Coronavirus (2021) thread

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vincent said:
Yes they are but just feels wrong especially when people can’t travel a few miles up the road. Just train in bloody Glasgow.
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For what it’s worth, I agree it’s silly. But give someone an inch and they’ll take a mile. The government have allowed this, in fact, they encouraged it months ago when one of their ministers (G.Shapps) travelled to Spain. Right now the Daily Mail has celebrities and high profile individuals plastered across their newspaper all abroad, which probably doesn’t help people’s mood when they’re being told they can’t leave their house to go for a coffee but if they have the means, they’re well within their rights to jump on a plane to escape and return when the hard work has been done in getting the virus down.

I’m becoming more hostile to the idea of a lockdown when there isn’t a level playing field.
 
Interesting to see what has happened in places like Wilmslow, Poynton, Macclesfield etc which were in tier 2 when GM was in three. Unsurprisingly cases have risen which is further evidence that all regions need to have the same measures otherwise people will look for loopholes and go wherever they can for a pint.
 
domalino said:
You should tell the CEO of Astrazeneca that because just a few days ago he was on the news confirming that they would be delivering 2m doses per week by the 3rd week of January.
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There is a difference in him delivering it which I believe he could do and completing a vaccination. It’s the capacity of the end user delivery by the NHS which is not confirmed yet. Israel is achieving 150,000 per day at present by running 24 x 7 and enlisting medics from their armed services as well as their health system. We should be moving heaven and earth and getting every available trained person behind this be they from the army, private health or the NHS.
I wonder who is responsible for making this happen. Please god they have a good person leading this as their only responsibility.
 
kaz7 said:
They must have based it on more than ten patients , they are gp's who have been on since the start and must have read clinical trials and unpublished data that we havent seen ? They were both very adament about it
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Its based on the phase three trial data.

You can read it here, table 5, data after 21 days post 1st jab.

Ten patients hospitalised on placebo, zero on active.

Like I said, these are great data, just be cautious extrapolating too far. I don't think anyone expects real world hospitalizations to be zero post vaccination. Massively down, absolutely.

 
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Marvin said:
My concern is on the South African variant and its effect on the vaccines.
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Total scare story stuff. The Sage member who spread this story needs to be sacked from Sage as his comments go against all scientific method.
There are 7 vaccines in use across the world now; Pfizer, Moderna, Oxford, 1 Russian, 1 Indian and 2 Chinese. All target different parts of the spike protein chains. Unless the virus has totally changed its Spike protein a good proportion of the vaccines will still work and the Oxford vaccine can be retargetted within 3 months (with re-approval).
 
kaz7 said:
Found out from two drs on this morning that the vaccine gives you 100% protection against being hospitalised and death , where are the media in this
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It was discussed in here about 3 weeks ago and mentioned a few times since.

After one of the doctors appeared on TV and explained why the approval of the vaccine was being held back a few weeks.

The NHS knew two weeks ahead of Christmas exactly what was going on and why and some patients were even told when they would likely be able to have the Oxford vaccine in mid December. To the very day. Doubt that was just guesswork.

They felt it was worth doing that to get approval for this side of the regime because stopping people being hospitalised - which Oxford does much better than any other vaccine so far - was the primary need in January / February to stop the NHS being swamped with patients and unable to cope.

It was obvious to us in here that was the real game changer of the arrival of Oxford as if you make it a milder illness and stop the sickest getting sick enough to swamp the NHS you save lives. Not just Covid ones but those who would be lost if the NHS was full of sick Covid people and had no room to save lives from other illnesses.

It is not the first time Blue Moon has been way ahead of the media in noticing things that matter.

Not that that is especially hard given the agenda driven media we have in the UK.
 
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ayrshire_blue said:
All I know is I sense a drastic change in tone from you guys from when the vaccines were beginning to be approved early December time, and it makes me anxious.
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The government has simply not reacted to the rise in cases post lock down 2.

The new variant is part of this, but also the more general strategy to allow numbers to rise until hospitals are in trouble is at the root of it.

Numbers have now been allowed to get so out of hand vaccinating alone can't solve the problem.

We have to get cases down, or we'll simply infect the entire country before we can vaccinate.

I'm much less worried in the short term about vaccine effectiveness against emerging strains. There seems to be low risk there.

Longer term, attempting to vaccinate during a huge outbreak means there is much more driving force for mutations (the virus is much more exposed to vaccinated, or worse partially vaccinated subjects, so vaccine resistant mutations are selected for). We don't know how likely this is, but again, this makes reducing prevalence imperative.

The good news is that the genetically engineered nature of these vaccines makes developing one against a new variant much easier than would historically have been the case.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
There is a difference in him delivering it which I believe he could do and completing a vaccination. It’s the capacity of the end user delivery by the NHS which is not confirmed yet. Israel is achieving 150,000 per day at present by running 24 x 7 and enlisting medics from their armed services as well as their health system. We should be moving heaven and earth and getting every available trained person behind this be they from the army, private health or the NHS.
I wonder who is responsible for making this happen. Please god they have a good person leading this as their only responsibility.
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Been saying this for a while now. We are simply not mobilising enough people to carry out the vaccinations and the system is weighed down in bureaucracy. Giving a vaccine job isn't such a big deal, they could even post it out to those at home who feel comfortable giving it to family members. Ive had a hepatitis jab in my house administered by a family member. Just bought it at a travel clinic and my mother in law gave it to me, its not illegal, Its not for everyone but I bet there are millions of people that would be prepared to take responsibility for themselves and do this. This country is weighed down in bureaucracy and nanny state H and S and in danger of missing the bigger picture.
 
BlueAnorak said:
The Oxford vaccine pretty much stops all deaths on one dose. But Serious illness is still there as is normal illness.
The Pfizer and Moderna vaccines don't have this information yet.
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I've not looked at Moderna, but the data is available for Pfizer.

Table S5 (supplementary data) from the NEJM publication:

9 severe cases on placebo, one on active


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kippaxwarrior said:
Hancock has just said hes very worried about the South African strain is more transmissible. If that's the case and they have the data to suggest that why are we not going into full lockdown?
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for the spike receptor is the same mutation as ours so in theory should be the same transmissibility as ours. Unless some other mutations are in play as well. Ours is 17/20 different mutations.
 
Wales data :

1897 cases (it was 2273 last Monday)

From just under 13,000 tests, 14,6% positivity.

25 deaths - it was 15 last Monday.
 
CTID Chris said:
So pretty much at herd immunity levels by then, adding on vaccination numbers and previous cases. Sounds like Boris has solved the COVID problem!

( /s )
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Yup. That's the trajectory we're on. Run through the whole population before vaccinating.
 
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