Another new Brexit thread

[blueinsa]

i'm a blue aswell when you play spurs and Liverpool you piece of shit.

Fucking glory hunters!

 

[BlueHammer85]

It appears Johnson has thrown in the towel on his do or die promise and accepted the delay

The Conservative Party has produced leaflets appearing to show that https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...s-deal-latest-tory-leaflet-leak-a9156711.htmlJohnson has accepted Brexit may be delayed until after 31 October.

The flyers, made available to activists last week, warn voters that supporting the Brexit Party would mean "more delay" because the party "can't deliver Brexit".

The wording suggests that the Tories expect Brexit may not have happened when the leaflets are distributed, despite Mr Johnson having repeatedly vowed to take the UK out of the EU by the end of October "do or die".


Maybe its about time he stopped them adverts too now on Brexit having spaffed £100 millions up the wall on a deadline he was never ever going to meet. If the opposition has any sense it will hang him out to dry and then make him call the vote or they call the no confidence on the 31st October just to rub his snout in it.

Those advert are so pointless - 'Prepare yourself for 31st Oct , you may need to fill out extra forms ' etc etc

Costly bollox

 

[mcfc1632]

well said.
His writing style is so off putting to read that I drift off and give up after a couple of paragraphs - it’s really not that I’m anti his views, as I take great interest in Metal Bikers leave views and others. But with him, it’s hard to work out if he’s just a WUM or not, either way he at times has ruined this thread with his catching up on everyone’s posts and tedious responses.

Then why not just take my and @Ric advice then

Place me on ignore - it is not difficult and is a solution in your own hands - it is the action advised in the COCs

I try to be careful to keep the right side of the CoCs - even when some posters are deliberately seeking to provoke personal arguments with a plethora of gratuitous snide posts. Such people have also been invited to put me on ignore and/or take interactions to PM.

All I can take from this is that people continuing to have Leaver views are simply unwelcome.

If you had any genuine desire to debate you could do...

If you find my posts not worth bothering with - then an option is to ignore - all in your own hands

Logically - given that every single one of your posts relating to me seem to be of a similar carping vein as this one - I assume that you are just part of the drive to stop Leavers expressing their views.

Given that putting me on ignore would address all the points you raise - that you have not logically suggests that you have no defence to this assumption

And to think that people accuse me of whinging - when I am only ever responding to stuff like this

 

[AlexWilliamsGloves]

Just been contemplating these last couple of days on the extent to which posters eulogise about the position and attitude of Ireland in all this Brexit shambles - it all seemingly paints Ireland as the 'plucky victims' of a crime/disaster that is not of their making etc. etc.

Whilst, on the one hand, I have some understanding and acceptance of this - there is also a large amount of naivety and lack of understanding of the motivations evidenced in what people post. This is especially true in their readiness to see the UK locked in an unfettered backstop, which Ireland will unilaterally control the release mechanisms for and the design of which is only partly driven by the border issues.

Of course Varadkar, on behalf of Ireland, is desperate to secure a deal that has as much of the unfettered backstop in it as possible - and, failing that, can still ensure that the EU can impose regulatory controls on the sorts of key policies such as Corporation Tax levels. Before the 2008 crash and since, Ireland has enjoyed a boom - but Varadkar knows that this could become something of a bust, or at least a significant drop in momentum, if things do not fall right for them with regards to controls over a post-Brexit UK.

It is interesting that Ireland's GDP per head rate has been double that of the UK over the last decade or so and 3 times that of the Eurozone average. It stands only 2nd - behind Luxembourg - now what is the financial miracles that those 2 nations enjoy that is different to others?

Ireland's 'onshore' economic sectors such as agriculture are not driving this growth - it is their 'offshore' sectors - including large flows of revenue into and through Ireland that have boomed and fuelled the long period of high growth.

Of course a couple of years ago Brexit would have had Ireland licking its economic lips - with every expectation that it could be a major benefactor of transfers from the UK - but all that 'hope and aspiration' could sink to 'angst and despair' if the UK is 'free' to set its own policies on such matters as Corporation Tax.

This is because Ireland uses a series of structures to provide a 'flag of convenience' for international companies to dog-leg revenues and profits through Ireland that relate to economic activities primarily in other EU Member States, but also in non-EU countries as well. Whilst Ireland significantly benefits - this is mainly to the detriment of Germany, France and the UK.

When providing the bailout in 2008 - 'a grip' was taken on Ireland (by Germany and France) with regards levels of Corporation Tax, but the country is still able to present themselves as an attractive place for large companies to establish their EU headquarters for non-EU businesses, and to attract EU-wide revenues into Ireland while leaving the costs in other Member States.

Ireland are in a good place - along with Merkel, as evidenced by her recent pronouncements, they would not want to see a truly independent UK just off its shores. The robustness of the WA negotiations have the GFA and associated border issues somewhere near their heart - but there are other driving forces that should attract less eulogising.

Just some musings to counter the flow of sentiment on here that I would summarise as:

UK = big bad bully and generally bad

Ireland = innocent victim and all-round to be admired and pandered to

I have said on a number of occasions that anyone in the UK that supports a WA with an unfettered backstop - whether either through ignorance of its consequences or just pig-headed anti-Brexit sentiments - is actually supporting damage to the future health of the UK. This as always been another of those 'inconvenient truths' (aka facts)

 

[mcfc1632]

It appears Johnson has thrown in the towel on his do or die promise and accepted the delay

The Conservative Party has produced leaflets appearing to show that https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...s-deal-latest-tory-leaflet-leak-a9156711.htmlJohnson has accepted Brexit may be delayed until after 31 October.

The flyers, made available to activists last week, warn voters that supporting the Brexit Party would mean "more delay" because the party "can't deliver Brexit".

The wording suggests that the Tories expect Brexit may not have happened when the leaflets are distributed, despite Mr Johnson having repeatedly vowed to take the UK out of the EU by the end of October "do or die".


Maybe its about time he stopped them adverts too now on Brexit having spaffed £100 millions up the wall on a deadline he was never ever going to meet. If the opposition has any sense it will hang him out to dry and then make him call the vote or they call the no confidence on the 31st October just to rub his snout in it.

He is intending that it will be delayed - not stopped - so stopping the communications activity would be a bit silly - just needs to be amended along the lines that - due to the machinations of the sycophants at Westminster, I have today reluctantly...…….

If he can get to a GE without a referendum being confirmed (I doubt it) then that unfolding events will play well to the voters - not most on here obviously

 

[blueparrot]

In well over 10k posts on here I've never used the ignore feature once. Finally made an exception. This thread has about half as many posts and sometimes the carry on doesn't make quite as much sense, but it's undeniably better. If I had to read "Bit behind so just catching up" one more fucking time I was going to lose it. Felt like you ended up reading the thread twice. Tedious enough reading the fucker once!

He the only one I’ve ever put on ignore, wonder how many don't even see his lectures. Though sometime wish I could exclude myself from the thread.

 

[journolud]

Then why not just take my and @Ric advice then

Place me on ignore - it is not difficult and is a solution in your own hands - it is the action advised in the COCs

I try to be careful to keep the right side of the CoCs - even when some posters are deliberately seeking to provoke personal arguments with a plethora of gratuitous snide posts. Such people have also been invited to put me on ignore and/or take interactions to PM.

All I can take from this is that people continuing to have Leaver views is simply unwelcome.

If you had any genuine desire to debate you could do - if you find my posts not worth bothering then an option is to ignore - all in your own hands

Logically - given that everyone of your posts relating to me seem to be of a similar carping vein as this one - I assume that you are just part of the drive to stop Leavers expressing their views.

Given that putting me on ignore would address all the points you raise - then you have not logically defence to this assumption

And to think that people accuse me of whinging - when I am only ever responding to stuff like this

So despite him specifically saying that he takes interest in the leave views of Metal Biker among others the only thing you can take from his post is that he is against leavers expressing their views. You haven't really given it much critical thought have you?

Bad post

 

[mcfc1632]

In well over 10k posts on here I've never used the ignore feature once. Finally made an exception. This thread has about half as many posts and sometimes the carry on doesn't make quite as much sense, but it's undeniably better. If I had to read "Bit behind so just catching up" one more fucking time I was going to lose it. Felt like you ended up reading the thread twice. Tedious enough reading the fucker once!

Well said - you have explained the benefit well

Others are free to take your advice - in fact there is no sensible reason for them not to and would save myself the need to read all their whinging and themselves being bothered by me.

I also get tempted to do the same

As I say - it just seems that an echo chamber is what is sought on here by Remainers - and people that point out inconvenient truths are not welcomed​

 

[mcfc1632]

So despite him specifically saying that he takes interest in the leave views of Metal Biker among others the only thing you can take from his post is that he is against leavers expressing their views. You haven't really given it much critical thought have you?

Bad post

Yep - I have

 

[journolud]

Yep - I have

Good post blah blah sycophants blah inconvenient truths blah blah

 

[mat]

The media will portray the PM as the victim of a parliament he'll bent on remain thus depriving him of his leave date. When in reality the bullshitting **** got caught out for the Nth time and the sooner he's fucked off the better.

 

[blueinsa]

The media will portray the PM as the victim of a parliament he'll bent on remain thus depriving him of his leave date. When in reality the bullshitting **** got caught out for the Nth time and the sooner he's fucked off the better.

The media will be correct.

Weeks of we must stop no deal and now its we will reject any deal.

Lying fuckers is what they are.

Roll on the GE.

 

[journolud]

The media will be correct.

Weeks of we must stop no deal and now its we will reject any deal.

Lying fuckers is what they are.

Roll on the GE.

You're not the first person to suggest that ny deal that gets agreed (still looks a big if) will be rejected just seemingly for the sake of it but I honestly haven't seen anything to back that assertion up. So how do you come to that conclusion? Is there a reliable source of the information?

 

[west didsblue]

The media will be correct.

Weeks of we must stop no deal and now its we will reject any deal.

Lying fuckers is what they are.

Roll on the GE.

I knew you were a Tory all along.
Or is Uncle Nige your man?

 

[blueinsa]

You're not the first person to suggest that ny deal that gets agreed (still looks a big if) will be rejected just seemingly for the sake of it but I honestly haven't seen anything to back that assertion up. So how do you come to that conclusion? Is there a reliable source of the information?

Watch the news mate.

SNP, Lib Dems, Plaid Cymru and lots on the labour side whipped by Corbyn and his front bench have said they will vote against any deal that comes back this week.

That's how anti no deal they are.

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

Just been contemplating these last couple of days on the extent to which posters eulogise about the position and attitude of Ireland in all this Brexit shambles - it all seemingly paints Ireland as the 'plucky victims' of a crime/disaster that is not of their making etc. etc.

Whilst, on the one hand, I have some understanding and acceptance of this - there is also a large amount of naivety and lack of understanding of the motivations evidenced in what people post. This is especially true in their readiness to see the UK locked in an unfettered backstop, which Ireland will unilaterally control the release mechanisms for and the design of which is only partly driven by the border issues.

Of course Varadkar, on behalf of Ireland, is desperate to secure a deal that has as much of the unfettered backstop in it as possible - and, failing that, can still ensure that the EU can impose regulatory controls on the sorts of key policies such as Corporation Tax levels. Before the 2008 crash and since, Ireland has enjoyed a boom - but Varadkar knows that this could become something of a bust, or at least a significant drop in momentum, if things do not fall right for them with regards to controls over a post-Brexit UK.

It is interesting that Ireland's GDP per head rate has been double that of the UK over the last decade or so and 3 times that of the Eurozone average. It stands only 2nd - behind Luxembourg - now what is the financial miracles that those 2 nations enjoy that is different to others?

Ireland's 'onshore' economic sectors such as agriculture are not driving this growth - it is their 'offshore' sectors - including large flows of revenue into and through Ireland that have boomed and fuelled the long period of high growth.

Of course a couple of years ago Brexit would have had Ireland licking its economic lips - with every expectation that it could be a major benefactor of transfers from the UK - but all that 'hope and aspiration' could sink to 'angst and despair' if the UK is 'free' to set its own policies on such matters as Corporation Tax.

This is because Ireland uses a series of structures to provide a 'flag of convenience' for international companies to dog-leg revenues and profits through Ireland that relate to economic activities primarily in other EU Member States, but also in non-EU countries as well. Whilst Ireland significantly benefits - this is mainly to the detriment of Germany, France and the UK.

When providing the bailout in 2008 - 'a grip' was taken on Ireland (by Germany and France) with regards levels of Corporation Tax, but the country is still able to present themselves as an attractive place for large companies to establish their EU headquarters for non-EU businesses, and to attract EU-wide revenues into Ireland while leaving the costs in other Member States.

Ireland are in a good place - along with Merkel, as evidenced by her recent pronouncements, they would not want to see a truly independent UK just off its shores. The robustness of the WA negotiations have the GFA and associated border issues somewhere near their heart - but there are other driving forces that should attract less eulogising.

Just some musings to counter the flow of sentiment on here that I would summarise as:

UK = big bad bully and generally bad

Ireland = innocent victim and all-round to be admired and pandered to

I have said on a number of occasions that anyone in the UK that supports a WA with an unfettered backstop - whether either through ignorance of its consequences or just pig-headed anti-Brexit sentiments - is actually supporting damage to the future health of the UK. This as always been another of those 'inconvenient truths' (aka facts)

 

[blueinsa]

I knew you were a Tory all along.
Or is Uncle Nige your man?

Firmly on the side of the government as they try to get brexit done.

Firmly on the side of respecting and enacting a winning democratic vote.

Not made up my mind who I will vote for yet but Labour under Corbyn is a no and much will depend on if we have left or not.

If not I will vote either Tory or BP dependant on what works best where I live and if we have I will probably vote for an independent.

 

[west didsblue]

Watch the news mate.

SNP, Lib Dems, Plaid Cymru and lots on the labour side whipped by Corbyn and his front bench have said they will vote against any deal that comes back this week.

That's how anti no deal they are.

Maybe they can see a route to a EEA/EFTA Brexit rather than a shit deal that totally fucks the economy of Great Britain whilst guaranteeing a breakup of the UK.

 

[bluejon]

Maybe they can see a route to a EEA/EFTA Brexit rather than a shit deal that totally fucks the economy of Great Britain whilst guaranteeing a breakup of the UK.

Leave means leave, out means out, dave means dave. The ultra brexit lot don't care about the details of an exit, any exit will satisfy them, even if it ends up fucking everything up. I believe the correct description is 'zealots'.

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

Maybe they can see a route to a EEA/EFTA Brexit rather than a shit deal that totally fucks the economy of Great Britain whilst guaranteeing a breakup of the UK.

Or maybe it is more simple than that. They just dont trust Boris Johnson and will not enable him to do anything. Or maybe its just principle - he's a lying **** so why help him out of teh corner he backed himself into.