Another new Brexit thread

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Mëtal Bikër said:
So it's all good then, yeah.

Sounds like the ERG aren't as boisterous about opposing it either.
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That’s because they’re desperate now too.

They probably see this as the only chance the island of Great Britain will be outside of the CU and SM.

NI was never too much of a worry to those on the right wing side of the Brexit debate, they have never given a fuck.
 
On the BBC ticker, it is being reported that the Secretary of State has told the Brexit committee workers rights to a level playing field will no longer apply. As part of the post-Brexit future relationship between the UK and the EU, both parties were expected to mutually agree minimum standards for employment protections. This would have comprised part of a ‘level playing field’ for future trade. Both sides of the negotiations had their own reasons for negotiating an agreement on employment protections. In the EU, there were fears that without common minimum standards the UK would be tempted to deregulate its employment legislation in order to gain a competitive advantage over EU member states.

Looks like Johnson is so desperate to get the hard right ERG on board he is willing to sacrifice the protections enjoyed by the working class.

I wonder if the halfwit even realises what that means, the man is so desperate he is risking everything on the ERG just to stay in power. This was never about Brexit and what was for the good of the nation, it was about him, power and basking in glory. It is a shame the working class as per normal will pay the heaviest price for one man's vanity.

If any Labour MP votes for a deal that does this to the working class then surely they are finished for good.

Rule fucking Britannia no more, welcome to Singapore on Thames, the new ultra neo-liberal dream world of the Capitalist class.
 
Rascal said:
On the BBC ticker, it is being reported that the Secretary of State has told the Brexit committee workers rights to a level playing field will no longer apply. As part of the post-Brexit future relationship between the UK and the EU, both parties were expected to mutually agree minimum standards for employment protections. This would have comprised part of a ‘level playing field’ for future trade. Both sides of the negotiations had their own reasons for negotiating an agreement on employment protections. In the EU, there were fears that without common minimum standards the UK would be tempted to deregulate its employment legislation in order to gain a competitive advantage over EU member states.

Looks like Johnson is so desperate to get the hard right ERG on board he is willing to sacrifice the protections enjoyed by the working class.

I wonder if the halfwit even realises what that means, the man is so desperate he is risking everything on the ERG just to stay in power. This was never about Brexit and what was for the good of the nation, it was about him, power and basking in glory. It is a shame the working class as per normal will pay the heaviest price for one man's vanity.

If any Labour MP votes for a deal that does this to the working class then surely they are finished for good.

Rule fucking Britannia no more, welcome to Singapore on Thames, the new ultra neo-liberal dream world of the Capitalist class.
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Stevie K 'll vote for it.
 
Hesperus said:
Macron has just announced the he believes the deal is about to be agreed. If he’s saying it, I think it’s very likely. It just needs to get passed by the ERG and the DUP now.
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The EU agreed a deal 4 months ago. Still didn't happen.

The ERG are shitting themselves now. Whatever the pros and cons of a planned no deal brexit, crashing out will be a shit storm of biblical proportions for the UK.
Johnson has managed unprecidented feat of painting himself into two corners at once: the 31/10 deadline and an expected general election. An election called after a crash out could coincide with peak disruption at Calais, peak layoffs, and peak shortages. Can't be many Tories who would fancy their chances with that scenario.

The DUP are nutters. Who knows what they'll do.

 
More background from the Guardian. Interesting stuff.

Michel Barnier told EU27 ambassadors important progress had been made on Brexit, but two sides not there yet.

Boris Johnson has made three big concessions to make this possible, but EU fears parliament could still block. EU27 have not seen the text. Time is running out.
1.
Concession No1. (most surprising)
The Level Playing Field is back. Boris Johnson has agreed that the UK must be in line with EU norms on climate, environment and workers’ rights for a Free Trade Agreement.
2.
Michel Barnier has always said UK’s proximity and size means LFP was much more important than distant countries such as Canada and Korea. EU diplomats had fretted about Singapore on Thames. Tonight MB told them he had guarantees for fair competition for an FTA
3.
Political Declaration will state goal for zero tariffs and unlimited quotas. Not clear if EU still intends to tie zero tariffs to fishing rights (as stated in a previous document). Fishing remains a big issue for Macron - he once said it was a “lever” in rest of talks.
4.
Concession No 2 (on the cards) Back to Northern Ireland only backstop. It’s not called the NI-only backstop, but the proposal of February 2018 (i.e. when EU suggested it). UK has accepted NI will be subject to EU customs rules and oversight of EU authorities, including ECJ.
5.
But EU has moved on original NI-only backstop. This is Schrödinger’s customs union, NI legally in UK C-U, practically in EU. So NI businesses can claim refunds on tariff differences. i.e Johnson can claim NI will benefit from post-Brexit trade deals.
7.
Concession No 3 Consent.
Boris Johnson has abandoned DUP veto. New system envisages allowing Stormont Assembly to vote whether rebranded backstop applies by simple majority of those present in chamber. First vote scheduled 4 years after entry into force.
 
BobKowalski said:
More background from the Guardian. Interesting stuff.

Michel Barnier told EU27 ambassadors important progress had been made on Brexit, but two sides not there yet.

Boris Johnson has made three big concessions to make this possible, but EU fears parliament could still block. EU27 have not seen the text. Time is running out.
1.
Concession No1. (most surprising)
The Level Playing Field is back. Boris Johnson has agreed that the UK must be in line with EU norms on climate, environment and workers’ rights for a Free Trade Agreement.
2.
Michel Barnier has always said UK’s proximity and size means LFP was much more important than distant countries such as Canada and Korea. EU diplomats had fretted about Singapore on Thames. Tonight MB told them he had guarantees for fair competition for an FTA
3.
Political Declaration will state goal for zero tariffs and unlimited quotas. Not clear if EU still intends to tie zero tariffs to fishing rights (as stated in a previous document). Fishing remains a big issue for Macron - he once said it was a “lever” in rest of talks.
4.
Concession No 2 (on the cards) Back to Northern Ireland only backstop. It’s not called the NI-only backstop, but the proposal of February 2018 (i.e. when EU suggested it). UK has accepted NI will be subject to EU customs rules and oversight of EU authorities, including ECJ.
5.
But EU has moved on original NI-only backstop. This is Schrödinger’s customs union, NI legally in UK C-U, practically in EU. So NI businesses can claim refunds on tariff differences. i.e Johnson can claim NI will benefit from post-Brexit trade deals.
7.
Concession No 3 Consent.
Boris Johnson has abandoned DUP veto. New system envisages allowing Stormont Assembly to vote whether rebranded backstop applies by simple majority of those present in chamber. First vote scheduled 4 years after entry into force.
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I said no such thing!
 
If Johnson gets his shit deal agreed by the EU, and there’s no reason he shouldn’t given that he’s effectively trading NI for a GB hard Brexit, I hope it gets full parliamentary support as long as there’s an amendment to enable a confirmatory referendum, which would clearly be the democratic thing to do. That referendum would need a majority in both GB and NI as it directly affects NI’s status as an equal member of the UK.
If he can’t get it agreed, the logical thing would be to go back to May’s shit deal with the same amendment for a confirmatory vote. No need for separate NI and GB results for this one as NI would retain the same status as GB due to May actually sticking to her principles (can’t believe I’ve said that!).
Either deal would sail through Parliament if that happened.
 
west didsblue said:
If Johnson gets his shit deal agreed by the EU, and there’s no reason he shouldn’t given that he’s effectively trading NI for a GB hard Brexit, I hope it gets full parliamentary support as long as there’s an amendment to enable a confirmatory referendum, which would clearly be the democratic thing to do. That referendum would need a majority in both GB and NI as it directly affects NI’s status as an equal member of the UK.
If he can’t get it agreed, the logical thing would be to go back to May’s shit deal with the same amendment for a confirmatory vote. No need for separate NI and GB results for this one as NI would retain the same status as GB due to May actually sticking to her principles (can’t believe I’ve said that!).
Either deal would sail through Parliament if that happened.
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Sounds more than fair.
 
Let’s try and keep it more civil after last night’s nonsense. Getting back on track:
 
Ric said:
Let’s try and keep it more civil after last night’s nonsense. Getting back on track:
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Thanks for the thread back and a nice early negative breakfast story for your like minded remainers to feast on ;-)

Shall I respond or will it be seen as argumentative and the post deleted?

Genuine question because i saw no arguments last night just debate but as usual, its seemingly not allowed the second remain views are challenged Ric?
 
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