George Floyd murder | Clashes between US police and protestors

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Tb1981 said:
Has Diane Abbott condemned the attack on the police the other day in her constituency yet?
Therein lies the problem in politics at the moment
Certain mps will only criticise certain people and not say a word about others
It’s not hard to say
I don’t like racists and I don’t like people who attack the police
I also don’t like racist police officers
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Saying that, did her son not attack the police not so long ago?
 
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Blue Maverick said:
What was the turning point in the war, the americans entering it? He was a great leader that galavanised a nation to take no shit against overwhelming odds, if it wasnt for him we would have probably sued for peace then Hitler wouldve invaded us later, you know like he did with Russia.
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Probably Stalingrad and the Kursk salient were the turning points in the European sphere, Midway in the Pacific. El Alamein in Africa was also important as that led eventually to the invasion of Italy.

Without these i would argue D-Day would not have happened when it did.

I am not saying Churchill wasn't important, i am saying his importance is exaggerated because of the way history is taught in the UK. We have a romantic view of history that has led to myths being formed and idolatary is a dangerous weapon exploited by the far right. If history is to be taught then teach it properly so that people can understand the role of Churchill warts and all, why his failures like Gallopili and Narvik, his past as a an officer in the Boer war, his experinces in the Anglo sudan and Indian confrontations all moulded him as a man. Then people can make a proper value judgement on him as an historical figure. Knowing he led the UK in WW2 is only a small part of his story, he was a man who divided the nation, he sent troops against people on strike for instance. Both my grandads who were from very different social and political backgrounds hated him. One of my grandads was a desert rat and he thought Churchill was a butcher. my other grandad was one of the very few who was too young to fight in WW1 and too old to fight in WW2 and he hated Churchill because he was a Tory and he hated all the Tories.

If we taught history properly then people would understand or maybe at least have a better understanding of his relevance, yes he was a great man who led us through the darkest times, but he was inherently flawed and if people knew about his flaws then they may accept the good he did more readily as it would be in context.

Its this romantic notion of British Imperialism that is being questioned at the moment, we are a country used to being seen and acting as we are exceptional, that for me is the crux of the matter. We have these myths we rely on to still claim the Great is in Britain and everything indicates that is false, we are still a good country, which enjoys a privileged and decent standing in the world but we are not the country of historical myth.
 
stonerblue said:
Really. wanna enlightne me with some links?
Off to work now but will check back in this affy ta.
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When you hear talk of Churchill's statue being under threat of coming down by the BLM movement, you're bound to get counter protesters there, not just far right thugs as the media like to portray but normal British folk who would be horrified at such a thing happening. Any violence on Saturday will be from the BLM and Antifa, the police will turn a blind eye to that and arrest the easy option in the counter protesters. Come back on Saturday night and tell me if I'm wrong.
 
BlueHammer85 said:
it’s to prevent the ‘football lads alliance’ turning up to prevent these monuments and basically looking for a fight.
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No that’s one reason to be fair and those racist yobs just need any excuse

Another reason is to stop people on the protest damaging or destroying them
Both of these sets are looking to hijack the protest for their own ends
Both sets are cunts
 
stonerblue said:
The Americans lending us shit loads of money, guns and people had quite a dramatic effect.
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Or you know it could be the 27 million Russian deaths on the eastern front whilst pushing back the might of the German army. Lending makes it sound like it was interest free, America saddled us with debt and as a result broke up our empire and made the dollar the number one currency.
 
Psychedelic Casual said:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...tter-graffiti-Antifa-symbol-war-memorial.html

You can bet your bottom dollar that Antifa are involved here too. They’re always involved with every protest that happens to some extent.
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MLK is in my top 3 hero’s of all time, as well as Jesus and David Silva.

Even reading a little about him will make anyone realise that he’d be totally against that and any vandalism or violence whatsoever.

His movement was so effective because they were so peaceful and dignified and showed themselves to be infinitely more civilised than the horrible white cops and racists in the south who attacked them.

That’s what got the nation on side, not vandalising war memorials with “fuck white people”.
 
Ban-jani said:
MLK is in my top 3 hero’s of all time, as well as Jesus and David Silva.

Even reading a little about him will make anyone realise that he’d be totally against that and any vandalism or violence whatsoever.

His movement was so effective because they were so peaceful and dignified and showed themselves to be infinitely more civilised than the horrible white cops and racists in the south who attacked them.

That’s what got the nation on side, not vandalising war memorials with “fuck white people”.
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Check your privilege bud and more importantly, which Jesus?
 
Ban-jani said:
MLK is in my top 3 hero’s of all time, as well as Jesus and David Silva.

Even reading a little about him will make anyone realise that he’d be totally against that and any vandalism or violence whatsoever.

His movement was so effective because they were so peaceful and dignified and showed themselves to be infinitely more civilised than the horrible white cops and racists in the south who attacked them.

That’s what got the nation on side, not vandalising war memorials with “fuck white people”.
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That’s where I make distinctions between BLM and random arseholes getting involved with BLM.

This isn’t one group of people out protesting for equality, Antifa are always there somewhere with their grubby fucking noses being stuck in so they can stir up some trouble.

They have nowt to do with BLM but I’ll bet they’ve been on every march.
 
doots said:
Well that's all the Starbucks shops getting trashed this weekend by the peaceful protesters.
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For fucks sake don't they wear a uniform to work? Why would people turn up wearing t shirts and gear which are protesting against every fucking thing. I don't go to work with my fuck the dippers t shirt as people might find the colour red offensive
 
Tb1981 said:
No that’s one reason to be fair and those racist yobs just need any excuse

Another reason is to stop people on the protest damaging or destroying them
Both of these sets are looking to hijack the protest for their own ends
Both sets are cunts
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Why can't the government just announce anyone caught damaging statues will get a £2000 fine and possible imprisonment
 
Fordyboy46 said:
Of course it was, any excuse for violence and they turn up, just like they will be involved on Saturday. They're fucking shitbags portraying themselves as the good guys, yet being the biggest fascits of them all.
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Surely by now there have been enough demonstrations over the years that you know some people go from one to another to cause trouble ,the rest are peaceful in the main and what they have to say should be heard,stop being angry and listen
 
Rascal said:
Probably Stalingrad and the Kursk salient were the turning points in the European sphere, Midway in the Pacific. El Alamein in Africa was also important as that led eventually to the invasion of Italy.

Without these i would argue D-Day would not have happened when it did.

I am not saying Churchill wasn't important, i am saying his importance is exaggerated because of the way history is taught in the UK. We have a romantic view of history that has led to myths being formed and idolatary is a dangerous weapon exploited by the far right. If history is to be taught then teach it properly so that people can understand the role of Churchill warts and all, why his failures like Gallopili and Narvik, his past as a an officer in the Boer war, his experinces in the Anglo sudan and Indian confrontations all moulded him as a man. Then people can make a proper value judgement on him as an historical figure. Knowing he led the UK in WW2 is only a small part of his story, he was a man who divided the nation, he sent troops against people on strike for instance. Both my grandads who were from very different social and political backgrounds hated him. One of my grandads was a desert rat and he thought Churchill was a butcher. my other grandad was one of the very few who was too young to fight in WW1 and too old to fight in WW2 and he hated Churchill because he was a Tory and he hated all the Tories.

If we taught history properly then people would understand or maybe at least have a better understanding of his relevance, yes he was a great man who led us through the darkest times, but he was inherently flawed and if people knew about his flaws then they may accept the good he did more readily as it would be in context.

Its this romantic notion of British Imperialism that is being questioned at the moment, we are a country used to being seen and acting as we are exceptional, that for me is the crux of the matter. We have these myths we rely on to still claim the Great is in Britain and everything indicates that is false, we are still a good country, which enjoys a privileged and decent standing in the world but we are not the country of historical myth.
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I don’t disagree but isn’t this just human nature?

The only country out there I can think of that shows genuine shame for their past is Germany.

Everyone else has a romantic view of their past that’s not entirely accurate.
 
Psychedelic Casual said:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...tter-graffiti-Antifa-symbol-war-memorial.html

You can bet your bottom dollar that Antifa are involved here too. They’re always involved with every protest that happens to some extent.

And those that are involved don’t care about BLM, they just want anarchy.
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HAHAHAHAHAHA, the Daily Mail haven't got a fucking clue. Its an Anarchist sign.

The world has gone nuts when anti fascists are seen as the enemy, only fascists see ANTIFA as the enemy.
 
Ban-jani said:
Not the one who plays up top for the blues although I am very fond of that lad, think he’s going to be great when he hits his peak.
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I would like him to hit his peak next week v LetterToCASShitouseFC, and remain at the same point for the next ten years. it would be nice if he started chasing Sergio's record.
 
BlueHammer85 said:
Why can't the government just announce anyone caught damaging statues will get a £2000 fine and possible imprisonment
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Because then they will be called racist

They are burying their heads hoping it will die down
Not a great approach but not sure there is much they can do
I think if it gets too violent and more things damaged etc then public opinion will turn and they will do something
But for the moment nothing

Some people will try to provoke a reaction to them compare police with America
 
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