Article 50/Brexit Negotiations

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instead of bumbling on like a sad robot mumbling "strong and stable" fucking up the Brexit negotiations on day one, (that is, after doing a Devon Lock in the election) May should do another classic U-Turn, say, the referendum was only 2% off a 50/50 split, and that she has misjudged the public in the wake of Manchester, London, Grenfell, call a 2nd referendum,resign and let Labour have a crack, which will either backfire spectacularly in Corbyn's face, or he will lead us into a new golden era.
 
Because if you're not from the UK and especially not from within these isles then I think you have some cheek to lecture me on what my country is, especially since it has one of the most complex histories, and b) chastise people here on their political decisions relating to national sovereignty of powers in their own country.

Here's an easier to grasp example for you. Is Rheged a country? It was annexed by Northumbria in the same way as the union of the crowns of Scotland and England, through inheritance. Northumbria was disputed by Scotland and England but later anyhow the Normans conquered the entire region now known as England. Wales was also conquered by Norman rulers. What about all the other kingdoms that have existed in Britain? Are they all countries?

If you want to consider perceptions, written from the late 13th Century onwards, one of the most famous pieces of Welsh literature (Welsh Triads) referred to all of Britain outside of the highlands (Alban) and south eastern England as Cymry, where the South East was Lloegyr. Wales was conquered in 1283 - it is part of the Kingdom of England. There have been several inceptions of state since then too, yet in society, people still think of it as a country. What they don't know of is the Celtic League that promoted self-determination of these areas based upon the false notion that they were a common peoples that English aren't.

Is this still the calibre and level of understanding you expect from people who voted for Brexit?
You can stand down Corporal Jones. I'm a Yorkshireman
 
You can stand down Corporal Jones. I'm a Yorkshireman
You used odd word usage in relation to NI and Scotland before. In any case I hope you'll see that countries are only black and white when it comes to the legal wording and that the home nations are largely a retrospective ideal. Satisfied by my facts now or do you want the hundreds of sources I've studied?
 
You used odd word usage in relation to NI and Scotland before. In any case I hope you'll see that countries are only black and white when it comes to the legal wording and that the home nations are largely a retrospective ideal. Satisfied by my facts now or do you want the hundreds of sources I've studied?
Go on list all your sources then.
I can tell you want to.
Then I'll list mine.
 
You're falling into the nuances of word use here where they can be applied in different context and still showing a clear misunderstanding of what the UK is. Where are you from out of interest?

Countries are useful terms to apply to the home nations in respect of their history but mainly as, for example, Scotland being a country of land - in the same way someone might say "out in the country" meaning a broad area of land. There are cultural nuances as to why it is referred to as a country in other respects. It is not however a country in the political sense remotely prior to devolution. Despite devolution, it has not been a political country on the international stage for 310 years - which is the proper use of the term that we are discussing here. This is a trouble of language, if there was another accurate word to distinguish between the two senses of "country" it would help explain. I avoided saying NI and Scotland are "part" of our country to avoid the comparison to actual countries politically united such as by the European Union. The EU is just an organisation in any case, despite some within it clearly wanting otherwise. Therefore, yes, NI and Scotland are this country - the UK. England does not exist outside of the regional sense (we are merely discussing political matters and avoiding sporting decisions here). These are facts, the misinterpretation of peoples/regions within the UK, revivalism of old cultures (at the beginning of which was often very inaccurate) and political organisations have led to a reimagined sense of these regions within the UK that are the home nations. I am dealing with legal facts alone here, not perception, which is widely available for your own study.

Unionists are called so because they want to stay united as a territory of the UK. NI and Ireland as a whole has it's own barrel of considerations aside. It is not a union, both English and Scottish parliament passed legislation that dissolved the political regions (Kingdoms at that time, from which modern European countries were conceived) into a single entity. The crowns of each kingdom were already possessed by a single ruler for 104 years, it was a formality that had been resisted until then. After that point there was no political distinction until devolution in Scotland 20 years ago.

To have some German bureaucrat have the audacity to think of involving himself in the intricacies of my country, he definitely doesn't have a fcking clue about, bellend was the most polite term I could use for him on here.

Because if you're not from the UK and especially not from within these isles then I think you have some cheek to lecture me on what my country is, especially since it has one of the most complex histories, and b) chastise people here on their political decisions relating to national sovereignty of powers in their own country.

Here's an easier to grasp example for you. Is Rheged a country? It was annexed by Northumbria in the same way as the union of the crowns of Scotland and England, through inheritance. Northumbria was disputed by Scotland and England but later anyhow the Normans conquered the entire region now known as England. Wales was also conquered by Norman rulers. What about all the other kingdoms that have existed in Britain? Are they all countries?

If you want to consider perceptions, written from the late 13th Century onwards, one of the most famous pieces of Welsh literature (Welsh Triads) referred to all of Britain outside of the highlands (Alban) and south eastern England as Cymry, where the South East was Lloegyr. Wales was conquered in 1283 - it is part of the Kingdom of England. There have been several inceptions of state since then too, yet in society, people still think of it as a country. What they don't know of is the Celtic League (and prior political organisations) that has promoted self-determination of these areas based upon the false notion that they were a common peoples that English aren't.

Is this still the calibre and level of understanding you expect from people who voted for Brexit?

Oh, now I get the distinction between "union" as in "Act of Union" and in "European Union". It's union, Jim, but not as we know it.
 
Go on list all your sources then.
If I had any confidence you're interested in reading them I would PM you some to get you started. But then again you have to study them objectively to an academic standard too.

Well what you just brought to the table were not sourceable facts but comments on political movements that are reflective of the perceptions and opinions of members within society which count for squat. In fact you used them incorrectly in the context anyway.
 
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Oh, now I get the distinction between "union" as in "Act of Union" and in "European Union". It's union, Jim, but not as we know it.
You're actually on the money there. The EU is a union of individual parts. The UK is a unified whole, occurring from two previously individual parts. Completely different things.
 
If I had any confidence you're interested in reading them I would PM you some to get you started. But then again you have to study them objectively to an academic standard too.

Well what you just brought to the table were not sourceable facts but comments on political movements that are reflective of the perceptions and opinions of members within society which count for squat.
If you're going to list them then list them on here so everybody can see them and compare your academic acheivement and mine. I'm sure you are far more academc than I ever could be. You come across as a quite an clever chap.
 
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