#8 | Ilkay Gündoğan - 2020/21 Performances

Status
Not open for further replies.
Rascal said:
I look forward to you taking over as manager someday.

I miss the relegation battles
Click to expand...
He speaks a lot of sense though. The way we play against Madrid and Liverpool is completely different from the way we play against everyone else. We don't have as much possession, and we play like how most sides play against us - on the counter. There's less pressure on gundogun to create or make those silky passes, which he isn't good at anyway. And defensively as the rest of the team are in containment mode, he has ample support from everyone else and he comes across as doing a decent job.
 
thesting said:
He speaks a lot of sense though. The way we play against Madrid and Liverpool is completely different from the way we play against everyone else. We don't have as much possession, and we play like how most sides play against us - on the counter. There's less pressure on gundogun to create or make those silky passes, which he isn't good at anyway. And defensively as the rest of the team are in containment mode, he has ample support from everyone else and he comes across as doing a decent job.
Click to expand...
Do you realise other teams arn't as good as Liverpool and Real. Sometimes we cant dominate and have to try and counter what the other team do. Gundogan is not the main creator, he is the recycler for our other more creative players. Against teams who play similar to us and keep the ball well, we need players who also keep the ball well. If we have the ball, the other team cant score and those 5 yard passes backwards sideways wherever keep the ball moving and away from their players. The ball does the work and the other team have to counter where the ball moves too. That conserves our energy and drains there energy. That Is why possession is so important. It is harder to defend without the ball as the whole team is playing and reacting against one man at a time. That makes space because you are pulling opposition players across the park, your own players can almost stand still or ghost into areas where the opposition team have vacated.

As for Aouar. the as time I looked he doesn't play for us so I don't know why he is even being spoke about as this is not fantasy football and from what I have seen he wouldn't do the job Gundogan does anyway. He is a good player yes, but so is Pogba and even Henderson but neither would be right for us because they don't play the way Gundogan does.

There is a real misconception that every midfielder has to be able to be a world beating passer of the ball, not even the great Barca side had that, they had Busquets doing the job that Gundogan does for us, which is recycle and give it to the more creative players and keep possession. Recycling and winning the ball is two different jobs as well, under Pep we defend from the front and the forward players are the first line of defence, the age of the midfield hard man has gone, you wouldn't see a Gerry Gow in the premier anymore because he was not good enough as a footballer bless him. He was great at winning the ball, but not so good once he had it.

I get our fans need a scapegoat, we have always had one that the fans like to moan about, from Paul Power to Richard Edgehill to Stefan Savic, Gundogan seems the player now in fashion to be the one to moan about. The facts say different though, he plays for Germany who are one best teams on the planet, he plays for City one of the best club teams in the world and still you have to fucking moan and whinge like little girls and play some idealised game of fantasy football in your heads where everyone scores 10 a game and we win ever game 100-0

Now you may not rate him, I have players I don't rate as well as football is a game of opinions, most of which are inconsequential because we have no say who gets picked thank fuck. Don't be a sheep though and follow fashion though, Gundogan might not be Kev but then who is, he might not be Silva but then who is, but what he does he does well and is an integral part of one of the best squads in our history and if he is picked to play I trust the best manager in our history has a good reason to pick him. You may not, that is fine, but to be honest I prefer the tactical nous of a man who has won loads of trophies over some kids who once won the FA Cup playing FIFA 2006.

Have fun everyone and keep smiling :))
 
Rascal said:
Do you realise other teams arn't as good as Liverpool and Real. Sometimes we cant dominate and have to try and counter what the other team do. Gundogan is not the main creator, he is the recycler for our other more creative players. Against teams who play similar to us and keep the ball well, we need players who also keep the ball well. If we have the ball, the other team cant score and those 5 yard passes backwards sideways wherever keep the ball moving and away from their players. The ball does the work and the other team have to counter where the ball moves too. That conserves our energy and drains there energy. That Is why possession is so important. It is harder to defend without the ball as the whole team is playing and reacting against one man at a time. That makes space because you are pulling opposition players across the park, your own players can almost stand still or ghost into areas where the opposition team have vacated.

As for Aouar. the as time I looked he doesn't play for us so I don't know why he is even being spoke about as this is not fantasy football and from what I have seen he wouldn't do the job Gundogan does anyway. He is a good player yes, but so is Pogba and even Henderson but neither would be right for us because they don't play the way Gundogan does.

There is a real misconception that every midfielder has to be able to be a world beating passer of the ball, not even the great Barca side had that, they had Busquets doing the job that Gundogan does for us, which is recycle and give it to the more creative players and keep possession. Recycling and winning the ball is two different jobs as well, under Pep we defend from the front and the forward players are the first line of defence, the age of the midfield hard man has gone, you wouldn't see a Gerry Gow in the premier anymore because he was not good enough as a footballer bless him. He was great at winning the ball, but not so good once he had it.

I get our fans need a scapegoat, we have always had one that the fans like to moan about, from Paul Power to Richard Edgehill to Stefan Savic, Gundogan seems the player now in fashion to be the one to moan about. The facts say different though, he plays for Germany who are one best teams on the planet, he plays for City one of the best club teams in the world and still you have to fucking moan and whinge like little girls and play some idealised game of fantasy football in your heads where everyone scores 10 a game and we win ever game 100-0

Now you may not rate him, I have players I don't rate as well as football is a game of opinions, most of which are inconsequential because we have no say who gets picked thank fuck. Don't be a sheep though and follow fashion though, Gundogan might not be Kev but then who is, he might not be Silva but then who is, but what he does he does well and is an integral part of one of the best squads in our history and if he is picked to play I trust the best manager in our history has a good reason to pick him. You may not, that is fine, but to be honest I prefer the tactical nous of a man who has won loads of trophies over some kids who once won the FA Cup playing FIFA 2006.

Have fun everyone and keep smiling :))
Click to expand...
I look forward to you taking over as manager someday ;)
 
Rascal said:
Do you realise other teams arn't as good as Liverpool and Real. Sometimes we cant dominate and have to try and counter what the other team do. Gundogan is not the main creator, he is the recycler for our other more creative players. Against teams who play similar to us and keep the ball well, we need players who also keep the ball well. If we have the ball, the other team cant score and those 5 yard passes backwards sideways wherever keep the ball moving and away from their players. The ball does the work and the other team have to counter where the ball moves too. That conserves our energy and drains there energy. That Is why possession is so important. It is harder to defend without the ball as the whole team is playing and reacting against one man at a time. That makes space because you are pulling opposition players across the park, your own players can almost stand still or ghost into areas where the opposition team have vacated.

As for Aouar. the as time I looked he doesn't play for us so I don't know why he is even being spoke about as this is not fantasy football and from what I have seen he wouldn't do the job Gundogan does anyway. He is a good player yes, but so is Pogba and even Henderson but neither would be right for us because they don't play the way Gundogan does.

There is a real misconception that every midfielder has to be able to be a world beating passer of the ball, not even the great Barca side had that, they had Busquets doing the job that Gundogan does for us, which is recycle and give it to the more creative players and keep possession. Recycling and winning the ball is two different jobs as well, under Pep we defend from the front and the forward players are the first line of defence, the age of the midfield hard man has gone, you wouldn't see a Gerry Gow in the premier anymore because he was not good enough as a footballer bless him. He was great at winning the ball, but not so good once he had it.

I get our fans need a scapegoat, we have always had one that the fans like to moan about, from Paul Power to Richard Edgehill to Stefan Savic, Gundogan seems the player now in fashion to be the one to moan about. The facts say different though, he plays for Germany who are one best teams on the planet, he plays for City one of the best club teams in the world and still you have to fucking moan and whinge like little girls and play some idealised game of fantasy football in your heads where everyone scores 10 a game and we win ever game 100-0

Now you may not rate him, I have players I don't rate as well as football is a game of opinions, most of which are inconsequential because we have no say who gets picked thank fuck. Don't be a sheep though and follow fashion though, Gundogan might not be Kev but then who is, he might not be Silva but then who is, but what he does he does well and is an integral part of one of the best squads in our history and if he is picked to play I trust the best manager in our history has a good reason to pick him. You may not, that is fine, but to be honest I prefer the tactical nous of a man who has won loads of trophies over some kids who once won the FA Cup playing FIFA 2006.

Have fun everyone and keep smiling :))
Click to expand...
fucking bang on
 
BillyShears said:
Forums/social media tend to bring out the worst aspects of this. Opinions are quickly polarised and people feel they need to be more and more extreme to 'prove' something. Hence you end up with comments like "he can't tackle" "he's not intelligent" "he can't pass forward" - all stuff that objectively is untrue, but is being characterised as not just fact, but obvious fact.

Will keep coming back to the same thing - whilst no manager is perfect and managers will often make mistakes, to suggest that Gundo is Pep's blind spot is IMO wildly incorrect.
Click to expand...

Of course comments like 'he can't pass forward' and 'he can't tackle' aren't true if it's being said unequivocally.

He can do those things, he's just not very good at them and doesn't do it enough. This is clear when watching him and in the statistical analysis' done previously about him as well.

The very thing you're claiming others of doing is the exact thing that you're actually doing. You've formed your opinion, and because of that, no amount of evidence will change it. You're seemingly making more and more dubious claims about the guy with each post you make defending him.

In my experience, supporters who lay into players mainly do so because they want what is absolute best for the team, and that's where their agenda lies. I don't see any of this being personal about Gundogan.... he's just not very good and doesn't fit the team or the league well.

Supporters who support and cling to certain players seem to run their agenda differently, along individual lines. They tend to lose focus of what the big picture is and forget that it's about the team, and not individual players that they're running their petty agenda through.
 
Last edited:
ws01 said:
Of course comments like 'he can't pass forward' and 'he can't tackle' aren't true if it's being said unequivocally.

He can do those things, he's just not very good at them and doesn't do it enough. This is clear when watching him and in the statistical analysis' done previously about him as well.

The very thing you're claiming others of doing is the exact thing that you're actually doing. You've formed your opinion, and because of that, no amount of evidence will change it. You're seemingly making more and more dubious claims about the guy with each post you make defending him.

In my experience, supporters who lay into players mainly do so because they want what is absolute best for the team, and that's where their agenda lies. I don't see any of this being personal about Gundogan.... he's just not very good and doesn't fit the team or the league well.

Supporters who support and cling to certain players seem to run their agenda differently, along individual lines. They tend to lose focus of what the big picture is and forget that it's about the team, and not individual players that they're running their petty agenda through.
Click to expand...
Further to that.....because others don't share their thoughts,some go further by attempting to undermine the opinion of others,and that usually presents by way of the 'scapegoat' accusation.

I always find it amusing/coincidental that one persons scapegoat is another's persons pudding.
 
ws01 said:
Of course comments like 'he can't pass forward' and 'he can't tackle' aren't true if it's being said unequivocally.

He can do those things, he's just not very good at them and doesn't do it enough. This is clear when watching him and in the statistical analysis' done previously about him as well.
Click to expand...
Not very good in comparison to who. Because he plays for a top club and a top national team so who are you comparing him too. Is it managers of Germany, Dortmund, City who cant see it or do they look at what they have in comparison and decide he is the best option and they are/were wrong or is Gundogan's fault because he isn't Kevin De Bruyne.

Not very good is something I would associate with fat Mick who turns out on a sunday morning because you are a player short. He isn't very good but makes up the numbers.
 
What i find hilarious about Gundogan critics is the continued reference that Gundogan and Rodri cant play together and they slow the game down , but its Gundogan who gets it in the neck, how about having a dig at Pep for making the selection or start a "Rodri blindsport" thread.
 
He helped bring a little bit of needed composure to proceedings when introduced,we were mainly on the front foot so he did what he does best and kept the ball moving.

Coming on in the final stages i feel is very much his best role.
 
He was a perfect sub to bring on. Sured up the midfield and our grasp on the game. Arsenal were generally inept in attacking in the second half so it was good to see him come and grab control.
 
Pep likes him for his la pausa, which no other player in the team has. Unfortunately for Gundo, he's been asked to take over from Silva, possibly one of the greatest players to possess that particular skill to have played in England.
 
Brightwell Bros. said:
Pep likes him for his la pausa, which no other player in the team has. Unfortunately for Gundo, he's been asked to take over from Silva, possibly one of the greatest players to possess that particular skill to have played in England.
Click to expand...
Who has asked him to take over from Silva?

I must’ve missed that question.

he’s part of the squad, with a certain skill set the manager admires.

He does a decent job for me.
 
Rascal said:
Do you realise other teams arn't as good as Liverpool and Real. Sometimes we cant dominate and have to try and counter what the other team do. Gundogan is not the main creator, he is the recycler for our other more creative players. Against teams who play similar to us and keep the ball well, we need players who also keep the ball well. If we have the ball, the other team cant score and those 5 yard passes backwards sideways wherever keep the ball moving and away from their players. The ball does the work and the other team have to counter where the ball moves too. That conserves our energy and drains there energy. That Is why possession is so important. It is harder to defend without the ball as the whole team is playing and reacting against one man at a time. That makes space because you are pulling opposition players across the park, your own players can almost stand still or ghost into areas where the opposition team have vacated.

As for Aouar. the as time I looked he doesn't play for us so I don't know why he is even being spoke about as this is not fantasy football and from what I have seen he wouldn't do the job Gundogan does anyway. He is a good player yes, but so is Pogba and even Henderson but neither would be right for us because they don't play the way Gundogan does.

There is a real misconception that every midfielder has to be able to be a world beating passer of the ball, not even the great Barca side had that, they had Busquets doing the job that Gundogan does for us, which is recycle and give it to the more creative players and keep possession. Recycling and winning the ball is two different jobs as well, under Pep we defend from the front and the forward players are the first line of defence, the age of the midfield hard man has gone, you wouldn't see a Gerry Gow in the premier anymore because he was not good enough as a footballer bless him. He was great at winning the ball, but not so good once he had it.

I get our fans need a scapegoat, we have always had one that the fans like to moan about, from Paul Power to Richard Edgehill to Stefan Savic, Gundogan seems the player now in fashion to be the one to moan about. The facts say different though, he plays for Germany who are one best teams on the planet, he plays for City one of the best club teams in the world and still you have to fucking moan and whinge like little girls and play some idealised game of fantasy football in your heads where everyone scores 10 a game and we win ever game 100-0

Now you may not rate him, I have players I don't rate as well as football is a game of opinions, most of which are inconsequential because we have no say who gets picked thank fuck. Don't be a sheep though and follow fashion though, Gundogan might not be Kev but then who is, he might not be Silva but then who is, but what he does he does well and is an integral part of one of the best squads in our history and if he is picked to play I trust the best manager in our history has a good reason to pick him. You may not, that is fine, but to be honest I prefer the tactical nous of a man who has won loads of trophies over some kids who once won the FA Cup playing FIFA 2006.

Have fun everyone and keep smiling :))
Click to expand...
BANG ON THE FUCKING MONEY. Especially the scapegoat point. And in any event what the fuck have Pep Guardiola and Joachim Low achieved in football when compared to the knowledgeable knicker wetters of Bluedoom?
 
Moggzy said:
Who has asked him to take over from Silva?

I must’ve missed that question.

he’s part of the squad, with a certain skill set the manager admires.

He does a decent job for me.
Click to expand...

Takeover is maybe the wrong term. We used to have two players with that quality, and now we only have one, and Pep values it to the extent he'd prefer someone on the pitch who brings it with him.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top