Oh look! In the middle of the COVID crisis a vegan narcissist pops up and makes it all about their issue. There is a vegan thread for your lot to moan on mate go rant to your mates on there.
I’m sorry I’m not having that.
When the rest of the world looks at what you’re doing in disgust, it’s pretty clear you’re the odd one out, when it comes to diet.
Some animals bring disease more than others and are known to do so.
You can’t tell me seafood is the same as eating a spider or eating a cow is the same as eating a bat.
There’s a reason no one else eats these things.
Think it only far to point out that not all Chinese eat 'exotically'. I've spoken to quite a few from around the country who find the practice just as abhorrent as we do. Millions couldn't afford to either.
No species has dominated the natural world like humans in the last two hundred years. Not even remotely close. Included in that is behaviour that greatly increases pollution in the air, the sea and the ground, is transforming the biological landscape of the planet and creating the ideal environment for a virus to spread. All these factors have been caused by our (relatively) recent dominance of the natural world. This, based on what went before it, is novel, unprecedented in fact. Within a vanishingly short period. So, man’s behaviour over the last two hundred years represents something that has never subsisted previously, and moreover those changes have occurred in the blink of an eye. Something’s changed. That is what I mean when I talk about the natural balance being disturbed. The planet is in unchartered waters in that regard and I believe that consequences flow from that.
So that is my ‘evidence’, and whilst you may not agree with it, it is still founded in rationality. I think that events like this and more unpredictable weather will become increasingly common going forward because of our undeniable impact upon the natural world. I hope I’m wrong, but what is the alternative? That we can dominate the natural world with impunity? Doubtful. I believe there are consequences to our impact on the natural world and this disease, even though it is caused by an unthinking pathogen simply looking for a host to replicate itself within, is an example of that.
The world we’ve created gave rise to this virus jumping from species to species and human behaviour in the modern world aided and abetted its spread at a speed that was inconceivable before industrialisation. In that sense we’ve ‘caused’ this and I believe if we continue to act in the same way as a species, then more is to follow.
They haven't at all. The Chinese weren't running these wet markets for these animals prior to the 1970's, that's the point.But they have. WE haven't, but other parts of the world have. Asia grow and consume fruit and vegetables we havnt even heard of, heck rice was once unheard of. Should that too be seen as a risk? maybe, but it is part of that geolocational society and culture.
Could be because it isn’t a lockdown, and hasn’t been announced as one yet.This isnt really a lockdown is it ? It lead by our employers and if they say they are staying open we have to go in. I mean bike shops , why do the government think that in a pandemic we all going to rush out a buy new bikes or fix up the one in the shed. Solicitors still open, some building sites open some building supplies open. It really is a miss and hit lockdown. In my household once we have finished self isolating, we are all (3 of us ) back to work as normal. Local council worker,( grass cutting) solicitors secretary and bike shop worker doesnt feel like a lock down to us !
I'm getting pretty anxious about all this. I work in a supermarket which exposes myself to a lot of different people and have a horrible feeling this thing might finish me off.
My medical history has all been respiratory related. Pleurisy, pneumonia, two collapsed lungs which required surgery which led to complications and a prolonged chest drain and now I'm diagnosed with bullous emphysema.
I've raised concern with the night manager but he stated unless I receive one of those letters from my GP I'm fine to work. I'm already on a reduced hours contract because of occupational health.
I'm thinking of self isolating for the good my anxiety more than anything.
I'm getting pretty anxious about all this. I work in a supermarket which exposes myself to a lot of different people and have a horrible feeling this thing might finish me off.
My medical history has all been respiratory related. Pleurisy, pneumonia, two collapsed lungs which required surgery which led to complications and a prolonged chest drain and now I'm diagnosed with bullous emphysema.
I've raised concern with the night manager but he stated unless I receive one of those letters from my GP I'm fine to work. I'm already on a reduced hours contract because of occupational health.
I'm thinking of self isolating for the good my anxiety more than anything.
Yes, that’s undoubtedly the counter-argument.I have a lot of sympathy for your argument and the way man has shaped this planet in the last century or so but the most destructive plague was the Black Death in the 1300’s, which also effected cattle, pigs etc, when man’s dominance of the planet was much less marked and, given the era, spread quickly through Asia and Europe. There was also the Sweating Sickness in England starting in the 1400’s. Population density, interconnected travel and our impact on the natural world in these times was negligible compared to today.
Arguable that our dominance allows us to control and mitigate these occurrences much more than in previous centuries.
https://www.euromomo.eu
Europe monitors mortality already. note this years flu season has been exceptionally mild.
Interesting article online from Building Magazine which also says it’s a big game of poker because nobody wants to be sued for failing to fulfil contracts. You might have thought some common sense and leniency might apply in the circumstances but apparently not.I am a Director of a medium sized construction company and I want to get this out here right now before people get the wrong impression.
We as a company have been lead by the government guidelines on this and confusion reigns. We have some of our supply chain closing but we are being asked to carry
On - we work all around the UK including several sites in and around London- our labour force are being turfed out of their accommodation , they cannot share with their colleagues and their families at home are beyond concerned.
This is becoming a huge game of who blinks first between Contractors and Clients playing contractural poker.
It’s fast becoming a fucking right mess and we feel that the industry is being hung out to dry by politics here.
I don't know mate, and maybe when this is all over we will look back and say we did everything right.
I just cannot see it myself. I think we are going to end up like Italy or worse, and we had every opportunity to not have been. I think it stems from our inaction in the early stages 2 or 3 weeks ago, and I am convinced at that time we were thinking that everyone is going to get this, and that they didn't want to have people milling around at the peak period of infections - imagining that people would get bored of any measures introduced too soon, and then compliance would drop. So they accepted the rising infection rates whilst we did bugger all. And then they realised the catastrophic overloading of the NHS that would result, and the huge numbers of excess lives that would be lost and so changed tack. But only after precious weeks were lost.
I posted previously that our daily death rate was probably mulitplying by 10x every 8 or 9 days. Sadly I was wrong. It's been every 6 or 7 days. So a couple of weeks of not doing enough, makes a 10x to 100x difference in the daily death rate. Which is why we'll be seeing 1,000+ people dying every day over the coming days. Terrible, terrible and very sad.
There will need to be the inquest of all inquests when all this is over.
They haven't at all. The Chinese weren't running these wet markets for these animals prior to the 1970's, that's the point.
And when humans moved around, taking their pathogens to new worlds, the indigenous died out. See Incas and Native Americans being virtually wiped out by Smallpox and Flu.
Ok, not really had a chance to post this over the last couple of days since I found out so bear with me and I’ll be interested to hear views.I agree that it's unlikely the current infection rate is anywhere near 50% of the population. But if the majority of those 90k tests have been done on hospitalized people, it gives us no indication at all on the rate of asymptomatic infections. If you've shown no symptoms at all (or even mild symptoms), you haven't been tested.
As I’ve said about five times this morning. Humans haven’t lived in close proximity to these animals and their pathogens for the last 200,000 years. As such, we can’t deal with their viruses and pathogens.