Italy v England | Euro 2020 Final

What will the result be?

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give it to gordon said:
I said it last night and the more I think about it the pissed of I get ( and I dont really follow England )

But with the two Italians centre halfs on yellow cards for about 60 minutes. Why didnt Southgate go at them ?

Grealish left wing, Sancho right right, Sterling central forward all with instructions to run at the centre halfs. But them under pressure to commit fouls.

But no Southgate stuck with Kane who played straight into the Italians hands.

At no point throughout this tournament did Southgate go for it. It was boring football, and when teams put England under pressure hoofball would return. Yet in some games England kept the ball well.
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I agree with this.
A total change later in the game.
Playing Raz through the middle with Sancho and maybe Saint Findus Rashford.
Grealish supplying the ammo would still have had six holding.
The Italians were very happy to let Easter Island bring the ball out of defence but cut the flanks down and left a bit of room centrally but we had nobody to draw in their defence at all.
 
The defeat lies solely on Southgates shoulders.

I wouldn't of minded sitting back if we were 2-0 up.

Late subs, change of tactics, bringing on Rashford and Sancho so late.

Allowing the penalty takers to go in that order, list in endless.

After watching Southgates side all competition, doesn't half make me appreciate the football we play under Pep.

I do think its a mistake Southgate stays on until 2022, but there isn't many managers with an appetite to be a international manager
 
BlueHammer85 said:
that doesn't relate when he is apparently picking the wrong players and tactics.
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You just stick to being proud of the brave lions and their magnificent effort led by a forward thinking tactical genius and enjoy.
Let others who aren't quite so blinded by the wool being pulled over their eyes talk about the reasons you were outwitted and outclassed when it matters.
If you cant be critical of of something that is so obvious then you're part of the problem and I've read it a few times on this thread.
England will always be stuck in a cycle of failure whilst supporters are just grateful for getting far in a tournament and class it as success.
It's reeks of small time thinking.
 
Pablo1 said:
You just stick to being proud of the brave lions and their magnificent effort led by a forward thinking tactical genius and enjoy.
Let others who aren't quite so blinded by the wool being pulled over their eyes talk about the reasons you were outwitted and outclassed when it matters.
If you cant be critical of of something that is so obvious then you're part of the problem and I've read it a few times on this thread.
England will always be stuck in a cycle of failure whilst supporters are just grateful for getting far in a tournament and class it as success.
It's reeks of small time thinking.
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we was a penalty shoot out away from winning our first major tournament in 55 years - so yes i'm proud of how good we done and proud of these lot on and off the pitch.

It's fine to be critical, that's all part and parcel of the game - but to say we got to the final despite of Southgate doesn't make any sense when he is playing the wrong formation and players, if that was the case we wouldn't have got this far.
 
BlueHammer85 said:
we was a penalty shoot out away from winning our first major tournament in 55 years - so yes i'm proud of how good we done and proud of these lot on and off the pitch.

It's fine to be critical, that's all part and parcel of the game - but to say we got to the final despite of Southgate doesn't make any sense when he is playing the wrong formation and players, if that was the case we wouldn't have got this far.
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You can hide behind the fact it went to penaltys as vindication that everything is rosy but that would be just accepting failure.
That game was there to be won and the manager didn't know how to get the job done and was too scared to attempt anything other than caution.
Of course it's the case England got to the final because of the quality of players at their disposal, mixed with a run of games where you were large favourites and home advantage it'd have been an absolute flop to have not got as far as they did.
When it mattered your third tier manager produced a third tier performance and blew the best opportunity to win a trophy you'll likely get again for a long long time.
Unless of course he finally realises that to win games it helps to have players who know how to attack and not rely on not conceding.
 
Pablo1 said:
You can hide behind the fact it went to penaltys as vindication that everything is rosy but that would be just accepting failure.
That game was there to be won and the manager didn't know how to get the job done and was too scared to attempt anything other than caution.
Of course it's the case England got to the final because of the quality of players at their disposal, mixed with a run of games where you were large favourites and home advantage it'd have been an absolute flop to have not got as far as they did.
When it mattered your third tier manager produced a third tier performance and blew the best opportunity to win a trophy you'll likely get again for a long long time.
Unless of course he finally realises that to win games it helps to have players who know how to attack and not rely on not conceding.
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I was obviously happy at reaching the final, but was aghast at some of the shit I had to watch getting there and in the final. God ! We were a hard watch at times.
 
Bill Walker said:
I hope he resigns.
He's out of his depth. Like KK admitted he was.
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I don't think there is a cats chance in hell of that mate.
England fans better hope he can learn and develop because the team wont win anything without that happening.
There will hardly be a queue of elite coaches waiting for the job when he goes either. There are very few English coaches who would do a markedly superior job. Only three are rated above him on squawka (not that its a reliable reference) Dyche, Gerrard and Potter. Gerrard maybe albeit I think he is pretty much nailed on for the Dippers after Klopp. I think Southgate has the capability to learn and develop, he is reputably openminded, thoughtful and will no doubt reflect hard on why the Italy game was almost an identical rerun of Croatia in the last world cup. It would not take much for him to go 4-1-2-3 for the next few games and see if his squad are as talented as some (and the media) think.
 
BlueHammer85 said:
we was a penalty shoot out away from winning our first major tournament in 55 years - so yes i'm proud of how good we done and proud of these lot on and off the pitch.

It's fine to be critical, that's all part and parcel of the game - but to say we got to the final despite of Southgate doesn't make any sense when he is playing the wrong formation and players, if that was the case we wouldn't have got this far.
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I think there was a lot to be proud of. Overall the behaviour of manager and players was a beacon of light in an ever darkening England. They were exemplary in victory and defeat.
I think you are right that Southgate will get England to the latter stages of competition but he wont win one until he develops more tactical flexibility and bravery. He is more than capable intellectually of doing that and losing two matches in competition in almost exactly the same way is a big encouragement for him to reflect long and hard. The next few games will tell us a great deal.
 
C
Uffa said:
But enough with the compliments, we must also have some flaws mate.

Anyway about yesterday's game; going by your comments, one thing Englishmen seem to not have grasped yet is that there's no such thing as a team "deserving" to win. If we'd lost on penalties to you guys we wouldn't have deserved to win just because we had more chances, possession or attacking football. You win if you score more goals than the opponent, simple as. We know that very well. There's no consolation prize for "chances not scored". Obviously if you have more of the ball it's more likely that you'll manage to put it in the net, but if you have no striker (us all tournament with Immobile being invisible and an utter disgrace) it surely complicates things. I can tell you yesterday was a very frustrating watch for you and us both, albeit for different reasons. As a side note, it was clear to everyone that you had the best squad of the two.

I'm obviously over the moon for the boys (Chiello in particular) and for Mancio though, and I'm also happy that Chiesa managed to shine and show his character during these games. It's actually funny how quickly I've warmed up to Mancini ever since he's become the NT coach, despite him being a former Inter manager. He's both reserved and very intense.

Regarding Southgate's decisions during the match; just like everyone else I found it odd when he sent on Sancho and Rashford for penalties at the last minute, because young wing-strikers would never be my choice, especially with no game-time in their legs. Apart from that, from an outsider's perspective he's always seemed quite classy and nice throughout the Euros, but he seems still somewhat shaky on game-management decisions. He doesn't look like a very assertive figure. The fact is that he has a squad that's packed full of young talented players and to manage that you have to be very sure of yourself and have very clear roles, hierarchy and gameplan in mind, otherwise it's always going to turn into shaky, "wing it during the match" type of decisions. But that's just my two cents and tbf I know very little about Southgate or the English squad's internal dynamics. Let's say that he fits your team because he's not old; he's eager and somewhat inexperienced so he can grow together with the team, but that didn't necessarily make him the best choice for immediate success of course.
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Chiello has many strings to his bow and orchestrated everything.
 
Protein Junkie said:
Chiello has many strings to his bow and orchestrated everything.
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Including a grand master of the dark arts: Nothing Waistcoat could have done under the circumstances.
Is this what the beautiful game has come too? Kiricocho my arse!

VAR: Voodhoo Assistant Referee and no where to be seen.
 
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its so so funny seeing the media not still asking the questions we all want to here ? FODEN. why did he spend most of the euros on the bench ? plus news coming out that rashford was not fit and need a operation on his shoulder ? so why was he in the squad in the first place
 
ancoats said:
its so so funny seeing the media not still asking the questions we all want to here ? FODEN. why did he spend most of the euros on the bench ? plus news coming out that rashford was not fit and need a operation on his shoulder ? so why was he in the squad in the first place
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For me, Southgate was "obliged" to have the best creative talent the country has had in many a year, because had these players not been called up, there would have been an outcry from fellow managers, pundits and pros.

The issue is Southgates style doesn't maximise this creativity and England don't get the best out of them.

Sadly, whilst Southgate is the gaffer, unless he can adopt new tactics to best utilise the talent at his disposal, England will suffer.
 


Listening to that, and what Schmeichel said before the semi-final, I really wish our media would stop with all this "it's coming home" stuff. It makes us look entitled, disrespectful and arrogant. The truth is England are the biggest underachievers in international football, considering the history, players we've had, popularity of the sport and the Premier League, and money invested in the game. Yet despite all of that, one trophy to show for it all, 55 years ago!
 
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