2020 US Elections

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west didsblue said:
But presumably the courts can?
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Trevor Morley's Tache said:
There is no reason the courts can't see them now, but it appears the Justice Department have been complicit in the coverup.
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The courts can't just decide to show his tax returns.

THe situation is basically that Cy Vance and Congress have seperately issued subpoenas to Mazars, Trump's accountants, to hand over his tax returns.

Trump has sued to stop that subpoena and that's been stuck in the courts for 2 years.

When Trump stops being president, Congress no longer has the valid reason for demanding his tax returns.

Cy Vance still does, but he's been trying for a long time with no success - although it's possible that the SC stops backing Trump now they know he's toast.
 
As he has committed numerous crimes, it should be incumbent on the Attorney General to instruct an inquiry and subsequent prosecution in a clear and open process so that everyone can see all the evidence of his wrongdoings. Unless this happens he will continue to go on about witch hunts etc and his base will believe him. Everyone, especially them, needs to see the incontrovertible evidence of his crimes. Without that he’ll never go away.
 
Mancityus said:
You can take the Democrats to be stupid but I do not think they are that stupid that they will go after him. If they do they will dig their own grave by making him a victim and ensuring his return in four years.
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I can't believe anyone actually thinks he should be allowed to get away with all the crimes he has committed?

No way.

Trump is an authoritarian. The way you beat him is by destroying the myth he created. Step 1, the tax returns, expose the fact he's not a billionaire, he's not a successful businessman, he's a crook who literally steals from charities and his political donors (the everyday republican) to pay his bills.

Second is to full prosecute those in the Trump inner circle who conspired with the Russian and Ukranian Oligarchs and committed other crimes.

Then he faces his sexual assault and rape allegations in court.

By the time the SDNY is done with Donald Trump, he will be an unelectable loser.
 
Mancityus said:
You can take the Democrats to be stupid but I do not think they are that stupid that they will go after him. If they do they will dig their own grave by making him a victim and ensuring his return in four years.
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Sure,

The self proclaimed billionaire with a list of financial improprieties that make Nick Leeson look like a boy scout is the victim in all this.
 
domalino said:
I can't beleive anyone actually thinks he should be allowed to get away with all the crimes he has committed?

No way.

Trump is an authoritarian. The way you beat his is by destroying the myth he created. Step 1, the tax returns, expose the fact he's not a billionaire, he's not a successful billionaire, he's a crook who literally steals from charities to pay his bills.

Second is to full prosecute those in the Trump inner circle who conspired with the Russian and Ukranian Oligarchs.

Then he faces his sexual assault and rape allegations in court.

By the time the SDNY is done with Donald Trump, he will be an unelectable loser.
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And his Election Campaign fund.
 
domalino said:
The courts can't just decide to show his tax returns.

THe situation is basically that Cy Vance and Congress have seperately issued subpoenas to Mazars, Trump's accountants, to hand over his tax returns.

Trump has sued to stop that subpoena and that's been stuck in the courts for 2 years.

When Trump stops being president, Congress no longer has the valid reason for demanding his tax returns.

Cy Vance still does, but he's been trying for a long time with no success - although it's possible that the SC stops backing Trump now they know he's toast.
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Cy Vance wants his tax returns in relation to alleged improprieties on a Deutsche Bank loan, and insurance fraud in connection with a New York property. Nothing to do with Congress.
 
domalino said:
Yes, exactly.

The Bible belt republican housewife needs to know that she's paying for Trump's latest pornstar mistress to have an abortion, or financing his 27th sexual assault trial when she's donating $50 to the Trump 2024 campaign.
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The Bible Belt housewife probably turned a blind eye because Trump managed to appoint a pro life bible thumping judge to the Supreme Court.
 
Trevor Morley's Tache said:
Cy Vance wants his tax returns in relation to alleged improprieties on a Deutsche Bank loan, and insurance fraud in connection with a New York property. Nothing to do with Congress.
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I know the Vance and Congress lawsuits are seperate but I'm not convinced Vance will succeed, Congress has a much stronger case - it's literally stated that the executive branch must follow their subpoena, whereas the White House Counsel can easily make a bullshit argument that the president isn't beholden to SDNY.

Vance might succeed after January 20th, but that brings in political choices for Biden - does he want one of his first acts to be going after Trump? That's why I've always thought SDNY will have to operate without help from the new administration.
 
Fode N The Hole said:
Are you sure this is insurance Fraud? Underinsurance isn't defrauding the Insurance provider as the risk of there being a gap between the insured value and actual value falls on the asset holder. Might be a breach of contract/misrepresentation or breach of fiduciary duty issue if he has debt against the assets and as part of that debt agreement he has agreed to insure at a minimum threshold. Could be a case of fraudulently obtaining credit if that was a condition he always intended not too keep before he entered into it.
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www.msnbc.com

Trump's alleged financial fraud creates an important new vulnerability

If Trump tried to perpetrate a fraud against financial institutions, that's a felony -- for which the statute of limitations has not expired.
www.msnbc.com www.msnbc.com
 
domalino said:
I know the Vance and Congress lawsuits are seperate but I'm not convinced Vance will succeed, Congress has a much stronger case - it's literally stated that the executive branch must follow their subpoena, whereas the White House Counsel can easily make a bullshit argument that the president isn't beholden to SDNY.

Vance might succeed after January 20th, but that brings in political choices for Biden - does he want one of his first acts to be going after Trump? That's why I've always thought SDNY will have to operate without help from the new administration.
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I think SDNY will have more than enough without help from the Biden administration.

Obviously the justice department could stick their oar in, but I honestly think they will just back off and let justice take it's course (hopefully).
 
domalino said:
I can't believe anyone actually thinks he should be allowed to get away with all the crimes he has committed?

No way.

Trump is an authoritarian. The way you beat him is by destroying the myth he created. Step 1, the tax returns, expose the fact he's not a billionaire, he's not a successful businessman, he's a crook who literally steals from charities and his political donors (the everyday republican) to pay his bills.

Second is to full prosecute those in the Trump inner circle who conspired with the Russian and Ukranian Oligarchs and committed other crimes.

Then he faces his sexual assault and rape allegations in court.

By the time the SDNY is done with Donald Trump, he will be an unelectable loser.
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Do not think any of these would be pursued by democrats. Over 70 million voted for him, if you want to solidify that vote against you, go after him and risk your own administration.
 
Fode N The Hole said:
Are you sure this is insurance Fraud? Underinsurance isn't defrauding the Insurance provider as the risk of there being a gap between the insured value and actual value falls on the asset holder. Might be a breach of contract/misrepresentation or breach of fiduciary duty issue if he has debt against the assets and as part of that debt agreement he has agreed to insure at a minimum threshold. Could be a case of fraudulently obtaining credit if that was a condition he always intended not too keep before he entered into it.
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This^^^
 
domalino said:
It's like you didn't read anything I wrote.
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I read and none of it is worth it for democratic party. For example it may be important for you to prove that he is not a billionaire but what does the party gain by doing it when he is not the President ?
 
Mancityus said:
I read and none of it is worth it for democratic party. For example it may be important for you to prove that he is not a billionaire but what does the party gain by doing it when he is not the President ?
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The Democrats don't have to go after him.

SDNY can prosecute him without the help of the federal government.
 
Trevor Morley's Tache said:
www.msnbc.com

Trump's alleged financial fraud creates an important new vulnerability

If Trump tried to perpetrate a fraud against financial institutions, that's a felony -- for which the statute of limitations has not expired.
www.msnbc.com www.msnbc.com
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There is nothing in the article about understatement being insurance fraud- I even watched the whole video too.

As far as I am aware, understating the value of assets could be accounting fraud, particularly if they were previously inflated. Or there could be a financial statement/accounting fraud if you are understate liabilities or expenses. Or a wide disparity between declared value at the time of applying for a loan and insurance value might point towards evidence of a false statement to obtain to obtain money, but he wouldn't need to make a false statement to the insurance provider- you can legally insure an asset for less than it's worth (save for considerations mentioned in previous post).
 
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