General Election June 8th

[Churchlawtonblue]

I didn't think they were buying them back I thought the idea was not to renew the franchises?

Water companies arnt franchises. I believe their ftse value in total is about 100billion. McDonnald said he hadnt costed them in manifesto. Small oversight you could say

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

The Tories have also stated they won't be reducing national debt til 2025. They will spend to try to save later. With no assurances that the latter will happen. But hey, why not just tell one side so it fits the agenda.

No agenda from me pal. I hate both, just think one side are marginally bettee than the other who are totally fucking deluded. None of the above for me.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

No black hole at all mate.
If you're referring to the 58 bn black hole alleged by the Tories to purchase the assets of the industries to be renationalised it's not a black hole.
The money will be borrowed by issuing bonds, the profits from the industries will be used to pay off the debt and interest ( very low at today's rates) instead of being paid out in dividends.
Pleased to be of assistance.

More borrowing lol.

Hey lets plant some more money trees!

Fucking clueless.

 

[Ricster]

No agenda from me pal. I hate both, just think one side are marginally bettee than the other who are totally fucking deluded. None of the above for me.

Sweet. Still time to get you aboard the lefties ha

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

The alledged black hole lol. John McDonald admitted it wasnt costed. He said it!! Alledge doensnt come in to it.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Sweet. Still time to get you aboard the lefties ha

Nice try, but no ta. After voting all my life the penny has dropped. They are all the same! Thieving lying barstards.

 

[KenTheLandlord]

Water companies arnt franchises. I believe their ftse value in total is about 100billion. McDonnald said he hadnt costed them in manifesto. Small oversight you could say

You should sit next to Hammond, he cannot juggle numbers either The estimated value of water companies is £70bn. Just the £30bn overshoot.

Nationalising 32 water companies in England and Wales will also be costly. The water regulator, Ofwat, puts the capital value of the industry at £69bn.

Don't worry CLB

Will it increase the public debt?
...the policy wouldn’t add to Britain’s debt burden. Unlike the nationalisations of failing industries in the 1930s and 1940s, Railtrack in 2002 and the banks in 2008, Labour’s targets are thriving. It may seem like an accounting sleight of hand, but the cost of privatisation would be balanced by the value of the asset acquired.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...tionalisation-rail-water-energy-cost-benefits

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

You should sit next to Hammond, he cannot juggle numbers either The estimated value of water companies is £70bn. Just the £30bn overshoot.

Nationalising 32 water companies in England and Wales will also be costly. The water regulator, Ofwat, puts the capital value of the industry at £69bn.

Don't worry CLB

Will it increase the public debt?
...the policy wouldn’t add to Britain’s debt burden. Unlike the nationalisations of failing industries in the 1930s and 1940s, Railtrack in 2002 and the banks in 2008, Labour’s targets are thriving. It may seem like an accounting sleight of hand, but the cost of privatisation would be balanced by the value of the asset acquired.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...tionalisation-rail-water-energy-cost-benefits

The 100b estimate was quoted on rad 4. But whatever it is its still not costed is it you prat! He said he would have to borrow to pay for all of the privatisation. They just left that small detail out of their manisfesto. Lol. You must be truly thick !

 

[Len Rum]

More borrowing lol.

Hey lets plant some more money trees!

Fucking clueless.

LOL.
Tories planting those money trees all the way up to 2025 now! ( first it was 2015,then 2017, then 2020, now 2025).
You are right - fcuking clueless the Tories when it comes to the economy.

 

[The perfect fumble]

One thing I suspect some people overlook is that the government becomes responsible for capital investment once a company is nationalised. Then along come competing demands, some of which are very precious to voters. Guess what? Investment can take a flying fcuk and the industry gets progressively run down.

Yes, there are no competing demands in the private sector, they plough all their profits in to capital investment with scarcely a penny for the executives or the investors. They run their services with customers, sorry, I mean citizens first and foremost in their minds, that's why they are value for money and the services they provide are the cheapest and most efficient in the world, just look at our railways, admired across the globe.

 

[sir baconface]

You should sit next to Hammond, he cannot juggle numbers either The estimated value of water companies is £70bn. Just the £30bn overshoot.

Nationalising 32 water companies in England and Wales will also be costly. The water regulator, Ofwat, puts the capital value of the industry at £69bn.

Don't worry CLB

Will it increase the public debt?
...the policy wouldn’t add to Britain’s debt burden. Unlike the nationalisations of failing industries in the 1930s and 1940s, Railtrack in 2002 and the banks in 2008, Labour’s targets are thriving. It may seem like an accounting sleight of hand, but the cost of privatisation would be balanced by the value of the asset acquired.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...tionalisation-rail-water-energy-cost-benefits

"It may seem like an accounting sleight of hand". Hmm. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

This all assumes they continue to run at a profit. That in turn will need capital investment. And a government that doesn't piss half of it away in wage increases, sick and parental leave, consultancy fees, confidentiality agreements to cover up whistle-blowing or sheer incompetence; not to mention massed ranks of new managers and administrators. NHS anyone?

If they can't oversee contracts properly, why would anyone think they'd be be successful running the companies direct?

 

[The perfect fumble]

"It may seem like an accounting sleight of hand". Hmm. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

This all assumes they continue to run at a profit. That in turn will need capital investment. And a government that doesn't piss half of it away in wage increases, consultancy fees and massed ranks of managers and administrators. NHS anyone?

If they can't oversee contracts properly, why would anyone think they'd be be successful running the companies direct?

Yep, they should give the army to McDonald's and the NHS to Sports Direct.

 

[KenTheLandlord]

The 100b estimate was quoted on rad 4. But whatever it is its still not costed is it you prat! He said he would have to borrow to pay for all of the privatisation. They just left that small detail out of their manisfesto. Lol. You must be truly thick !

Stood next to you i would be the genius. Listen, stop applying your world of nonsense on to what is happening. If it is too difficult, bow with a little dignity. The figures you provided were out and i would love to see even one cost from the tory comic. The value of the assets would more than cover the costs, clearly they cannot predict to the penny, so no add to the debt, of which, the tories are piling up like a builder on speed. This is a breathe of fresh air compared to the utterly clueless tory economic plan (by plan i mean fuck up).

 

[sir baconface]

Yes, there are no competing demands in the private sector, they plough all their profits in to capital investment with scarcely a penny for the executives or the investors. They run their services with customers, sorry, I mean citizens first and foremost in their minds, that's why they are value for money and the services they provide are the cheapest and most efficient in the world, just look at our railways, admired across the globe.

Just as they were admired before nationalisation you mean? Look back to the heyday of nationalised industries. National Coal Board, British Steel, British Gas, the docks (?), British Telecom, British Leyland. All bastions of customer excellence, high productivity and efficiency.

Alway easy to sneer about customers when you are employed by the government.

 

[KenTheLandlord]

"It may seem like an accounting sleight of hand". Hmm. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

This all assumes they continue to run at a profit. That in turn will need capital investment. And a government that doesn't piss half of it away in wage increases, sick and parental leave, consultancy fees, confidentiality agreements to cover up whistle-blowing or sheer incompetence; not to mention massed ranks of new managers and administrators. NHS anyone?

If they can't oversee contracts properly, why would anyone think they'd be be successful running the companies direct?

Some guesswork and ifs there. I would be perfectly happy to give it a go and see what comes out of the box when its rattled and see the money foraged away in offshore accounts returned to the country coffers.

 

[KenTheLandlord]

Just as they were admired before nationalisation you mean? Look back to the heyday of nationalised industries. National Coal Board, British Steel, British Gas, the docks (?), British Telecom, British Leyland. All bastions of customer excellence, high productivity and efficiency.

Alway easy to sneer about customers when you are employed by the government.

You assume the customer service is better now and yet we pay far more for the same product and have no comebacks. Meanwhile those profits drip drip out of the country.

 

[sir baconface]

You assume the customer service is better now and yet we pay far more for the same product and have no comebacks. Meanwhile those profits drip drip out of the country.

My perception is better customer service on the whole, though far from perfect.

Re comebacks, what are the regulators doing? And how would comebacks be improved on re-nationalisation?

Re more expensive, I believe two major factors in the utilities sector are capital investment catch-up, following years of under-funding, and green technology demands.

I was never enthusiastic about selling staple industries to foreign owners, to be honest. How many French or German utilities do we own, I wonder?

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Just as they were admired before nationalisation you mean? Look back to the heyday of nationalised industries. National Coal Board, British Steel, British Gas, the docks (?), British Telecom, British Leyland. All bastions of customer excellence, high productivity and efficiency.

Alway easy to sneer about customers when you are employed by the government.

In fairness, compared to today, most large commercial organisations were run inefficiently back then.

Some things are better run by the state. For me, railways, prisons and most utilities fall into that category - and I am an arch capitalist.

 

[bluethrunthru]

Reuters quoting poll lead of 13% for the Tories narrowed to just under 10% in Sundays Metro - May's " Death Tax " as its been dubbed going down a storm. On Peston today a majority of 46 was being predicted - if that comes to pass then May is fucked - taking a predicted 200 majority landslide down to under 50 the knives will be out for her and the decision to call the GE will look as clever as Camerons referendum

 

[sir baconface]

Reuters quoting poll lead of 13% for the Tories narrowed to just under 10% in Sundays Metro - May's " Death Tax " as its been dubbed going down a storm. On Peston today a majority of 46 was being predicted - if that comes to pass then May is fucked - taking a predicted 200 majority landslide down to under 50 the knives will be out for her and the decision to call the GE will look as clever as Camerons referendum

Even as a "natural Tory", and one who was initially happy she called the GE, I won't lose any sleep over this. She's played a stinker and could do with a helping of crow pie. On Brexit, she'd win hands down. On personal projection and on non-Brexit matters, she's looking more and more like the Empress with No Clothes.