George Floyd murder | Clashes between US police and protestors

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ayrshire_blue said:
I have no idea. Sections of the black community seem to think they are, which is fair enough, but I don't know the statistics to reflect that, and I don't know how they compare to having committed actual criminality per % of the community.

All I'm saying is that article, which in Karen's own words has 'pissed her off' is something about nothing. Absolutely nothing in it to suggest racial profiling but the public have already made their minds up. Its not ok to be racist (we all agree on that) but it's fine to suggest people are racist without any evidence seems to be the take away from that.
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i actually said this

This is what pisses people off.

Stop and search has long been something that the black community has had to deal with much more than the white community,on the streets and in cars,i have never been asked once in nearly 40yrs,i am not in the profiled group

it is too late to go searching for stats now but I will tomorrow if you remind me
 
karen7 said:
i actually said this

This is what pisses people off.

Stop and search has long been something that the black community has had to deal with much more than the white community,on the streets and in cars,i have never been asked once in nearly 40yrs,i am not in the profiled group

it is too late to go searching for stats now but I will tomorrow if you remind me
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I bet the stats would also be heavy weighed for young male as well
I have been stopped and breathalysed a few times for zero reason other than my age
Doesn’t happen anymore thankfully!
 
Alan Harper's Tash said:
What is the percentage of BAME managers across the top 5 leagues in Europe?
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I’m not sure. The likes of Italy and Spain will have none and will no doubt have none for the next 20-30 years as there won’t be enough black players to choose from in those countries.
 
WNRH said:
I’m not sure. The likes of Italy and Spain will have none and will no doubt have none for the next 20-30 years as there won’t be enough black players to choose from in those countries.
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There are “enough” that have retired from each and every one of those leagues, yet very few have made the leap to management.

Maybe they interview badly, or maybe they have the football world against them (sometimes subconsciously) and can’t get a job.
 
Alan Harper's Tash said:
There are “enough” that have retired from each and every one of those leagues, yet very few have made the leap to management.

Maybe they interview badly, or maybe they have the football world against them (sometimes subconsciously) and can’t get a job.
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There has hardly been any Italian or Spanish black players ever. Apart from Balotelli can you name ten from both countries combined?

This season La Liga has 17/20 Spanish born managers, the 18th and 19th are from Mexico and Argentina (same language) and the only non-Spanish speaking manager is Zidane and he is fluent.

In Seria A, 16/20 are Italian born.

Those figures are so high as they reflect the countries and leagues demographics.

The Premier League is so diverse and will continue to be so over the coming years, only then when the pool of all demographics is big enough can the question is this fair be applied.
 
Ric said:
Sorry, I thought when you referenced past players with a UEFA licence and said “from there, given the lopsided numbers of applicants and experience, I’m not sure I can see the issue” that you had some evidence to back it up?!
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No, I said such statistics would create data, and that given such lopsided numbers (white vs non-white players), and years of experience in the game (few players walk straight into a coaching job at the top level), there MIGHT be data that supports your viewpoint. Until then, it’s pissing in the wind, don’t you think?
 
Alan Harper's Tash said:
Maybe they interview badly, or maybe they have the football world against them (sometimes subconsciously) and can’t get a job.
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Perhaps, which more often than not is the judgement of a white owner. It's interesting that with playing, where it's basically a meritocracy, black people do well, but as soon as their future is decided on the whims of a few chairmen, they suddenly struggle.

The one that gets me is Frank Rijkaard. This was a young manager who won two La Ligas and a Champions League with Barcelona, and then went on the manage Galatasaray, ended up in Saudi Arabia, and then quit management to run a football academy in America. And you wonder why he went to Galatasaray. Did he just follow the money, or did he not get offered anything better? Because we all know that usually a manager with that record leaving Barcelona would immediately jump to another top club in the big four leagues.

Arteta got the Arsenal manager's job, and he's done well, but if you're going to base it on hiring an ex-player with a managerial record, then surely Patrick Vieira was more qualified for the role? I wonder if he was even considered.

The other issue though is that there doesn't really seem to be any link with being a good player and being a good manager. Managers like Pep or Zidane are the exception. So it's perhaps not fair to look at Premier League football itself, but look at professional football as a whole. Although even then, you'll likely see the same pattern.
 
oakiecokie said:
Fawlty Towers "dont mention the war" now axed from the Beeb.
Will it never end ??
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The germans has been temporary taken down by UKTV gold channel which is part owed by a bbc company because when the major is refering to the test match he used the two raciali slurs about black people.

Bbc still have it available on britbox and full episodes are on youttube and netflix all unedited.

When it is on terestrial telly it has a pre approved by cleese re-edited version that removes the scene.

UKTV are expectes to have it return soon with the editd version.


Cleese has critisied the move though.
 
So has lockdown all been for nothing then?
Everyone can now do what they want?
 
FogBlueInSanFran said:
I concur. Read a really interesting book called “The Diversity Bonus” that walked through good mathematical and scientific proof for this when it came to organizational decision-making. It’s less true with teams doing rote task-based jobs and working alone which isn’t surprising. There are equity/inclusion/moral issues too but really compelling evidence of better organizational performance beyond this.
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meltonblue said:
Yep spot on.

In terms of this particular example, I’d argue the cabinet should be as diverse as the electorate they serve. Our cabinet right now though have a much bigger issue with diversity of thought as even if they have it, it’s not listened to anyway and a lot of their best thinkers have been shunted to the back benches.
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karen7 said:
It does matter in a multicultural country,let's face it a cabinet of all white ,rich bullingdon boys are not going to get most others problems
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Indeed, which therefore shows that the diversity of the cabinet would be given to the right diverse people for the job if the diversity of the individuals made the cabinet better.

But if there wasn’t an individual or a few individuals who are black who would make the cabinet better because, by chance, they just wouldn’t be as good at the job as the people in the positions now; they shouldn’t be given positive discrimination and just given the roles because of the colour of their skin.

Now, if there is only one black MP in the cabinet like there is now, because others have been blocked from getting the position (who would make the cabinet better) due to racist undertones; then let’s challenge it. But is that the case?

Likewise, if there was a board of people that didn’t need a middle-aged middle-class white bloke, then he shouldn’t just be given a place on that board just for the sake of diversity.
 
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ChicagoBlue said:
No, I said such statistics would create data, and that given such lopsided numbers (white vs non-white players), and years of experience in the game (few players walk straight into a coaching job at the top level), there MIGHT be data that supports your viewpoint. Until then, it’s pissing in the wind, don’t you think?
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Gerrard and Lampard walked into top line jobs. Neville got the Valencia job with no experience whatsoever. Shearer at Newcastle. A top black player won’t be walking into a top line job with no experience that easily. Closest I can think is Gullit at Chelsea and Henry at Monaco.

It’s a fact of life you employ who you know, who you can relate to and who you are comfortable with. It’s why Big Sam, Hughes and the like keep getting jobs. It’s as much an unconscious thing as anything else. Forcing employers to look outside there comfort zone is no bad thing.
 
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