Another new Brexit thread

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Reallly, do you know a lot of people that don’t go on holiday ? I have know a lot of people on low wages that always make sure their family holiday happens.
Yes. Nobody I work with has said they've been on 'holiday' this year, or last, pre-COVID, except for a couple who pooled their wages and went for a week in Iceland.

I'd love to live in your world, pal, I really would. £359 on furlough. Can you survive on that?
 
Reallly, do you know a lot of people that don’t go on holiday ? I have know a lot of people on low wages that always make sure their family holiday happens.

I once went 8 years without a holiday fella. Anyhow I'm glad you have dismissed such a thing and UK residents all have holidays.

This new info will certainly go down well with some of our posters who frequent the politics forum.
 
Yes. Nobody I work with has said they've been on 'holiday' this year, or last, pre-COVID, except for a couple who pooled their wages and went for a week in Iceland.

I'd love to live in your world, pal, I really would. £359 on furlough. Can you survive on that?

I have.
 
Don’t know when I was getting child and family credit and getting my business off the ground. I made sure my children got holidays. Didn’t feel privileged, never had a BMW, about priorities I guess.

Yeah my mum and dad did the same for us - usually Rhyl in a caravan - Robin Hood camp I think it was called - and we did the same for our kids when they were little. First week in September this year when we were allowed to we had a week in Bournemouth in a caravan and took my two kids in their twenties with us. All Covid secure and we met some old friends from down there out side and socially distanced.

MB will be on next calling me a champagne socialist no doubt !
 
Yeah my mum and dad did the same for us - usually Rhyl in a caravan - Robin Hood camp I think it was called - and we did the same for our kids when they were little. First week in September this year when we were allowed to we had a week in Bournemouth in a caravan and took my two kids in their twenties with us. All Covid secure and we met some old friends from down there out side and socially distanced.

MB will be on next calling me a champagne socialist no doubt !

I think you're quite safe with a caravan in Rhyl mate.
 
You must be concerned with your chalet in the Alps pal?
Had to let him go mate.

And the holiday home in the south of France. Don't even get me started on what happened to the Bentley.
 
Which is kind of the point. Everything so far is about removal, of things being taken away. Some big, some small, but the direction of travel is what you have, you will no longer have.

So, where is the counter argument? What does Brexit bring? How does Brexit make life that little bit easier, that little bit better?

I’m not talking about grand visions, but the small things, tell me what Brexit adds.

The floor is open. Over to you.
The small narrative over the big vision is why I could not support remain.

I don't think there is one specific tangible thing that leaving the EU will enhance in UK life, but it gives the chance for a grand vision to be achieved. Now, there are two grand visions associated with leave, one is the ERG/Classical Liberal/Libertarian vision of unfettered neo liberalism, free market expansionist, corporatist domination, the other is a Socialist vision of regulated markets, statist capital controls and reduction of inequality. They both share some distinct similarities in that immigration control and national sovereignty are to the fore, but for differing reasons. If you are Pro EU, you resign yourself to a watered down version of what the UK ERG/Classical Liberals/Libertarians desire in that neo - liberalist ideology will still be prevalent, albeit not as extreme as the afore mentioned. It rules out any real possibility of leftist policies being enacted. The EU is a comfort blanket for liberals, but it is an inherently right wing project that locks out the left from political decision making and in that sense it is anti democratic. Yes the EU has thrown some sops to the working classes such as the working time directive but is main focus is on the enhancement on corporate control of the economy. In January 2015, the radical left party Syriza was elected, with its leader Alexis Tsipras declaring “Greece is leaving behind destructive austerity.” Jean-Claude Juncker, president of the European Commission, responded that “To suggest that everything is going to change because there's a new government in Athens is to mistake dreams for reality… There can be no democratic choice against the European treaties.”
The economic warfare unleashed on Greece by the Troika witnessed living standards slashed, services privatised and workers' rights dismantled as part of what the Jubilee Debt Campaign has called “The Never-Ending Austerity Story”. That is the EU that exists, it is neo-liberal to its core and it is anti democrat as Juncker declares.

Meanwhile, the refugee crisis laid bare the callousness of Europe's rulers as thousands drowned fleeing war and instability. The EU deployed gunships despite criticism from aid groups such as the Red Cross and then made the deal of shame that saw the forced relocation of migrants from Greece to Turkey. UN High Commissioner for Human Rights Zeid Ra'ad Al Hussein argued that “resources currently deployed for ineffective border control systems could instead be invested in maximizing the benefit of regular migration channels" The EU is in effect becoming a closed state that ignores obligations to the UN.

The Labour PLP was complicit in this by supporting the EU and its neo-liberal agenda, Corbyn had an avowed anti EU position for decades but was forced by the likes of Keith into the disastrous second referendum position/sitting on the fence position, which has all but destroyed leftist politics in this country such is the overarching might of the neo liberal EU position.

Now you can argue, BREXIT what does it do for me, it stops me living in a hut in the Austrian Alps, or a beach hut on Corsica, it stops your kids going to University in Unterhacing and yes the scary people on the RW of UK politics may make a killing out of BREXIT and that should be avoided of course, but it is a small price to pay if it means Leftism can be resurrected and the UK finally sees the RW clowns for what they are and votes in a proper Socialist government that puts people before profit and co-operatives before corporations.

I must admit it took me a long time to come to this position, because the EU did temper some of the ravages of Thatcherism and i also didn't really understand the complexity of the arguments. I have listened to hours of James O'Brien who is pro EU so i could work out what the counter arguments where and why they were important. I am still nowhere near educated enough to know what i really need to know, but i know enough to see that leaving without a deal despite its dangers and it being desired by the crackpot RW is the way we have to go and it is the only way i can foresee for the UK to have the Socialist state i really want.
 
Yes. Nobody I work with has said they've been on 'holiday' this year, or last, pre-COVID, except for a couple who pooled their wages and went for a week in Iceland.

I'd love to live in your world, pal, I really would. £359 on furlough. Can you survive on that?
A week in Iceland would cost more than a month in Spain.
 
Had to let him go mate.

And the holiday home in the south of France. Don't even get me started on what happened to the Bentley.
How much do you think it costs for lets say a week all inclusive in Spain, that makes it a holiday for the privileged jet setter. How much a week would you need in disposable income to pay for it? £6 a week should do it.
Can every one afford it no, can most people pretty much yes if they want to.
 
I am loving the whole charade of the usual suspects on political thread that normally shout about the concerns of the downtrodden, underpaid victims of privilege of the UK attacking one of their own for highlighting that they have been underpaid and have lacked the privileges others are using to rub in their faces! XD
 
Had to let him go mate.

And the holiday home in the south of France. Don't even get me started on what happened to the Bentley.

Sorry pal Bentleys are nice I have had to sell one of mine, don’t have time to wash it with all the wasted time doing inconvenient Brexity stuff that hasn’t happened yet.

As you are no doubt replacing it with a Vauxhall Corsa can you tell me what things you like about the car that you haven’t experienced yet. Nothing big just a small thing you like about the car you haven’t even sat in . Maybe you like the air freshener you haven’t smelt or the feel of the steering wheel you haven’t turned?

Please don’t be shy there must be something, i will tell you it’s still shit afterwards but I think we would both be expecting that anyhow, don’t you agree?
 
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