COVID-19 — Coronavirus

[mrbelfry]

If it was remotely correct the rates would be highest in the border areas and North Wales coast and not deep in the Valleys where tourists and day visitors from England scarcely venture.

Not necessarily. If a coach party of care workers from Glasgow goes to Blackpool for drinking then they carry the virus deep into Scotland. If the super spreader theory is correct then one person can cause a knock on of infections.

If they are able to state this is happening though with any real confidence and have data to prove it I'd be surprised though and they should release it. Then we can all avoid those areas

 

[mosssideblue]

I changed my post to “against taking the vaccine”.

You’ve just said you don’t know what it will do to you and your kids and you are reluctant to take it.

If everyone felt that way then we’re in the dire position we are in indefinitely, until the virus finally fizzles out, but that could be years.

Not everyone has lost someone to what was thought to be a "safe" vaccine

 

[Healdplace]

On the issue of blame. Nationalist governments will always be nationalistic. So yes you do have to take that into account with their messaging.

The inference Wales meant North West was mine (no part of England was specified) and only because this was the closest to Wales in big trouble around the time they were under restrictions. Though things are very different now.

We also saw it with Nicola Sturgeon going to great trouble calculating how many people may have brought the virus back from coach trips to Blackpool a few weeks ago. It came up a few times in her briefings as I reported here.

One of my best friends, who is in her 80s with asthma and who just before Covid hit was in hospital with pneumonia and nearly died, will be getting the vaccine very soon as she is a top priority. But she was asked to go to Wales for Christmas and she was planning to do so despite my explaining daily why that was not a great idea given the numbers.

Happily she has now been told they have decided not to let her come as Greater Manchester is rife with the virus and it would be unfair to put Wales at risk

She knows the data as I tell her daily and we both had a good laugh. But I am relieved their cock eyed view means she will not travel there.

 

[03 March 2002]

Not everyone has lost someone to what was thought to be a "safe" vaccine

With all due respect and with no offense meant, if someone suffers an adverse reaction to what's considered a safe vaccine then it's an issue with an underlying problem of that person - diagnosed or otherwise. I'm sorry that all medication can't be checked in every person with each their individual ailments but if a vaccine is deemed safe then it's safe with the admonishment that everyone is somewhat equal. There are tolerances either side of 'normal' by way of age, sex, ethnicity, certain medical conditions and whatnot.

The suitability of that medication to individual persons is the responsibility of the health care professional.

Once again, I know you have a particular position on this and rightly so (you've previously clarified it to me). The issue is the message we spread. Potentially >30,000 people of varying backgrounds and medical positions have now had this and we've seen nothing to suggest it doesn't work/harms people.

 

[Ban-jani]

Not everyone has lost someone to what was thought to be a "safe" vaccine

A colossal amount more people have lost someone to Covid-19 recently though

 

[Keith Moncrieff]

A medical professional said yesterday that driving to get the vaccine is more risky than the actual vaccine. I’m with science on this one

 

[Del_Bosque]

Wonder if the US press will jump all over the 2 all over the allergic reactions

if it was the Oxford vaccine I get the feeling they’d be chiselling it into Mt Rushmore

 

[Healdplace]

Wales - most cases ever in the pandemic today, tragically

Deaths 31

Cases 2238 at a shocking 21.4% positive.

Why are they not in full national lockdown? If they carry on like this to Christmas then it will kill many of their old folk. Surely they can see that?

 

[Healdplace]

England hospital deaths a little better news. 344 - lower than either of past 2 weeks on what is usually the biggest day of the week. And NW even better news as just 58 - way down on the past three weeks when add ons in this region are common due to the lack of weekend reporting. Likely that is why yesterday's NW % was up. They just reported the lag a bit quicker this week.

This is more evidence that the deaths are plateauing but that is a 4 week or so legacy of when we were in lockdown. The risk exists that over coming weeks cases will rise as we relax and then deaths come January will go up again from an already tragically too high base.

 

[Healdplace]

Germany had a new daily record number of deaths today at 590.

 

[Healdplace]

N Ireland is also sadly starting to unravel a bit after their circuit breaker. It is starting to look like these are not terribly effective.

But what it really shows is how easily the virus returns if you lower your guard.

Unfortunately this is a window into what you will probably see in the NW over the next month given how we are planning to go forward right now and the understandable but very unfortunate double whammy of Chrtistmas mixing and the vaccine is coming relaxation of caution.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

Wales - most cases ever in the pandemic today, tragically

Deaths 31

Cases 2238 at a shocking 21.4% positive.

Why are they not in full national lockdown? If they carry on like this to Christmas then it will kill many of their old folk. Surely they can see that?

it’s weird they had a circuit breaker national lockdown and yet seem to be the worst of the home nations ?

 

[mosssideblue]

With all due respect and with no offense meant, if someone suffers an adverse reaction to what's considered a safe vaccine then it's an issue with an underlying problem of that person - diagnosed or otherwise. I'm sorry that all medication can't be checked in every person with each their individual ailments but if a vaccine is deemed safe then it's safe with the admonishment that everyone is somewhat equal. There are tolerances either side of 'normal' by way of age, sex, ethnicity, certain medical conditions and whatnot.

The suitability of that medication to individual persons is the responsibility of the health care professional.

Once again, I know you have a particular position on this and rightly so (you've previously clarified it to me). The issue is the message we spread. Potentially >30,000 people of varying backgrounds and medical positions have now had this and we've seen nothing to suggest it doesn't work/harms people.

No offence taken and you are absolutely correct in that it was a family underlying issue, hence our families reticence.

Of course the vaccine will be safe to most, and maybe even me, but I simply get a tad wound up by a few posters who simply put me and others with similar justifiable concerns as people simply refusing the vaccine based on nothing.

 

[mosssideblue]

A colossal amount more people have lost someone to Covid-19 recently though

And?
I am simply saying for me and my family, the vaccine may not be safe

 

[SWP's back]

I hate comments like that arbitrarily thrown out. Some, me included have real concerns about what the vaccine may do to me or my children - we are far from idiots!

Not everyone is safe from vaccines, please consider this demographic before trying to look big

Not sure why you feel the need to tell everyone every day that you’re not having the vaccine and how that doesn’t make you an idiot. You’ve made your point but you still feel the need to keep making it as you’re obviously drawn to this thread and feel like you have to justify it to strangers online which is just weird.

Luckily the vast majority don’t think like you (nor act like you) on this subject or a vaccine would be totally fucking useless in the first place.



If you don’t want the vaccine, don’t have it. If it offends you when people (though not me) say anti-vaxxers are idiots then it may be worth giving this thread a miss.

 

[Healdplace]

N Ireland:

Deaths 12 - well up on last week but there were quite a few older catch up deaths added today.

Cases 483 - most in a while and slowly been increasing for some days now. At 15% positive too. 3 times the level in England.

The seven day rolling cases total that fell from nearly 7000 to just over 2000 during the circuit measure and just after has been climbing for the past week or more and today went back over 3000 for the first time to 3031.

The age range is also starting to look concerning as the upping of older people catching it will result in deaths in 3 or 4 weeks.

ages 0 - 19 (568), 20 - 39 (912), 40 - 59 (870), 60 - 79 (452), 80 + (229) - almost a quarter testing positive over 60.

Better news on care home outbreaks though as these are falling daily. Down today from 109 to 107. It has fallen by about a third in three weeks.

 

[mosssideblue]

Not sure why you feel the need to tell everyone every day that you’re not having the vaccine and how that doesn’t make you an idiot. You’ve made your point but you still feel the need to keep making it as you’re obviously drawn to this thread and feel like you have to justify it to strangers online which is just weird.

Luckily the vast majority don’t think like you (nor act like you) on this subject or a vaccine would be totally fucking useless in the first place.

View attachment 6450

If you don’t want the vaccine, don’t have it. If it offends you when people (though not me) say anti-vaxxers are idiots then it may be worth giving this thread a miss.

I reply to posters too ignorant to understand why someone who feels strongly about their position, and as for it being every day, go on show me.

I'm not in anyway asking anyone not to take the vaccine.

Covid affects us all and there is an awful lot of info to be gleened from reading its content, hence why I read it

Maybe, if you don't like reading why people have concerns about the vaccine, you too could take your own advice and give the thread a miss.

 

[Healdplace]

More on England 344 deaths :

2 wks v 2 wks v last wk v today: Total / NW total / NW %

282 / 98 NW / 35%

353 / 84 NW/ 24%

372 / 92 NW / 25%

TODAY 344 / 58 NW / 17% - big fall here.

Other regions with deaths reported: Midlands 83, NE & Yorks 64, South East 50, London 30.

Dartford 18, Birmingham 17, Medway 10 were most deaths. Manchester with 10 was the highest in NW.

Age range of deaths: 0 - 19 (1), 20 - 39 (1), 40 - 59 (24), 60 - 79 (107) and 80 + (211)

 

[Healdplace]

Wales 3 wks v 2 wks v last wk v TODAY Deaths/Cases/Patients/Ventilated

41d - 640c - 1121p - 70v

41d - 907c - 1134p - 70v

51d - 1480c - 1151p - 68v

31d - 2238c* - 1208p - 82v TODAY * Highest ever recorded.

All these numbers bar deaths are going up. And sadly as we all know that means around Christmas deaths will follow.

They really need urgent action.

 

[NeilYoungIsBack]

Scottish scientist explaining with Nicola Sturgeon that they almost eliminated the virus in Scotland with their strict measures but it came back because it spread from other infected areas once lockdown ended. Allowing travel reintroduces the virus. He urges people NOT to travel outside Scotland to higher infected areas as this is what reimports the vaccine after hard work locally eliminates it.

This seems to be the report referred to. Extract from the BBC.

The origins of many of the second wave of Covid infections in Scotland can be traced to countries outside the UK, a new expert report has said.

Prof Jason Leitch, Scotland's national clinical director, told the daily media briefing the March lockdown eliminated the majority of the first wave strains.

But he said the report demonstrated that whole new strains were introduced and the study identified travel to Europe as the trigger for the second wave.

The report, written for the UK government's Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (Sage), said many cases could be traced to summer holidays and other travel abroad in July and August.

I don't really have an issue with those conclusions TBH. Also, to cut some slack for the Welsh Government for once, I believe it has been mainly Plaid Cymru that have been consistently propagating the idea that the infection has been brought into Wales by English visitors.

Indeed, heroic Heath Minister Vaughan Gething has been placing all the blame for the wreckage of his strategy on the behaviour of the people of Wales in recent days...