Another new Brexit thread

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Lol. Brexit thread back - obviously the prospect of the muffin / barm one turning nasty has forced the mods to reinstate it.

 

[cibaman]

Pretty obvious to anyone who has been arround the block and worked in business that this is going to be the end result. Could have been done earlier had May and her civil servants had any experience in negotiating or the desire for Brexit. Those panicking and peddling project fear like the BBC and the lib dems and the fickle labour party are actually playing into the UKs gov hands by making it look more likley that we are prepared to go the whole mile. It's only a matter of time before Merkel tells the EU leaders to renegotiate. The paymaster calls the shots as always and in this case the two biggest are Germany and the UK.

You must have had a more successful business career than me. I seem to remember that many more potential deals that I was involved in were unsuccessful than were rescued at the last minute. The last minute agreements were the exception rather than the rule. Sometimes when both sides are miles apart it’s just not possible to reach an agreement.

 

[BobKowalski]

Yeah that's the way I see it. True to form, lots of bluster and bullshit that comes back to bite him.

Merkel probably couldn't believe her luck, he hasn't even dealt with Macron yet who's the more machiavellian of the two, wonder what he'll give away there?

The Channel Islands.

He met Macron earlier this afternoon. Lots of good cheer as Macron, like Merkel, passed Johnson the no deal rubiks cube to play with for the next 30 days.

We seem to be a long way from demanding that the backstop be ripped out of the WA as a pre condition for talks but hey what do I know.

 

[BlueHammer85]

Back on!
Now, for the love of god - any handbags take it to PM.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

If you actually listen to what was said by Merkel, Macron and Boris rather than how it's reported it's pretty clear we are headed towards tweaking the backstop provisions in the existing WA enough to get it through parliament by 31 Oct. BJ gets to look like the man with corbyn, Swainson and the brexit party left open mouthed clutching their balls and sounding irrelevant. BJ then calls a GE which he'll win and subject us to another fixed term of tory rule :-(

 

[George Hannah]

If you actually listen to what was said by Merkel, Macron and Boris rather than how it's reported it's pretty clear we are headed towards tweaking the backstop provisions in the existing WA enough to get it through parliament by 31 Oct. BJ gets to look like the man with corbyn, Swainson and the brexit party left open mouthed clutching their balls and sounding irrelevant. BJ then calls a GE which he'll win and subject us to another fixed term of tory rule :-(

Not sure what Swinson will be clutching in that scenario :)

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

You must have had a more successful business career than me. I seem to remember that many more potential deals that I was involved in were unsuccessful than were rescued at the last minute. The last minute agreements were the exception rather than the rule. Sometimes when both sides are miles apart it’s just not possible to reach an agreement.

Miles apart in name only, but very close when it comes to massive mutual benefit.

 

[BobKowalski]

If you actually listen to what was said by Merkel, Macron and Boris rather than how it's reported it's pretty clear we are headed towards tweaking the backstop provisions in the existing WA enough to get it through parliament by 31 Oct. BJ gets to look like the man with corbyn, Swainson and the brexit party left open mouthed clutching their balls and sounding irrelevant. BJ then calls a GE which he'll win and subject us to another fixed term of tory rule :-(

Who is going to vote for it to get through Parliament?

Whether the vote fails or succeeds The Brexit Party will scream betrayal, because any deal is betrayal now, and target the Tories and the LibDems will target pissed off Remain voters in Tory seats.

 

[blueish swede]

Pretty obvious to anyone who has been arround the block and worked in business that this is going to be the end result. Could have been done earlier had May and her civil servants had any experience in negotiating or the desire for Brexit. Those panicking and peddling project fear like the BBC and the lib dems and the fickle labour party are actually playing into the UKs gov hands by making it look more likley that we are prepared to go the whole mile. It's only a matter of time before Merkel tells the EU leaders to renegotiate. The paymaster calls the shots as always and in this case the two biggest are Germany and the UK.

Are you not prepared to entertain the idea that the backstop is the worst possible deal, apart from all the others?

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Who is going to vote for it to get through Parliament?

Whether the vote fails or succeeds The Brexit Party will scream betrayal, because any deal is betrayal now, and target the Tories and the LibDems will target pissed off Remain voters in Tory seats.

Mate, the brexit party become irrelevant as soon as a WA passes just like ukip did after the referendum. The lib dems then also find themselves just as irrelevant after having styled themselves as a single issue remain party. The pissed off folk have largely already defected to change / brexit /lib dems.
To answer your question, once the backstop is tweaked/ removed the parliamentary arithmetic should see it home and dry, although it will of course still be too Brexity for some and not Brexity enough for others - but they are the extremists at both ends of the argument.

 

[Metal Biker]

Not sure what Swinson will be clutching in that scenario :)

Well they won't be made of paper or plastic, that's for sure.

 

[Fred_Quimby]

Just asking.

How can we take control of our borders if we don't have a hard border? Boris has said that it will not be the UK who puts up a border. How do we stop all these criminals from coming in?

Just asking.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Just asking.

How can we take control of our borders if we don't have a hard border? Boris has said that it will not be the UK who puts up a border. How do we stop all these criminals from coming in?

Just asking.

I think it's more politically correct to describe them as immigrants tbh. The answer is we won't stop them, never have and never will

 

[Ban-jani]

I think it's more politically correct to describe them as immigrants tbh. The answer is we won't stop them, never have and never will

So let’s stay in the Single Market and align our customs to the EU as Norway do.

We can reap the benefits of membership and won’t be politically tied to the EU.

We can strike trade deals where we want and if immigration isn’t a problem, who cares ?

 

[Fred_Quimby]

So let’s stay in the Single Market and align our customs to the EU as Norway do.

We can reap the benefits of membership and won’t be politically tied to the EU.

We can strike trade deals where we want and if immigration isn’t a problem, who cares ?

But leaving with no deal will mean we won't have a deal like Norway. Will we?

 

[BobKowalski]

Mate, the brexit party become irrelevant as soon as a WA passes just like ukip did after the referendum. The lib dems then also find themselves just as irrelevant after having styled themselves as a single issue remain party. The pissed off folk have largely already defected to change / brexit /lib dems.

No the BP won’t become irrelevant. The WA is seen as a betrayal of Brexit. It’s ‘vassalage’ as we remain within the EU area during transition and accept EU rules without any say. Hardcore ERG Tories say the same thing. Pass the WA and BP will campaign on ‘you can’t trust a Tory’. LibDems will campaign on the same thing as ‘this is worse than remaining’.

So who in Parliament is going to vote for the WA tweaked or otherwise? The DUP? Nope. ERG Tories? No chance. A handful of northern Labour MPs may back a right wing Johnson Govt but on the whole they hate Johnson more than they did May. This Govt has no effective majority so how the hell is it going to pass anything let alone the WA?

 

[Blue Hefner]

I think it's more politically correct to describe them as immigrants tbh. The answer is we won't stop them, never have and never will

It is factually correct to call them immigrants unless, of course, they have been convicted of a crime. Also, why don't we just call them 'people'?

 

[Metal Biker]

I think it's more politically correct to describe them as immigrants tbh. The answer is we won't stop them, never have and never will

And aside from a very minimal few in society with some rather...misguided views, we don't want to.

 

[Metal Biker]

It is factually correct to call them immigrants unless, of course, they have been convicted of a crime. Also, why don't we just call them 'people'?

Because that's not their political status.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

No the BP won’t become irrelevant. The WA is seen as a betrayal of Brexit. It’s ‘vassalage’ as we remain within the EU area during transition and accept EU rules without any say. Hardcore ERG Tories say the same thing. Pass the WA and BP will campaign on ‘you can’t trust a Tory’. LibDems will campaign on the same thing as ‘this is worse than remaining’.

So who in Parliament is going to vote for the WA tweaked or otherwise? The DUP? Nope. ERG Tories? No chance. A handful of northern Labour MPs may back a right wing Johnson Govt but on the whole they hate Johnson more than they did May. This Govt has no effective majority so how the hell is it going to pass anything let alone the WA?

Just to be clear,I'm only saying what I think, not stating it as a fact. It's pretty funny that everyone in the UK is getting their knickers in a twist about 'no deal' apparently. It'll be even more funny to see the mental gymnastics performed by the same if BJ comes back with one.