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blueinsa
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Is that a new strong cider?
General Election June 8th
- Thread starter Ric
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Is that a new strong cider?
HelloCity
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Says it all
KenTheLandlord
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you will be asking to tickle his tum next
bluethrunthru
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Yeah just saw him on The Andrew Marr show
Thought he did very well and very badly at the same time.
Every time I watch Corbyn I agree with almost everything that he says. However he's almost too calm and rational for Westminster, with never enough vigour. It's like he's the smartest man in the room but this automatically disqualifies him from being the most popular.
Honestly and some of his policies are absurdly daft because he's trying to bend them around previous statements made in the 1980s and 1990s. He was just asked if he'd tell British nuclear sub Commanders to retaliate with nuclear weapons and he dodged it. If he would have said "I'd tell them that if the UK was attacked by a nation with nuclear weapons then to bomb them back to the Stone Age", he would have instantly won 5% of the vote and nobody could really criticise him because he'd still be consistent in saying that he'd never launch a first strike.
The people in charge of Labour's PR strategy are constantly misfiring on Corbyn and have been since he was originally elected.
My problem is that whilst he seems so calm and reasonable - he is not what we need at this time to face off against the EU.
Yes, it all sounds aspirational in a positive way - but the EU are looking to boss these negotiations and they would be able to do with him in charge.
It is not us playing hardball - it is the EU - Corbyn would not get us the best deal - so for me in 2017 it is a no.....
Yes, it all sounds aspirational in a positive way - but the EU are looking to boss these negotiations and they would be able to do with him in charge.
It is not us playing hardball - it is the EU - Corbyn would not get us the best deal - so for me in 2017 it is a no.....
I think this is common wisdom but that it's wrong.
The best result of negotiations are always two sides who come in wanting to make a mutually beneficial deal and are willing to give and take. There's this conventional idea that ideologues and "hard people" get the best deals but that's just nonsense as many who have been in negotiations will tell you. Those people get told to sit in the corner while the adults work it all out.
This isn't a Hollywood movie. There's no action heroes storming the Champs Elysee to save the day from Europeans trying to rob us of our borders. It's a complex negotiation on trading unions, freedom of movement and customs protocols.
I think the Tories will get us the best deal because I think Labour as a Party aren't equipped to lead at the moment and I don't think the Lib Dems will EVER be equipped to lead. However, May being a firebrand will NOT help in actual negotiations and in fact will harm us. Diplomacy in the real world is patient and long winded.
But all of my best friends are Scots!
Ancient Citizen
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Deep fried leeks?
I agree absolutely about the 'two sides winning' - the negotiations need to be undertaken in a calm manner, building relationships and agreements well away from the glare of public debate, but under appropriate governance - there is no place for action heroes I agree.
Unfortunately that is not the position the EU is coming from - their mandate given to Barnier is a clear EU totally win and UK totally lose scenario - the UK cannot go with that.
We do need to bring to the table a position where we are able to conduct the patient and long-winded discussions because we are not simply forced to accept the EU positions.
The only point I disagree with you on is your comment on May acting as a Firebrand point. May, IMO, has been no kind of Firebrand - she has been utterly boring and making it all very toned down - as you say - this is what is needed.
My point was about Corbyn not May and it was not really with regard 'character' - the PM (Crobyn or May) will be the leader but they will not be actually undertaking the negotiations. I have undertaken major negotiations on behalf of the government and I have always done so by presenting the options and recommendations in front of the leader (and their governance group) at each point - the people that bring forward the options and recommendations will not be front-line politicians.
My point, although I made it sound all about Corbyn, was meant to be more about, from a negotiating preparations perspective, that the last months will have been all about getting our stall agreed and working out how we would conduct the negotiations and what we would actually do at the 'rub points' - even though you want them to be as few as possible. I do not think Corbyn will have made the necessary decisions and will have hampered the UK's negotiating team - just my opinion.
Anyway I have strayed in to the A50 thread content so will leave it there
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