy journalism,” he says of my comment concerning Klopp’s lack of oil money.
“He’s had as much money available to him as most top world clubs. They haven’t been stuck for a pound , and it’s not like the entire Liverpool team are academy results. Change the record. The guardians [sic] love in with Klopp is embarrassing.”
Our esteemed journalist replies:
The amount of money is not the topic here, George. I’m talking about the the source of that money. And for me, that does change the narrative.
-----
How does the source of the money a manager spends affect the quality of the players he can buy?
I assume he got the job as a journalist because he forgot to send off his application for village idiot.
Susan Boyle?
Tyrrell forgot to add the word 'la'
BringBackSwales
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Probably just put supports rags or dippers on his application form. The source of the money btw isn’t oil money, it’s self-generated from commercial income, ticket income, tv income and prize money. Not a fucking penny comes from oil, daft cunts. None of it comes from corrupt money laundering fucking banks either
JULES
Well-Known Member
apologies if this has been posted before, got this off rawk..decent too
Unbelievable this from The Spectator
The last bit is bonkers. Accusing him of being self-centred by announcing it early.
Not everyone will miss Jurgen Klopp
So, farewell then Jurgen Klopp. What memories you will leave us. You were exuberant, passionate and unorthodox. You ran up and down the touchline, gesticulating manically. You had a nice, albeit cosmetically enhanced, smile. You could be charming and witty.
You won. seven trophies in nine years for Liverpool, most significantly the Premier League title that ended an excruciating generation long wait and a sixth Champion’s League. Your place in the Pantheon is assured and things will be duller without you.
But is your leaving really a ‘disaster’? From the press reaction it would appear that your tenure at Anfield was an unbroken period of glory and joy the imminent cessation of which has precipitated something akin to mourning and existential angst. One wouldn’t be surprised at calls for a statue to be erected or a stand renamed.
Is this justified?
One league win in eight attempts is surely a tad disappointing for a club of Liverpool’s stature, and last year’s failure to even make it into the Champion’s League is similar to relegation for managers of teams outside the super elite. And as for trophies won, take out the not so super ‘Super Cup’, the glorified training exercise that is the Community Shield and the frankly rather silly World Club Championship and we’re down to four, one of which is the League Cup.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not quibbling with the idea of Klopp as a very good manager. Spurs and Arsenal, let alone Manchester United fans, would kill for four trophies in a decade. And given the enormous pressure and soaring expectations of the Liverpool faithful and the hyper competitive environment of the premiership, it’s a decent return. But the anguish and despair at your decision to move on, seems somewhat disproportionate.
Partly this is explicable by Liverpool’s footballing psychology. The red half of the city was experiencing something akin to a slow motion nervous breakdown as each title less year ticked by. Klopp’s 2019/2020 triumph was a supremely cathartic moment that must have felt like a release from prison and what had seemed like a life-sentence for the long-suffering fans.
Klopp now has mythic status and limitless reserves of gratitude. But winning the league in 2020 was no more of an achievement for having broken a long winless run. A more realistic response for a club that can field teams worth 500 million pounds or more would have been: ‘why did it take so long?’ or ‘about time’.
Klopp has probably also benefitted from the hard-wired irrationality in football that conflates charisma with success and allows charm and an indignant refusal to accept blame to distort the statistical record. (Call it the ‘Mourinho effect’.) If Klopp had been dull, humourless, uninspiring, and prone to shouldering responsibility for poor results rather than lashing out at referrees and VAR, he might even have been given the heave-ho after last season’s grave disappointments, never mind what had come before.
And if we are going to wish Klopp well, and recognise his contribution, we ought to at least acknowledge the less appealing side of his personality. Klopp’s off-the-field antics were frequently inappropriate and came close on occasion to bullying. There were numerous run-ins with referees such as after this season’s defeat to Spurs when Klopp virtually demanded a replay for a bad VAR decision, conveniently overlooking all the bad decisions, VAR and others, that have advantaged Liverpool over the years. Then there are the journalists who were belittled and snubbed for asking mildly critical questions (in other words doing their job).
Worst of all perhaps was his behavior after an FA cup game with third-tier Shrewsbury in 2020 which ended 2-2 and necessitated an inconvenient replay. Klopp, incensed at having to play the extra fixture, claimed the FA had reneged on an agreement to a mid-season break (it’s far from clear that this is what happened).
He refused to attend the replay and fielded an ‘under strength’ team led by youth coach Neil Critchley. This not only short-changed the fans, who would have expected at least a reasonably strong team, but was an insult to Shrewsbury, whose journeyman players’ one night in the spotlight in of the game’s great stadiums, was turned into a sour politicised non-event with all the focus on Klopp, in absentia.
The manner of his departure is controversial too, and smacks of a similar solipsism. Why announce now, with Liverpool top of the league and still in three cups? It can only have a disruptive effect, as players whose futures are suddenly in doubt (will the new boss have a clear out?) ponder what comes next when they should be focussed on winning games. Could he not have waited three months?
So, farewell the Jurgen Klopp and thanks for the memories. But let’s be honest, they weren’t all good.
Unbelievable this from The Spectator
The last bit is bonkers. Accusing him of being self-centred by announcing it early.
Not everyone will miss Jurgen Klopp
So, farewell then Jurgen Klopp. What memories you will leave us. You were exuberant, passionate and unorthodox. You ran up and down the touchline, gesticulating manically. You had a nice, albeit cosmetically enhanced, smile. You could be charming and witty.
You won. seven trophies in nine years for Liverpool, most significantly the Premier League title that ended an excruciating generation long wait and a sixth Champion’s League. Your place in the Pantheon is assured and things will be duller without you.
But is your leaving really a ‘disaster’? From the press reaction it would appear that your tenure at Anfield was an unbroken period of glory and joy the imminent cessation of which has precipitated something akin to mourning and existential angst. One wouldn’t be surprised at calls for a statue to be erected or a stand renamed.
Is this justified?
One league win in eight attempts is surely a tad disappointing for a club of Liverpool’s stature, and last year’s failure to even make it into the Champion’s League is similar to relegation for managers of teams outside the super elite. And as for trophies won, take out the not so super ‘Super Cup’, the glorified training exercise that is the Community Shield and the frankly rather silly World Club Championship and we’re down to four, one of which is the League Cup.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not quibbling with the idea of Klopp as a very good manager. Spurs and Arsenal, let alone Manchester United fans, would kill for four trophies in a decade. And given the enormous pressure and soaring expectations of the Liverpool faithful and the hyper competitive environment of the premiership, it’s a decent return. But the anguish and despair at your decision to move on, seems somewhat disproportionate.
Partly this is explicable by Liverpool’s footballing psychology. The red half of the city was experiencing something akin to a slow motion nervous breakdown as each title less year ticked by. Klopp’s 2019/2020 triumph was a supremely cathartic moment that must have felt like a release from prison and what had seemed like a life-sentence for the long-suffering fans.
Klopp now has mythic status and limitless reserves of gratitude. But winning the league in 2020 was no more of an achievement for having broken a long winless run. A more realistic response for a club that can field teams worth 500 million pounds or more would have been: ‘why did it take so long?’ or ‘about time’.
Klopp has probably also benefitted from the hard-wired irrationality in football that conflates charisma with success and allows charm and an indignant refusal to accept blame to distort the statistical record. (Call it the ‘Mourinho effect’.) If Klopp had been dull, humourless, uninspiring, and prone to shouldering responsibility for poor results rather than lashing out at referrees and VAR, he might even have been given the heave-ho after last season’s grave disappointments, never mind what had come before.
And if we are going to wish Klopp well, and recognise his contribution, we ought to at least acknowledge the less appealing side of his personality. Klopp’s off-the-field antics were frequently inappropriate and came close on occasion to bullying. There were numerous run-ins with referees such as after this season’s defeat to Spurs when Klopp virtually demanded a replay for a bad VAR decision, conveniently overlooking all the bad decisions, VAR and others, that have advantaged Liverpool over the years. Then there are the journalists who were belittled and snubbed for asking mildly critical questions (in other words doing their job).
Worst of all perhaps was his behavior after an FA cup game with third-tier Shrewsbury in 2020 which ended 2-2 and necessitated an inconvenient replay. Klopp, incensed at having to play the extra fixture, claimed the FA had reneged on an agreement to a mid-season break (it’s far from clear that this is what happened).
He refused to attend the replay and fielded an ‘under strength’ team led by youth coach Neil Critchley. This not only short-changed the fans, who would have expected at least a reasonably strong team, but was an insult to Shrewsbury, whose journeyman players’ one night in the spotlight in of the game’s great stadiums, was turned into a sour politicised non-event with all the focus on Klopp, in absentia.
The manner of his departure is controversial too, and smacks of a similar solipsism. Why announce now, with Liverpool top of the league and still in three cups? It can only have a disruptive effect, as players whose futures are suddenly in doubt (will the new boss have a clear out?) ponder what comes next when they should be focussed on winning games. Could he not have waited three months?
So, farewell the Jurgen Klopp and thanks for the memories. But let’s be honest, they weren’t all good.
JULES
Well-Known Member
and from rawk, of the most deluded wanker on the internet....son of spion, I almost pissed myself reading this
In a way, it is also best for us too. As Jürgen alluded to in his video.
Of course, he could have felt as he does but still soldiered on. But he knows that would mean giving less of himself. Less than 100%. He's an honourable man who will never shortchange himself or others. There's no way he'd allow himself to give anything less than 100%. He'd see it as shortchanging himself, our Club and every fan of this club.
This is why he believes he's not only doing the right thing for himself and his family, but for us as a club and fanbase too. As painful as it is to accept, I think he's right.
He loves us. He wants someone in who has still got 100% in the tank to give. He loves us, and that's why he's let us go.
In a way, it is also best for us too. As Jürgen alluded to in his video.
Of course, he could have felt as he does but still soldiered on. But he knows that would mean giving less of himself. Less than 100%. He's an honourable man who will never shortchange himself or others. There's no way he'd allow himself to give anything less than 100%. He'd see it as shortchanging himself, our Club and every fan of this club.
This is why he believes he's not only doing the right thing for himself and his family, but for us as a club and fanbase too. As painful as it is to accept, I think he's right.
He loves us. He wants someone in who has still got 100% in the tank to give. He loves us, and that's why he's let us go.
mexico1970
Well-Known Member
GaudinoMotors
Well-Known Member
Super
Blue and true
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Cult. They are the definition of indoctrinated.