Another new Brexit thread

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Vic said:
Hand over the legislative reins with no say in who that is? How the hell do you think we've got our current PM?
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The idea that you have to directly elect the PM is constitutional nonsense. PM is not a president, he/she is 'primus inter pares' (first among equals) and it fulfils the constitutional requirement if the cabinet choses him/her. Party members getting a vote is just party management.
 
johnnytapia said:
What's it like in cloud cuckoo land? Sounds great. You've listed the so called rules and regulations on freedom of movement. The reality, as witnessed daily by those of us with eyes open is very, very different.
And glad to see you empathise so well with the Greeks. The EU caused untold misery? Well, never mind, it's far worse in the UK so boo-hoo.
Why would I want to fund Farage? Such a facile argument, "you don't want this so I bet you want this". No wonder Remain were so, so fucking easy to beat.
Anyway, we're leaving, so we'll have plenty of time to discuss the medicine shortages; run on the pound; twenty mile truck queues; dead piles of cattle etc, etc. There'll all be rendered moot by WWIII anyway, so get knocking up your Anderson shelter (or will be onto WWIV by then?)
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‘’Remain so fucking easy to beat’’

That’s hilarious. How’s your victory going ?
 
BobKowalski said:
FoM can be managed given there are rules and caveats and it most certainly can be resourced properly. Greece can if it wishes either exit the Euro and stay in the EU or exit both. I imagine popular opinion is firmly on the side of exit and political parties are there to represent that? MEPs vote for the commission and also vote on new laws and regs. You vote for MEPs.

German unemployment rate is 3.0%. UK 3.9%. Yay the Eurozone. Reality is some countries do better than others. Don’t like the Eurozone then exit the Eurozone. We just spaffed £30m on contracts for a ferry company that had no ferries. That’s a lot of Kinnocks.
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James O'Brien stated yesterday that Greece public opinion was to stay in the EU and support for the EU had grown in Greece in the last year since they saw what we are going through. That may of course be driven by the example of our debacle rather than more positive feelings towards the EU!
 
BobKowalski said:
They could have written the article based on me. I didn’t so much tick all the boxes I made the bloody boxes :)
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It is actually a very positive thing that people engage, and are prepared to be forthright in their argument, no matter their political persuasion. As a nation we are woefully apathetic.
 
johnnytapia said:
What's it like in cloud cuckoo land? Sounds great. You've listed the so called rules and regulations on freedom of movement. The reality, as witnessed daily by those of us with eyes open is very, very different.
And glad to see you empathise so well with the Greeks. The EU caused untold misery? Well, never mind, it's far worse in the UK so boo-hoo.
Why would I want to fund Farage? Such a facile argument, "you don't want this so I bet you want this". No wonder Remain were so, so fucking easy to beat.
Anyway, we're leaving, so we'll have plenty of time to discuss the medicine shortages; run on the pound; twenty mile truck queues; dead piles of cattle etc, etc. There'll all be rendered moot by WWIII anyway, so get knocking up your Anderson shelter (or will be onto WWIV by then?)
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And so it goes.....

The facts may be inconvenient but it will still leave you very disappointed when immigration continues at current rates, just non EU immigrants replacing the EU immigrants. Simply the UK needs immigrants to help staff many of its sectors in roles that will not necessarily be taken up by UK citizens. I'm talking about the Health Service, Transport sector, Agriculture and the Tourism industry. It would make for a richer thread if you addressed the post with fact rather than dismissing it? Do you also dismiss those in the health sector that say the drying up of EU immigrants is already harming their sectors?

I'm glad you posted your reasons - not enough have been honest enough to do that but mate, please don't dismiss facts because they run contrary to your views.
I can absolutely understand your empathy for the Greeks but i'm not sure the UK leaving the EU will do anything to help them.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
And so it goes.....

The facts may be inconvenient but it will still leave you very disappointed when immigration continues at current rates, just non EU immigrants replacing the EU immigrants. Simply the UK needs immigrants to help staff many of its sectors in roles that will not necessarily be taken up by UK citizens. I'm talking about the Health Service, Transport sector, Agriculture and the Tourism industry. It would make for a richer thread if you addressed the post with fact rather than dismissing it? Do you also dismiss those in the health sector that say the drying up of EU immigrants is already harming their sectors?

I'm glad you posted your reasons - not enough have been honest enough to do that but mate, please don't dismiss facts because they run contrary to your views.
I can absolutely understand your empathy for the Greeks but i'm not sure the UK leaving the EU will do anything to help them.
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I’m not dismissing anything. I genuinely do think we’ll see immigration levels drop as a direct result of us leaving. And I think that’s a good thing.
I’ve seen, first hand, how the holders of EU passports have been able to enter this country, without any intention of working and helped themselves to local schools, doctors, housing etc, etc. I’ve seen the staff I work with get them that housing, knowing full well they’re taking the unadulterated piss. They’ve had Italian, Spanish, Austrian passports and have as much to do with those countries as your average Arctic seal. But, they have the golden ticket, the EU passport, ergo, there’s fuck all we can do.
I think leaving will reduce the number of these charlatans.
I don’t think us leaving will in any way help the Greeks. I just don’t want to have anything to do with an organisation that deliberately set them on a course of ultra-austerity and caused untold misery for hundreds of thousands.
We coped very well before joining the EC and I think we’ll cope equally well after we’ve left the EU.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
And so it goes.....

The facts may be inconvenient but it will still leave you very disappointed when immigration continues at current rates, just non EU immigrants replacing the EU immigrants. Simply the UK needs immigrants to help staff many of its sectors in roles that will not necessarily be taken up by UK citizens. I'm talking about the Health Service, Transport sector, Agriculture and the Tourism industry. It would make for a richer thread if you addressed the post with fact rather than dismissing it? Do you also dismiss those in the health sector that say the drying up of EU immigrants is already harming their sectors?

I'm glad you posted your reasons - not enough have been honest enough to do that but mate, please don't dismiss facts because they run contrary to your views.
I can absolutely understand your empathy for the Greeks but i'm not sure the UK leaving the EU will do anything to help them.
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More to the point, the Greeks don't think leaving the EU will help them. And it's hard to say what state they'd be in if they'd kept the drachma.
 
johnnytapia said:
I’m not dismissing anything. I genuinely do think we’ll see immigration levels drop as a direct result of us leaving. And I think that’s a good thing.
I’ve seen, first hand, how the holders of EU passports have been able to enter this country, without any intention of working and helped themselves to local schools, doctors, housing etc, etc. I’ve seen the staff I work with get them that housing, knowing full well they’re taking the unadulterated piss. They’ve had Italian, Spanish, Austrian passports and have as much to do with those countries as your average Arctic seal. But, they have the golden ticket, the EU passport, ergo, there’s fuck all we can do.
I think leaving will reduce the number of these charlatans.
I don’t think us leaving will in any way help the Greeks. I just don’t want to have anything to do with an organisation that deliberately set them on a course of ultra-austerity and caused untold misery for hundreds of thousands.
We coped very well before joining the EC and I think we’ll cope equally well after we’ve left the EU.
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That's it really. We've got used to better than "coping".
 
johnnytapia said:
I’m not dismissing anything. I genuinely do think we’ll see immigration levels drop as a direct result of us leaving. And I think that’s a good thing.
I’ve seen, first hand, how the holders of EU passports have been able to enter this country, without any intention of working and helped themselves to local schools, doctors, housing etc, etc. I’ve seen the staff I work with get them that housing, knowing full well they’re taking the unadulterated piss. They’ve had Italian, Spanish, Austrian passports and have as much to do with those countries as your average Arctic seal. But, they have the golden ticket, the EU passport, ergo, there’s fuck all we can do.
I think leaving will reduce the number of these charlatans.
I don’t think us leaving will in any way help the Greeks. I just don’t want to have anything to do with an organisation that deliberately set them on a course of ultra-austerity and caused untold misery for hundreds of thousands.
We coped very well before joining the EC and I think we’ll cope equally well after we’ve left the EU.
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Thats interesting. So you work on the front line and see this first hand? You say that these individuals have an EU passport but are nothing to do with the country of the passport. How can that be? But we always had the power to control those that had no intention to work. Just a shame we didn't exercise that control as it might have given you comfort that the system wasn't being abused.

We didn't cope particularly well though did we? We were termed the 'sick man' of Europe prior to us joining.
An honest question to you. Do you see a glimmer that we have the leadership and competence to lead us through the next say 5 years, because I just dont. The current bunch would struggle with steady state never mind the massive new challenges that will hit us.

One last question, if you don't mind. What are your views on ensuring we respect the GFA whilst implementing a 'no deal' brexit?
 
johnnytapia said:
I’m not dismissing anything. I genuinely do think we’ll see immigration levels drop as a direct result of us leaving. And I think that’s a good thing.
I’ve seen, first hand, how the holders of EU passports have been able to enter this country, without any intention of working and helped themselves to local schools, doctors, housing etc, etc. I’ve seen the staff I work with get them that housing, knowing full well they’re taking the unadulterated piss. They’ve had Italian, Spanish, Austrian passports and have as much to do with those countries as your average Arctic seal. But, they have the golden ticket, the EU passport, ergo, there’s fuck all we can do.
I think leaving will reduce the number of these charlatans.
I don’t think us leaving will in any way help the Greeks. I just don’t want to have anything to do with an organisation that deliberately set them on a course of ultra-austerity and caused untold misery for hundreds of thousands.
We coped very well before joining the EC and I think we’ll cope equally well after we’ve left the EU.
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Blame the government. If people are coming in on EU passports and aren’t supporting themselves and paying into the system then it’s the UK government’s fault for not using the powers it has to remove these people. You’ve been told this and yet ignore it.
 
Ban-jani said:
Blame the government. If people are coming in on EU passports and aren’t supporting themselves and paying into the system then it’s the UK government’s fault for not using the powers it has to remove these people. You’ve been told this and yet ignore it.
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Ha! Ha! Fantastic. You're the ideal border control guy. "Can you support yourself?" "yep". "in you come".
 
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