Where have all the police gone?

I don't know the examples you are referring to but not everybody likes the police-so publishing details of private vehicles etc on line isn't something you can ignore..they aren't terrorists-and as a former custody inspector I'd be less than impressed if they were nicked for TACT offences (because I would need to quickly get my books out to revise what to do-because the detention law is totally different!)...
If you are very very bored one day google audits of police stations on youtube. Loads of these cunts. (koleeberks, auditing britain, DJaudits etc etc)
 
My lad starts secondary school on Monday and he's a mild mannered lad, I've told him if anybody starts on him to tell them my dad will be at the school gate with a baseball bat to end them.
Only way to sort the fucking cunts.
sad but so very true.......I learned that in the 60's in Gorton
 
I think you deal with it at the time, retirment has left time to reflect-which is not always a good thing.

Nonetheless, it is more to give evidence of what people go through-like in many occupations; people want to do a good job. It often feels like a thankless job though-I've seen so many colleagues go through terrible experiences and you do wonder what the point was.

The solutions are there though-but it needs huge investment to undo the damage done by the last decade.

You have young officers on the frontline with 20/30 crimes to investigate, and still need to respond to calls every shift-the time simply does not exist to provide a quality service.

In my own force people are leaving in their droves.
Where would such investment go to, aside from where any previous investment has already gone to?

They've nearly got as much new tech as NASA already. lol
 
Where would such investment go to, aside from where any previous investment has already gone to?

They've nearly got as much new tech as NASA already. lol
To undo the last 10 years for starters-40k new recruits, pay, thousands of admin staff, rural police stations/contact points-national training centres, cps, courts…it would run into hundreds of millions if not more.
 
Patel calling for police to return to basics conveniently removes herself from the actual problem. They are the cause of this. I can assure you police want to deal with crime.
I'm sure they do mate. I am trying to understand what's gone wrong, not to point blame at police officers.
 
There is also a growing and insidious movement to undermine the police. You see it whenever a police officer is involved in a crime such as the heinous Sarah Everard case where all the great work done by tens of thousands of policemen is ignored and an aberrant example is held up as being somehow indicative of an "institutionalised" malaise.
 
absolutely spot on, post of the day, from someone who was there and witnessed how the cuts have decimated the police
I agree it was a good post, but cuts absolutely have NOT decimated the police. Putting aside the pedantic point that decimated means reduced by 90%, there's more active police officers in the force today, with more resources, than for most of the time over the past 50 years. Yes, the numbers are slightly reduced compared to the peak in 2010, but to say they are "decimated" is nonsense.

Hence my opening post of "where are they???"
 
I can understand all of that mate, but SURELY over the last 50 years and also with all the new tech we have, there have been efficiency improvements?

Anecdotally, how many police are at the Etihad on a Saturday now? Compared with back in the 70s when there was fucking battalions of them.
50 years ago an officer walking his beat would see a couple of young acrotes hanging around on the corner. Whilst they weren't doing anything illegal at the time, he likely knew them from the neighbourhood.

He'd tell them to get on down the road. They'd go because they had an idea what may happen if they didn't. Nowadays, teenagers will likely tell the officer to fuck off. And the officer fucks off because there is nothing he can do about it.

Not saying the old way was better, just different in how things were done.
 
The issue isn't inspecting people's work, it's making the people who do the work do the inspecting and collect the data for you. Teachers having to send electronic versions of lesson plans to people who will never read them, for example. Imagine if you worked in an Amazon warehouse and to help management measure productivity, you had to fill in a form every time you fulfilled an order. Well you'd have a great record of everything that happened, but what happened would be about half as much.
Of course. That's why I said it was a balance. The other end of the scale is an absolute free-for-all where everyone does what the fuck they like and skives off at 3 every day and no-one gives a toss.
 
50 years ago an officer walking his beat would see a couple of young acrotes hanging around on the corner. Whilst they weren't doing anything illegal at the time, he likely knew them from the neighbourhood.

He'd tell them to get on down the road. They'd go because they had an idea what may happen if they didn't. Nowadays, teenagers will likely tell the officer to fuck off. And the officer fucks off because there is nothing he can do about it.

Not saying the old way was better, just different in how things were done.
Ah. the good old days of "proper" policing ;-)

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Edit, I laughed out loud at "bum conkers". Not heard that one before
 
And yet when my sister was (wrongly, I might add) suspected of blackmailing someone, literally about 8 or 9 of them turned up at her house in the morning in 3 or 4 cars. For a single woman living on her own in a posh suburb.

1 would have done.
Yes. One probably would have been fine for the situation you described but two would be better.

The reason for 3 or 4 cars, I am guessing, is because if they thought they would have to go into her home they don't know who's there. Is she there by herself? Does she have a husband or boyfriend? Are there adult male friends staying with her? Better to have 6 or 8 and have a couple of officers who aren't needed than 1 and all of a sudden find yourself alone faced with your sister's boyfriend and his two adult sons once you walk into the house.
 
Ignoring the usual rubbish, lets look at what has actually happened.

I try to ignore these type of conversations nowadays because its not particularly good for me and those who already have their 'views' won't change them.

Nonetheless, I served for 25 years, 17 of which was as a response Inspector and then custody Inspector. I worked with some of the bravest, hardest working people you could ever meet. A tiny minority were poor-and the majority of those weeded out quickly.

I also saw things you dont forget and met some of the most violent people you could imagine.

Policing though is in crisis.

When I joined in 95 my force was bouyant-we had strong, experienced response teams, teams of detectives who were skilled and experienced and a command team that did their thing. It was a tough job to get into to; pay and conditions were decent and the pension very worthwhile.

Late 90s saw huge investment, the development of Neighbourhood policing and the advent of 'intelligence led policing'. Computers replaced typewriters which increased efficiency but slowly reduced time on the streets in order to complete paperwork. Admin/Civilian staff proliferated around this time too. In general morale was high. However, with the computers came an obsession with stats, targets and performance indicators-command officers/home office who were blissfully ignorant of performance now had the tools to monitor and often micro manage. But overall things were still good and the job worked.

From 2010 onwards the the policing landscape changed. Cuts were savage, year on year. Pay was frozen for a decade (real terms 20% cut over that period). Pension contributions increased by almost 20% and the actual pension for many was crippled; so much so that many questioned whether it was worth 30 years of grief to get to that point. Simply put you could now earn more from flipping burgers without the agro. In addition 'A19' meant that officers with 30 years+ service were all pensioned off-all that experience binned.

Neighbourhood policing disappeared-so too did vital links to the community, intellience led policing no longer functioning. Hundreds of police stations and contact points sold off. Officers withdrawn to cities, towns and hubs.

Cuts have consequence. Recruitment suffered-instead of people older with life experience, it became kids who would accept 19k a year and crap terms. Vetting was cut. Training cut back. More and more online-officers tied to computers.

Meanwhile a half of all courts have closed. Huge cuts to cps. It can take years to get to court.

In the community cuts to other services (NHS, social care) and the proliferation of drug use and mental health have meant that around half of all police time is taken up by mental health, missing persons, concerns for safety, 'baby sitting' vulnerable people at hospital, sitting with them in custody. In the last few years the law changed so that a police station (and therefore a cell) was no longer deemed a place of safety for a s136 mental health patient. Try to have that discussion with a local NHS bed manager at 4 in the morning when you have somebody who needs help and is locked in one of your cells? Do you simply release them? After all its illegal to keep them there but NHS are saying they have no beds in the entire country-yet that person has committed no crime...that was a weekly occurrence for me. And that would be one detainee among 50-80-the overwhelming majority with mental health issues, drug induced problems, self harm issues-so that those detainees would take officers from the streets to watch them in the cells-and many others sat outside hospitals with other people. Lines of police vehicles sat outside A&E's waiting to be seen.

As others have alluded to, new technology; 'internet crime', mobile phones etc have brought their own challenges in terms of the ability to deal with these 'crimes' and the amount of time it conusmes.

Now I haven't mentioned political parties* but its very convenient that the media is happy to portray the image of a handful of officers at pride events or similar-what is so wrong with that? What is so bad about promoting inclusion and diversity? Moreover, its a very convenient way of distracting the public from the real problems facing the service.

The job like many public services needs huge investment. You cannot expect to pay somebody 19k and attract quality, and then expect them to give 30+ years service, to work nights for decades, get assaulted regularly, spat at, treated like shit, threatened-lose almost every xmas/new year, most weekends...why would you?

But equally investment in the service-a return to high standards, recruitment-(I would estimate it would need 40,000 new police to recover from the cuts, resignations and retirement of the last decade), vetting, training-standards of appearance, uniform, discipline. A return to neighbourhood policing models. Investment in promotion and leadership.

None of this can happen though without huge investment in the NHS, social care, mental health, education, drug diversion etc etc. Because the officer you need to see isn't dealing with 'crime' they are dealing with all manner of things unrelated to that and nothing will change unless that changes.

*tories are c*nts.

There is no aspect of society they won't undermine or fuck up, because after all there is no such thing as society is there?

A hallmark of the last 12 years has been the number of people I know in various jobs, inc. police, teachers and doctors who can now add 'part time social worker' to their list of skills because they are left holding the baby (or middle aged man in crisis or mentally ill teenager, take your pick) because there is literally no else to do it.
 
I agree it was a good post, but cuts absolutely have NOT decimated the police. Putting aside the pedantic point that decimated means reduced by 90%, there's more active police officers in the force today, with more resources, than for most of the time over the past 50 years. Yes, the numbers are slightly reduced compared to the peak in 2010, but to say they are "decimated" is nonsense.

Hence my opening post of "where are they???"
Decimated is not hyperbole. You compound it with similar savage cuts in other public services, and exaggerated by the rise in technology crime and a mental health crisis plus erosion in pay and conditions. It’s a mix that has broken the service. It was always just managing-it reached a tipping point a few years ago.
 
There is no aspect of society they won't undermine or fuck up, because after all there is no such thing as society is there?

A hallmark of the last 12 years has been the number of people I know in various jobs, inc. police, teachers and doctors who can now add 'part time social worker' to their list of skills because they are left holding the baby (or middle aged man in crisis or mentally ill teenager, take your pick) because there is literally no else to do it.
Yes totally.
 
Decimated is not hyperbole. You compound it with similar savage cuts in other public services, and exaggerated by the rise in technology crime and a mental health crisis plus erosion in pay and conditions. It’s a mix that has broken the service. It was always just managing-it reached a tipping point a few years ago.

I think this is the thing people sometimes don't get, the 'system' has a high number of interdependencies it needs all agencies to be functioning well or at least adequately for things to work properly. The compound effect of cuts in multiple services is enormous and it becomes a vicious downward spiral.
 

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