Another new Brexit thread

[AlexWilliamsGloves]

Are you Irish or British bud? Which one comes first?

As we speak, im British

 

[blueparrot]

Are you Irish or British bud? Which one comes first?

Does it matter ?

 

[west didsblue]

Are you Irish or British bud? Which one comes first?

Are you English or British?

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

mcfc1632 said: We have learned over the years:

Irish Nationalism, Scottish Nationalism and EU 'nationalism' = something noble and to be greatly admired

English people showing a bit of care about what happens to them = Something to be decried as 'little Englander' / jingoism
(nothing remotely as strong as deserving the label nationalism)

I have been shocked at how strong these sentiments are on here - and just how much of a desire some people have to run their country down.

A lot of it can be attributed to the dilution of our national culture, why should someone who determines themselves as being of different origin that English give a sod how much the English are denigrated. FOM in particular has been a great tool for the EU to depopulate the main 3 countries of their population by bringing so many more people in who aren't from their cultures, this has a knock on effect of strengthening the EUs hold on those countries because there are less indigenous people in those countries to fight back.

Scottish independence is fine, and let's all stick up for the Irish and the Catalonians, but the English are just little Englanders and we need to sneer at them at any given opportunity, it's no shock to me that those doing the sneering tend to be the people who support Labour, remain and Ironically Harry over the throne.

Reluctant as I am to get drawn into this, as I have stated previously to mcfc1632 I don't see anything wrong with English nationalism or national pride.
I would say own it and take it away from those that give it a bad name. Celebrate it. It doesn't need to be exclusive.
There are differences however between Scottish and Irish nationalism. Scottish and Irish nationalism manifest themselves as wanting to break away from the union...that is the UK, not the EU.
English nationalism seems to want to break from the EU but not the UK.
Regarding the dilution of your national culture? Mexico1970, are you talking of your English culture specifically or are you talking of your British culture?
Because I would say the dilution of your English culture has more to do with your British Empire legacy than anything else.
You colonize half the world and call it British, then don't be surprised that things are going to change culturally when they come home to the motherland.

 

[mexico1970]

Does it matter ?

Of course it does, if someone puts being Irish first above British then don't be surprised if someone English puts themselves above being British.

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

A lot of it can be attributed to the dilution of our national culture, why should someone who determines themselves as being of different origin that English give a sod how much the English are denigrated. FOM in particular has been a great tool for the EU to depopulate the main 3 countries of their population by bringing so many more people in who aren't from their cultures, this has a knock on effect of strengthening the EUs hold on those countries because there are less indigenous people in those countries to fight back.

Scottish independence is fine, and let's all stick up for the Irish and the Catalonians, but the English are just little Englanders and we need to sneer at them at any given opportunity, it's no shock to me that those doing the sneering tend to be the people who support Labour, remain and Ironically Harry over the throne.

You could've expanded more by including a further paragraph on eugenics .....

 

[BobKowalski]

that were many funny things in boris speech today even the way he presented it mainly looking at the ceiling but the line we want a Canada style agreement with the eu but if we can’t get that then we will look toward an Australia type agreement.

in other words in his cogs in his head, Brits like Australia and they want an agreement so if I invent a new phrase jobs a good un and people will think that sounds like a good deal.

Like ‘Australian points system’ for immigration :)

Still good to see we are prioritising entertainment over reality when it comes to Johnson. Comical buffoonery is a much underrated skill set when it comes to the job of PM.

 

[mexico1970]

mcfc1632 said: We have learned over the years:

Irish Nationalism, Scottish Nationalism and EU 'nationalism' = something noble and to be greatly admired

English people showing a bit of care about what happens to them = Something to be decried as 'little Englander' / jingoism
(nothing remotely as strong as deserving the label nationalism)

I have been shocked at how strong these sentiments are on here - and just how much of a desire some people have to run their country down.



Reluctant as I am to get drawn into this, as I have stated previously to mcfc1632 I don't see anything wrong with English nationalism or national pride.
I would say own it and take it away from those that give it a bad name. Celebrate it. It doesn't need to be exclusive.
There are differences however between Scottish and Irish nationalism. Scottish and Irish nationalism manifest themselves as wanting to break away from the union...that is the UK, not the EU.
English nationalism seems to want to break from the EU but not the UK.
Regarding the dilution of your national culture? Mexico1970, are you talking of your English culture specifically or are you talking of your British culture?
Because I would say the dilution of your English culture has more to do with your British Empire legacy than anything else.
You colonize half the world and call it British, then don't be surprised that things are going to change culturally when they come home to the motherland.

Talking about the EU here, we didn't colonise the EU or European countries. The point I am making is in context of the discussion about how English nationalism is sneered at and other nationalistic citizens of other countries get a fist pump.

Why?

 

[joe123]

'Believing Johnson' -lol - 'the reality that ain't changing' - lol The reality is the EU have a £98bn trade surplus with us in goods they want to keep, they'll come to heel you can rely on it. FYI the CETA deal eliminates 98% of all tariffs on goods traded between Canada and the EU and unlike the EU27, Canada is free to strike trade deals with other countries around the world. Japan has broadly similar arrangements. We want the same but extended to include financial services - which might take a while of course.
Noooooooooo - it's *'The Light at the End of the Tunnel - Is the Light of an Oncoming Train' - Half Man Half Biscuit (an uncomprehending Beatles Tribute Group).

I don't want to descend into insults on this thread but that's fucking bollocks. HMHB are not a Beatles tribute band at all. They're fucking fantastic.

 

[AlexWilliamsGloves]

Of course it does, if someone puts being Irish first above British then don't be surprised if someone English puts themselves above being British.

For the record, again...im English..British... but have lived here since 1986...NI is basically being cut off from GB not through a Border Poll or will of the people, but because of English Nationalism

 

[mexico1970]

You could've expanded more by including a further paragraph on eugenics .....

Oh BINGO!

 

[blueparrot]

Of course it does, if someone puts being Irish first above British then don't be surprised if someone English puts themselves above being British.

What does English above British even mean ? Why do you have to define yourself as either. I ‘ve always thought as myself as English, British, European . However living in Scotland when the time comes I’ll decide on whether to vote for independence purely on what I believe is the best for my family and children's future. English or British labels won’t enter my thoughts.

 

[mexico1970]

For the record, again...im English..British... but have lived here since 1986...NI is basically being cut off from GB not through a Border Poll or will of the people, but because of English Nationalism

No it wasn't it was a referendum a lot of people voted in. Have you blamed the Welsh?

 

[mcfc1632]

You’ll have to enlighten me on your posts

I just think they seem to care a bit too much (ie I think they are a tad disingenuous)

I voted out but if remain had won I am pretty sure I would have been gutted for ten minutes and then got on with my life

I agree with you entirely for the vast majority of the more vocal remain posters on here.

Had this been project leave led by Corbyn and labour it would have been the best thing since sliced bread.

Totally an anti anything Tory stance for many of them imo.

This has been completely obvious for 4 years

If a decision to leave the EU had been what was required to get Corbyn into Downing St - the vast majority of the ardent Remainers on here would have been instantly ardent Leavers​

 

[George Hannah]

I don't want to descend into insults on this thread but that's fucking bollocks. HMHB are not a Beatles tribute band at all. They're fucking fantastic.

I know, I was joking, indeed they aren't a BTB and they also are exactly what you said.

 

[AlexWilliamsGloves]

No it wasn't it was a referendum a lot of people voted in. Have you blamed the Welsh?

Come on, noone considers the Welsh....

 

[mexico1970]

What does English above British even mean ? Why do you have to define yourself as either. I ‘ve always thought as myself as English, British, European . However living in Scotland when the time comes I’ll decide on whether to vote for independence purely on what I believe is the best for my family and children's future. English or British labels won’t enter my thoughts.

This is the context of this discussion, it has been said that English nationalism is sneered at whilst the nationalism from other home nations is to be applauded. It's weird how people who don't claim to like nationalists fall apart when they are asked an opinion on let's say Scottish nationalism.

On this thread I have been called a Nazi for stating an opinion why English nationalism gets the stick.

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

This has been completely obvious for 4 years

If a decision to leave the EU had been what was required to get Corbyn into Downing St - the vast majority of the ardent Remainers on here would have been instantly ardent Leavers​

On here maybe. But remaining a member of the EU is universally popular. It polls consistently over 50%. Corbyn is universally un-popular he polls 30% on a very good day.

 

[blueparrot]

This is the context of this discussion, it has been said that English nationalism is sneered at whilst the nationalism from other home nations is to be applauded. It's weird how people who don't claim to like nationalists fall apart when they are asked an opinion on let's say Scottish nationalism.

On this thread I have been called a Nazi for stating an opinion why English nationalism gets the stick.

It’s fairly obvious just look at those that have represented English nationalism going back to the 70s when the English flag and nationalism was misappropriated by the NF, BNP, football hooligans. More recently EDF,. There is a place for English nationalism and IMO an English parliament in Federal UK., but it needs to taken back from the extremists, it needs to stand for something not against things, that’s been something I’ve believed all the way back to the 70s and the old rock against racism days. It’s a long way back for English nationalism to lose that image.

 

[Vic]

This has been completely obvious for 4 years

If a decision to leave the EU had been what was required to get Corbyn into Downing St - the vast majority of the ardent Remainers on here would have been instantly ardent Leavers​

Don't be stupid.