Which is all fine, well and good.Because the larger party has the biggest say. If we were a small farm trying to sell to Tesco’s, it would be Tesco’s dictating the terms. By ourselves we’re the small farm trying to sell to Tesco’s. As part of the EU, our small farm is in an alliance with lots of others and would get a much better deal.
Not sure what you mean about the same aspect but the match is about to kick off so I’ll leave it there.Which is all fine, well and good.
Do something about the politicisation and you'll have me onboard. They aren't, so I want out, and instead find the same aspect across the pond.
So why have the majority of our MP's not voted in favour of it, if that's all there is to it?
You know full well there could be (could have been) compromise. Most on here would compromise around your EFTA - but there is no chance of that compromise being acceptable to at least half of Leavers. Don't pretend otherwise; it's tedious.So we need to come to a compromise, don't we. As we've* agreed this is the best way forward.
*basis this on recent, previous exchanges about compromising between us both
I think half of leavers would accept it, just as long as it wasn’t subject to a second referendumYou know full well there could be (could have been) compromise. Most on here would compromise around your EFTA - but there is no chance of that compromise being acceptable to at least half of Leavers. Don't pretend otherwise; it's tedious.
Leavers, compromisers. EFTA has always been the way forward, IMO. I've advocated it since day one.I think half of leavers would accept it, just as long as it wasn’t subject to a second referendum
EFTA/EEA would be most Remainers acceptable second choice but it would only be acceptable at all to 10-20% of Leavers. Two thirds of leavers want no deal at all costs which will be their undoing. Leavers are shit scared of a second ref because they know what would happen, and we couldn’t possibly be given the opportunity to think again three and a half years after the decision was made before we knew the consequences.I think half of leavers would accept it, just as long as it wasn’t subject to a second referendum
Johnson, the ERG and the right wing press are a million miles from seeing that light.Leavers, compromisers. EFTA has always been the way forward, IMO. I've advocated it since day one.
3 years on and others are beginning to see the light.
I personally don't feel that it's as high as two thirds, not now.EFTA/EEA would be most Remainers acceptable second choice but it would only be acceptable at all to 10-20% of Leavers. Two thirds of leavers want no deal at all costs which will be their undoing. Leavers are shit scared of a second ref because they know what would happen, and we couldn’t possibly be given the opportunity to think again three and a half years after the decision was made before we knew the consequences.
But you're happy to force me and others to accept being in a union we don't want to be a part of?
How very pragmatic of you.
What's becoming a joke is the sheer childish, tantrum-throwing rhetoric from remainers who refuse to listen to anyone's opinions on the matter. You expect everyone to conform to what you want. No-one takes you seriously anymore; the adults are trying to reach a compromise whilst you sit in the corner shouting "but I wanted ice cream!"
I'd accept a Norway deal, a Switzerland deal, an EFTA membership deal, a Canada style deal. "My people"? Sorry, but anyone who's not willing to accept a compromise isn't "my people". You need to become more aware of current events.
Remainers refusing to accept brexit, is what has made brexit what it is.
Two thirds of leavers is one third of the electorate which is exactly Johnson’s support. Add in Farage’s support and subtract the deluded Tories who actually believe Johnson’s looking for a deal and support that, you’re back at a third of the electorate or two thirds of leavers.I personally don't feel that it's as high as two thirds, not now.
Most just want brexit concluded. Along with the numbers of remainers also wanting brexit concluded, and EFTA/EEA leave arrangement would be supported by the majority of the British public, and the "remoaners" and "brexshitters" (as they have been reduced to as mere insults) would make up the minority of desenters.
Fortunately they make up less than 1/4 of MP's.Johnson, the ERG and the right wing press are a million miles from seeing that light.
But you add in the remainers who support leaving in order to preserve democracy, and you have your majority.Two thirds of leavers is one third of the electorate which is exactly Johnson’s support. Add in Farage’s support and subtract the deluded Tories who actually believe Johnson’s looking for a deal and support that, you’re back at a third of the electorate or two thirds of leavers.
And in fairness, my initial response was to this statement by NevilleK who stated:
I simply said that to me, "that's not very democratic". You can hate refs, fail to see their importance or significance, but advocating we never have one again? Not down for that. I also couldn't fail to see the hypocrisy that once we hold a final ever referendum on leaving the EU, we should never have any more.
I'd laugh at what the suggestion should be if the result was exactly the same... "okay... so we hold ONE MORE referendum and THEN not have any more!"
Ha, so do you! More so in fact!You are happy to shit on your Brexit brothers, so you have no credibility.
Ha, so do you!
Claiming I have no credibility, then admitting you have no credibility.I don't have any Brexit brothers.
I have said, I think the whole thing is out of order & wrong. I think its time that the inetelligent ones amongst you just admit it.
Whether you want to leave the EU or not, the whole thing was a fuckup from day one, & you are now trying to suggest ways to rescue it.
If there was ever to be a referendum then, it should have been first of all, be thought out, how it was worded & how it could be carried out, without any misunderstanding or ambiguity.
But a deal that is basically EFTA/EEA was fairly well understood before the first referendum. It was widely discussed as a potential outcome of a leave vote. There’s no real justification for a second referendum on an EFTA /EEA Deal on the grounds that it wasn’t understood before the referendum. The only justification for a second referendum is if it’s No Deal or a deal that’s so off the wall that it couldn’t have been foreseen in 2016.EFTA/EEA would be most Remainers acceptable second choice but it would only be acceptable at all to 10-20% of Leavers. Two thirds of leavers want no deal at all costs which will be their undoing. Leavers are shit scared of a second ref because they know what would happen, and we couldn’t possibly be given the opportunity to think again three and a half years after the decision was made before we knew the consequences.
Leavers, compromisers. EFTA has always been the way forward, IMO. I've advocated it since day one.
3 years on and others are beginning to see the light.
Don’t disagree but I doubt the majority of Leavers would. After the vote most Remainers including myself had said they’d accept EFTA/EEA but most leavers were saying that it wasn’t really leaving and were rejecting it outright.But a deal that is basically EFTA/EEA was fairly well understood before the first referendum. It was widely discussed as a potential outcome of a leave vote. There’s no real justification for a second referendum on an EFTA /EEA Deal on the grounds that it wasn’t understood before the referendum. The only justification for a second referendum is if it’s No Deal or a deal that’s so off the wall that it couldn’t have been foreseen in 2016.