Sevilla U19s v City U19s 3/11/2015

[Sir peace frog]

neville k,I appreciate you knowledge on all things youth, but you don't half rattle on about it, your becoming obsessed with youth players getting into the first team, if they are good enough they will play.

as for denayer being good enough, i don't know , but im sure the youth and first team coaches know better than most ,they are not trying to spite the youth players, they are trying to get them to realise their potential , and if they think it serves the club/player better to go out on loan then its a loan for the better of the club

 

[supercity88]

neville k,I appreciate you knowledge on all things youth, but you don't half rattle on about it, your becoming obsessed with youth players getting into the first team, if they are good enough they will play.

as for denayer being good enough, i don't know , but im sure the youth and first team coaches know better than most ,they are not trying to spite the youth players, they are trying to get them to realise their potential , and if they think it serves the club/player better to go out on loan then its a loan for the better of the club

Unfortunately that's just not true and it's incredibly naive. The fact of the matter is we're more likely to buy the latest wonder kid for £8m and play him than we are to play someone who has proven themselves week in week out in the EDS. We'll get in the situation where we stall the development of our own talents, they'll leave the club and go elsewhere and then do well and we'll buy them back for more money. Despite the fact that Otamendi has made a great impact, we are supposed to be integrating a model where the academy feeds the first team. That's just not happening. We spent £40m on Mangala then followed it up with £25m or whatever it was on Otamendi. Where does that leave our very own Denayer who has looked incredibly impressive?

The same will happen in other areas of the pitch. You can't have a successful academy if there's no hope of making the first team. So far there's very little hope of progression.

 

[Centurions]

Unfortunately that's just not true and it's incredibly naive. The fact of the matter is we're more likely to buy the latest wonder kid for £8m and play him than we are to play someone who has proven themselves week in week out in the EDS. We'll get in the situation where we stall the development of our own talents, they'll leave the club and go elsewhere and then do well and we'll buy them back for more money. Despite the fact that Otamendi has made a great impact, we are supposed to be integrating a model where the academy feeds the first team. That's just not happening. We spent £40m on Mangala then followed it up with £25m or whatever it was on Otamendi. Where does that leave our very own Denayer who has looked incredibly impressive?

The same will happen in other areas of the pitch. You can't have a successful academy if there's no hope of making the first team. So far there's very little hope of progression.

Sorry but that is pure bollocks. You, like a lot of others, keep quoting the Denayer situation as if one instance symbolises the whole club. By all accounts (because none of us know exactly what goes on back stage) Mangala was the one going out on loan and we would have kept Denayer as 3rd/4th choice with Demichelis. If Mangala turns down the move because he wants to prove himself here then that's his right. Someone had to then go and Denayer seemed happy enough to go out for 12 months (with almost guaranteed 1st team football) until next season when Demichelis will be moved on (NYCFC?).

Yes, perhaps we didn't need Otamendi but he's should be proving his worth to anyone by now. Denayer has nothing to worry about as I see it, Mangala perhaps should be though. I can see him being loaned out next Summer with an option to buy, he's not looking settled in this league at all.

And don't give me the Barker/Roberts scenario as they play on opposite wings, yes I know Roberts came on for (5 minutes?) on the left once but if you really think that that has stalled Barkers development then you're being deliberately obtuse.

 

[supercity88]

Denayer was rewarded with a new contract and has dine what was asked of him by impressing on loan. There comes a time when you have to play these kids or there's no hope or faith amongst academy players that they'll make a career at the club which is their ultimate goal. Yes they can still forge careers elsewhere but the number 1 goal is they play for city.

Mangala was only linked with a loan because his agent is also otamendis. The agent had to do the best for Mangala but also had the chance to make money from Otamendi signing for us. Mangala said he would stay and fight so the agent was left happy.

I'm not talking about the Barker v Roberts scenario. If you think we are doing a good job with the academy then that's up to you. But where exactly are the academy players in our first team?? Nacho? Does he count? If he had have been with City for six or seven years I doubt he would have made an appearance for us. Barker has impressed at every level and for England and deserved a chance. Garcia has looked okay but bang average at EDS level but gets opportunities. Its an odd scenario that is occurring and there doesn't seem to be a strong enough reward system in place for good performances.

I'm happy Barker has a loan spell. Looking at Tottenham you can see that young players can make a mark even if they don't instantly get in the first team at 19. Kane has been much better for those loan spells and the club is choosing good sides generally with which to send players.

At some stage someone will need to give these young players more of a chance though or the whole system could fall. If there's no chance of your son making it into the first team then despite the facilities you'd take them somewhere they might get a chance.

 

[Centurions]

Denayer was rewarded with a new contract and has dine what was asked of him by impressing on loan. There comes a time when you have to play these kids or there's no hope or faith amongst academy players that they'll make a career at the club which is their ultimate goal. Yes they can still forge careers elsewhere but the number 1 goal is they play for city.

Mangala was only linked with a loan because his agent is also otamendis. The agent had to do the best for Mangala but also had the chance to make money from Otamendi signing for us. Mangala said he would stay and fight so the agent was left happy.

I'm not talking about the Barker v Roberts scenario. If you think we are doing a good job with the academy then that's up to you. But where exactly are the academy players in our first team?? Nacho? Does he count? If he had have been with City for six or seven years I doubt he would have made an appearance for us. Barker has impressed at every level and for England and deserved a chance. Garcia has looked okay but bang average at EDS level but gets opportunities. Its an odd scenario that is occurring and there doesn't seem to be a strong enough reward system in place for good performances.

I'm happy Barker has a loan spell. Looking at Tottenham you can see that young players can make a mark even if they don't instantly get in the first team at 19. Kane has been much better for those loan spells and the club is choosing good sides generally with which to send players.

At some stage someone will need to give these young players more of a chance though or the whole system could fall. If there's no chance of your son making it into the first team then despite the facilities you'd take them somewhere they might get a chance.

So Spurs are doing right by sending them out on loan and gaining experience but we're (deliberately?) blocking their development by doing the same?

No. I wouldn't count Kelechi (or Roberts) as youth products, what exactly do you base your thoughts on as regards "Nacho? Does he count? If he had have been with City for six or seven years I doubt he would have made an appearance for us". Pure speculation (otherwise known as KFA).

Do tell us all, who these players are in the EDS who are ready to take the place of a 1st teamer, not the ones out on loan getting valuable experience (but only if they were Spurs players, we're just destroying their careers).

 

[blue b4 the moon]

Did we get that awful red card rescinded?

 

[Centurions]

Did we get that awful red card rescinded?

Not heard anything yet, don't even know when they look at these things.

Edit: just had a look at his twitter feed and there's nothing on there so possibly not been reviewed yet.

Our very own @towsips gets a retweet off him though ;)

 

[supercity88]

So Spurs are doing right by sending them out on loan and gaining experience but we're (deliberately?) blocking their development by doing the same?

No. I wouldn't count Kelechi (or Roberts) as youth products, what exactly do you base your thoughts on as regards "Nacho? Does he count? If he had have been with City for six or seven years I doubt he would have made an appearance for us". Pure speculation (otherwise known as KFA).

Do tell us all, who these players are in the EDS who are ready to take the place of a 1st teamer, not the ones out on loan getting valuable experience (but only if they were Spurs players, we're just destroying their careers).

You can respond with comments such as "pure speculation" but you can't say with any truth our academy talents are getting time in the first team. In reference to Spurs and loan spells, I do see the value in them and I'm much happier Barker has gone on loan. When he was at the club still he was being wasted and overlooked for players that were not in the squad on merit. You cannot argue that Roberts or Garcia's displays recently warranted an appearance for the first team. If there is a hierarchy of who plays based on their cost etc then our system is flawed. There have been numerous players in much more consistent form who haven't made an appearance for our first team, but others like Garcia and Nacho, and now Roberts seem to be more favoured. Barker and Evans have been at the club donkeys but had we bought them in the last couple of years and had their names sounded more Spanish we'd have seen them for the first team. It doesn't matter if that's speculation, it's what I believe to be the truth. If you believe it to be wrong your head needs to come back down from the clouds.

 

[Centurions]

You can respond with comments such as "pure speculation" but you can't say with any truth our academy talents are getting time in the first team. In reference to Spurs and loan spells, I do see the value in them and I'm much happier Barker has gone on loan. When he was at the club still he was being wasted and overlooked for players that were not in the squad on merit. You cannot argue that Roberts or Garcia's displays recently warranted an appearance for the first team. If there is a hierarchy of who plays based on their cost etc then our system is flawed. There have been numerous players in much more consistent form who haven't made an appearance for our first team, but others like Garcia and Nacho, and now Roberts seem to be more favoured. Barker and Evans have been at the club donkeys but had we bought them in the last couple of years and had their names sounded more Spanish we'd have seen them for the first team. It doesn't matter if that's speculation, it's what I believe to be the truth. If you believe it to be wrong your head needs to come back down from the clouds.

Your head needs to come back out of your arse bud, you're still talking bollocks.

 

[Neville Kneville]

You can respond with comments such as "pure speculation" but you can't say with any truth our academy talents are getting time in the first team. In reference to Spurs and loan spells, I do see the value in them and I'm much happier Barker has gone on loan. When he was at the club still he was being wasted and overlooked for players that were not in the squad on merit. You cannot argue that Roberts or Garcia's displays recently warranted an appearance for the first team. If there is a hierarchy of who plays based on their cost etc then our system is flawed. There have been numerous players in much more consistent form who haven't made an appearance for our first team, but others like Garcia and Nacho, and now Roberts seem to be more favoured. Barker and Evans have been at the club donkeys but had we bought them in the last couple of years and had their names sounded more Spanish we'd have seen them for the first team. It doesn't matter if that's speculation, it's what I believe to be the truth. If you believe it to be wrong your head needs to come back down from the clouds.

People who think Denayer & Barker would have been happy about being overlooked for the first team in favour of newcomers are in some kind of parallel universe where human nature is somewhat different.

We are reaching the stage where we have to start using more of our homegrown players or there will be a change in recruitment.

Some people are slow on the uptake on here but I'll put two things together to make it simpler.

1: Utd complaining about City snaffling all the best kids.
2: LVG going on about how he would rather use kids, than sign players for big money.

Are the two things connected ?

OF COURSE THEY FUCKING ARE!

If we want to retain our advantage, we soon have to start using more kids or they will start signing for Utd etc. Simple.