General Election - December 12th, 2019

[Chippy_boy]

I agree about the BP, their voters are starting to realise that voting for them now is pointless in many areas, so the
support is falling off. Where it gets interesting is the North, there are seats that have never been Tory, so their influence
there may make an impact, but I doubt it, if the Tory canvassers convince them that they won't get Brexit by voting for them.
Some will still vote for the BP, but I heard today they're only standing in 46 out of 75 seats in the North West, (figures may not
be exactly right), which would mean those
who are fiercely Brexit will vote Tory, but hold their nose. I don't think some people are aware of how strong is the disgust at Labour's
shenanigans re Brexit, many folk voted in the referendum for the very first time. When their vote has been stymied, and these
usually politically quiet people get screamed at as being racists, and thick idiots, who didn't know what they were doing,
then these people will be very pissed off indeed.

I think you make a very good point. Millions of people are really not that fussed about politics but came out to vote for the first time ever in the referendum. My brother-in-law being one example - Labour supporting family and background but could never be bothered to vote. He will be voting Tory in December. But to be honest, if it was reversed and the Tories were saying revoke or Ref2, and Labour were saying Brexit, I am sure he'd be voting Labour. He's really not that fussed about which party, he just wants Brexit followed through on.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

For balance.

labour plans for free tier one dental is a brilliant idea.

So much of your general health can be affected by poor dental health and many, myself included in the past have said i couldn't afford to go and suffered because of it.

Excellent idea imo.

Yes, that's a policy you can get your teeth into.

 

[Tb1981]

I think you make a very good point. Millions of people are really not that fussed about politics but came out to vote for the first time ever in the referendum. My brother-in-law being one example - Labour supporting family and background but could never be bothered to vote. He will be voting Tory in December. But to be honest, if it was reversed and the Tories were saying revoke or Ref2, and Labour were saying Brexit, I am sure he'd be voting Labour. He's really not that fussed about which party, he just wants Brexit followed through on.

So the one time they vote they are ignored completely
That’s why apathy generally reigns in those areas

 

[The perfect fumble]

Its called compassion for your fellow human being - but seeing what the Tories have done for those in need in the UK I shouldn't be surprised by their outbursts - thing with it is it is really aimed at those who would already be anti-immigrant anyway so I don't see it benefitting them much at all. They are the Nasty Party v2.0 and are now proud to flaunt it.

They are the nasty party, there is no doubt about that, they've always been the nasty party, their motivations have always been venal.....

But exposing their venality obscures a wider question.

When I was younger there was no debate as to who the Tories and Labour represented. The Tories may be in the grip of the neoliberals these days, but since the decline of the landed gentry, who they represent has remained much the same since the end of the Second World War, the same could not be said of Labour.

In 1964 it was easy, Labour represented them....

Who does Labour represent now?

This isn't about racism, it is about a social contract between Labour and the people, but who are the people Labour represents?

I've heard Corbyn speak and I am enthused by much of what he says, but he's speaking at me not for me, and I'm not alone, and that is why he will lose.

 

[hgblue]

I think you make a very good point. Millions of people are really not that fussed about politics but came out to vote for the first time ever in the referendum. My brother-in-law being one example - Labour supporting family and background but could never be bothered to vote. He will be voting Tory in December. But to be honest, if it was reversed and the Tories were saying revoke or Ref2, and Labour were saying Brexit, I am sure he'd be voting Labour.

I think the Labour Party will be sent a message they won’t forget in a hurry. Taking their Leave voters in the North for granted is going to bite them on the arse.

 

[mexico1970]

I've heard Corbyn speak and I am enthused by much of what he says, but he's speaking at me not for me, and I'm not alone, and that is why he will lose.

In a nutshell bud in a nutshell.

 

[inbetween]

Its not about having a day off its about working an average of 32hrs per week over a given period - say a tax year for example. It can actually allow businesses to manage their workforces better so in say times of surge people could be working 50hrs per week but when its quiet then just a few hours per week. If the work gets done at no extra cost everyone is happy. Ask anyone who works at home what hours they do and when and you will find very diverse hours are worked.

My company has 4500 people on my site - 5 hours lost per week per employee represents 22500 hours lost per week, multiplied by the working year that's over 1 million hours lost.

We already have a flexi scheme so the working life balance would not be affected in any shape or form.

And you also want companies to pay people the same?

Lol.

 

[lancs blue]

If they get insurance yes, like every other country does. Do foreign nationals get free education in other countries too?

Surely if they're working and living in the UK they'll be paying tax and NI so they should be entitled to access public services like the rest of us.

 

[blueinsa]

My company has 4500 people on my site - 5 hours lost per week per employee represents 22500 hours lost per week, multiplied by the working year that's over 1 million hours lost.

We already have a flexi scheme so the working life balance would not be affected in any shape or form.

And you also want companies to pay people the same?

Lol.

It doesnt matter, someone "rich" will be paying for it.

£1 lost from the economy because of brexit and they are apoplectic with rage yet they happily regurgitate policy like this as being the best thing since sliced bread.

 

[mexico1970]

Surely if they're working and living in the UK they'll be paying tax and NI so they should be entitled to access public services like the rest of us.

Not at all, they are still foreign nationals. In other countries you have to buy health insurance and I seriously don't know how education works in other countries. I have had to buy health insurance when I have worked abroad it's not a strange concept.

 

[BobKowalski]

If they get insurance yes, like every other country does. Do foreign nationals get free education in other countries too?

Typically if you get a work visa it means you have arrived to do a job and that visa will provide you with access to Health and Education services but not other benefits. Very often the visa costs will include an annual health surcharge which in a way is a premium for the ‘insurance’ of healthcare. EU nationals don’t require a visa and health is covered by reciprocity. You look after our nationals and we will look after yours. This can also apply to countries outside the EU it just depends on the arrangements between the countries concerned.

We will not attract necessary immigration or people with required skill sets if we say that if you get ill the best we can do is offer you is the recipe for a hot toddy. It’s short sighted and self defeating. Additionally how we treat foreign nationals will be reflected in how other countries treat our nationals.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Post imperialism, class is the single biggest factor in our decline as a country, it has prevented this great nation from utilising the talents of all its citizens.

I could quote you studies that categorically prove this, but you'd not read them, not surprisingly you prefer your class stereotypes and caricatures, which rather proves my point.

Well, post imperialism, this great nation doesn't appear to be doing that badly, why are we declining, and who is doing better?
No doubt this will result in the usual suspects painting Britain as a Dickensian nightmare with ragged starvelings clutching
at the clothes of passing toffs wearing supercilious sneers, but the reality is far different.

 

[lancs blue]

Not at all, they are still foreign nationals. In other countries you have to buy health insurance and I seriously don't know how education works in other countries. I have had to buy health insurance when I have worked abroad it's not a strange concept.

My comment was more about how I want THIS country to work - if a family are resident and paying taxes in the UK they should be entitled to use the NHS regardless of nationality.

 

[mexico1970]

Typically if you get a work visa it means you have arrived to do a job and that visa will provide you with access to Health and Education services but not other benefits. Very often the visa costs will include an annual health surcharge which in a way is a premium for the ‘insurance’ of healthcare. EU nationals don’t require a visa and health is covered by reciprocity. You look after our nationals and we will look after yours. This can also apply to countries outside the EU it just depends on the arrangements between the countries concerned.

We will not attract necessary immigration or people with required skill sets if we say that if you get ill the best we can do is offer you is the recipe for a hot toddy. It’s short sighted and self defeating. Additionally how we treat foreign nationals will be reflected in how other countries treat our nationals.

All I am saying is that we should do what almost every other country does and charge for health services, there's no reason why we shouldn't.

 

[mexico1970]

My comment was more about how I want THIS country to work - if a family are resident and paying taxes in the UK they should be entitled to use the NHS regardless of nationality.

I agree with you, after a certain predetermined time (Say 6 months).

 

[west didsblue]

Well, post imperialism, this great nation doesn't appear to be doing that badly, why are we declining, and who is doing better?
No doubt this will result in the usual suspects painting Britain as a Dickensian nightmare with ragged starvelings clutching
at the clothes of passing toffs wearing supercilious sneers, but the reality is far different.

Not so sure

 

[blueinsa]

I agree with you, after a certain predetermined time (Say 6 months).

No one is refused emergency medical care either might I add, no one.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

I've no issue in a 4 day week per se as i worked 4 on 4 off for years but it has to fit the business and cant be just shoehorned in.

It needs reminding that the plan isn't just for a 4 day week, its for a 32 hour week with no loss of pay.

It isn't going too happen.

Plenty work 4 day weeks, 4x10 hour shifts are popular, I briefly worked them in a chemical factory 20 odd years ago.
What we didn't get, or expect, is the company paying us to do 4x8 hours for the same wage.
It's just another senseless bribe in the hope of votes, to add to the other bagful of freebies that apparently pay for themselves.

 

[blueinsa]

Not so sure

Thank God that wasn't Soubry eh?

You can only imagine the outrage at her being called names.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Not so sure

Did you think the arseholes that screamed obscenities at children are deprived and poverty stricken?