Nicolas Otamendi - 2016/17 performances

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lancs blue said:
I'd say that's being "damned with faint praise" given the overall laxity of our defending.

If the ultimate aim is to win the CL then none of our current defenders are good enough in Pep's system to be regular starters. Stones is getting there and has the potential to succeed but the rest will never be more than backup players even if they survive the summer cull.
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I call total bullshit. Strong statement I know and this isn't really chanelled at you but anyone who's Nico out. Not an attack.

Why are CL champions linked to him? Stones is cut out for city but a player who's being wooed by a club that is known for seeking out 'galaticos' is not? I dunno??? Maybe they might be right. The stats say he's legit and the links to bigger clubs are plenty enough for me and any neutral to say he's the real deal.

I'm not even a huge Nico guy... the thing is you can't just scoop up world class CB's. Nico out and who do you want it? Nobody ever wants to answer that.
 
ADegenerate said:
I call total bullshit. Strong statement I know and this isn't really chanelled at you but anyone who's Nico out. Not an attack.

Why are CL champions linked to him? Stones is cut out for city but a player who's being wooed by a club that is known for seeking out 'galaticos' is not? I dunno??? Maybe they might be right. The stats say he's legit and the links to bigger clubs are plenty enough for me and any neutral to say he's the real deal.

I'm not even a huge Nico guy... the thing is you can't just scoop up world class CB's. Nico out and who do you want it? Nobody ever wants to answer that.
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Did you miss the "in Pep's system" phrase in my post? As an earlier poster pointed out he seems to have performed better at Valencia in a more organised defensive set-up but I don't see him being consistent enough to hold down a regular starting position next season assuming Pep brings in the defenders he wants in the summer.
 
lancs blue said:
Did you miss the "in Pep's system" phrase in my post? As an earlier poster pointed out he seems to have performed better at Valencia in a more organised defensive set-up but I don't see him being consistent enough to hold down a regular starting position next season assuming Pep brings in the defenders he wants in the summer.
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I disregarded it because he didn't 'fit' in MPs system either. Tell me more about this defender you envision him bringing in if you will. How much and who and where do you find him for sell?
 
ADegenerate said:
I disregarded it because he didn't 'fit' in MPs system either. Tell me more about this defender you envision him bringing in if you will. How much and who and where do you find him for sell?
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So he didn't fit into two managers defensive systems, not exactly adaptable, is he!

Personally I'd do whatever it takes to bring in Bonucci but I'm sure Pep will have his own view on that.
 
ADegenerate said:
I call total bullshit. Strong statement I know and this isn't really chanelled at you but anyone who's Nico out. Not an attack.

Why are CL champions linked to him? Stones is cut out for city but a player who's being wooed by a club that is known for seeking out 'galaticos' is not? I dunno??? Maybe they might be right. The stats say he's legit and the links to bigger clubs are plenty enough for me and any neutral to say he's the real deal.

I'm not even a huge Nico guy... the thing is you can't just scoop up world class CB's. Nico out and who do you want it? Nobody ever wants to answer that.
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Your whole argument falls apart when you consider that actually, Real Madrid have zero interest in him. It was a funny rumour that went away as quickly as it arrived.
 
Otamendi's second half performance vs. Chelsea at the Etihad was one of the worst CB performances I've ever seen, he was completely at fault for 2 goals and the only reason he wasn't blamed or the other was because he was so far out of position he wasn't even in camera shot.

I wonder if Pep will fear a similar performance and drop him, or hope for some sort of bounce back performance and keep him. I'm not really looking forward to it either way.
 
domalino said:
Otamendi's second half performance vs. Chelsea at the Etihad was one of the worst CB performances I've ever seen, he was completely at fault for 2 goals and the only reason he wasn't blamed or the other was because he was so far out of position he wasn't even in camera shot.

I wonder if Pep will fear a similar performance and drop him, or hope for some sort of bounce back performance and keep him. I'm not really looking forward to it either way.
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Have to disagree with you there Dom, the only reason he wasn't blamed is because Bravo was in goal.
 
domalino said:
Your whole argument falls apart when you consider that actually, Real Madrid have zero interest in him. It was a funny rumour that went away as quickly as it arrived.
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Maybe that's true. I'll even go so far as to say I'll accept it as total fact with no research. I don't care!!!! I'm not sentimental. Find someone better!

People want to insult.. but have no solutions. Eric bailly, mangala, Nico, etc...you just DONT BUY WC CB's we tried. Everyone tries.
 
lancs blue said:
So he didn't fit into two managers defensive systems, not exactly adaptable, is he!

Personally I'd do whatever it takes to bring in Bonucci but I'm sure Pep will have his own view on that.
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I agree with you in that I'd bring in Bonucci too. I'd bring in anyone better at anytime...within reason. The thing is the deal was never going to happen...using logic


I don't fully represent the pro Nico side but the main thing for me is you just aren't getting better and people can't accept that, that's the annoying part.

I've heard VVD, Laporte and rudiger....Passss
 
ADegenerate said:
Maybe that's true. I'll even go so far as to say I'll accept it as total fact with no research. I don't care!!!! I'm not sentimental. Find someone better!

People want to insult.. but have no solutions. Eric bailly, mangala, Nico, etc...you just DONT BUY WC CB's we tried. Everyone tries.
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Samuel ntiti? And David Luis appear to be the most successful cb purchases this season. I think Luis would've been perfect to partner a fully fit vk
 
bondsman said:
Samuel ntiti? And David Luis appear to be the most successful cb purchases this season. I think Luis would've been perfect to partner a fully fit vk
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Vk can't even get a game because peps afraid he'll have a good run and have to keep him.

I'll gladly accept being wrong with this.
 
ADegenerate said:
Vk can't even get a game because peps afraid he'll have a good run and have to keep him.

I'll gladly accept being wrong with this.
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It could be that. Or it could be that its crystal clear Kompany is steps behind the other 3. Its laughable that folks think Pep has a superstar defender on the bench but doesn't use him.

The likelihood of that is practically Zero. Pep wants to win more than anyone. And on average he is not dimmer than your run of the mill fan. So if they can guess " uww Kompany will be great at CB" you can bet its a thought that has crossed Pep's mind.

And lets stop pretending, its not likely because be fears he'll break down either. Kompany is not the first great injury prone player either. More likely than not the evidence probably just shows he is the weakest of the 4 CB.

I know this is hard to accept for many who have seen Komp at his finest. That was 5 years ago.

Some of you should have seen George Weah 5 years before we got him.
 
Dax777 said:
Its tiring to have this discussions where people pretend their eyes and brains saddled with all its biases somehow do a better job than a study of the relevant statistics.

Check individual stats he dwarfs everyone.
Check stats of games involved vs games not involved and the % of loses rises dramatically.

Check the quality of opposition played. You'd find that he played against the toughest and yet we won more and he was absent against the weaker teams and yet we won less in those games.

Simply put its undeniable that he is a net positive for the club. A greater net positive than any other defender since he has been here.

These are facts, not opinions, personal views or punditry. Just facts!

You don't have to agree with the facts. But that doesn't change them.
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Your stats are tiresome.

Otamendi statistically missed fewer challenges tonight than he did last week.
 
Was absolutely immense in everything today. Passing, heading, anticipation, tackling, reading of the game, he has it all
I posted some stats not long ago that showed that the team had never lost a league game when stones wasn't his partner in a thread where people were blaming him for stones poor performances. Now it could be that they just don't communicate and gel well as a pair but whenever he's played with anyone but stones next to him he's looked superb.
The teams record now in the league when he's started without stones reads 10 games 8 wins 2 draws with just 6 goals conceded in those games compared to games where stones has started without him which reads 10 games 6 wins 2 draws 2 defeats with 12 goals conceded.

Now I will also add that although stones generally also performs better without otamendi next to him and has been improving defensively this past month, Otamendi is still imo the much better defender(as he should be with his experience) and one I would keep with Kompany going forward in the team. I know some want him sold but I believe he has enough quality to be a mainstay in the team for a good 2-3 years once he has a settled partner that he understands next to him
 
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