Matheus Nunes

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DMA's said:
It does frustrate me that city are so quick to to brag about how much money they have made from selling x,y and z academy products. It just stinks of a very insecure mindset, a desperation to be accepted & admired by the wide football community. We all know that won’t ever happen and the narrative we just spend spend spend will continue.

This transfer window hasn’t gone well and as a result we may just have to suck it up and slightly overpay for Nunes. The market has changed and we will not get worldwide acclaim for refusing to pay above our valuation. Just feels like cutting our nose to spite our face.

As it stands we haven’t got the squad capable of competing for all 4 competitions (which is clearly the clubs aim). An injury to rodri and the season could be similar to the 2019/20 campaign. We have yet another chance to make history by becoming the first side to win 4 prem titles in a row. I just don’t understand why city seemingly are willing to put that achievement in serious jeopardy by hampering pep and weakening the squad.
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Do we brag about it? It’s more that we are praised for it rather than us bragging about it.

The market hasn’t changed that much. It was five years ago that Coutinho very dodgiily went to Barcelona for £142m. He was a worth about £40m and went for over £100m over that. It upped the market somewhat but we still got Kovačić, Håland, Álvarez, Akanji, Aké, Rodri, Cancelo and Mahrez all for cheaper than half of Coutinho-to-Barça at the top end and over £125m cheaper at the lower end, after that.

It’s only really Chelsea who are spending stupid money with a few other PL clubs trying to cash-in because of the stupidness of Chelsea, but the rest of football is still generally operating at a reasonable level, including City. There were calls for City to spend £125m on Bellingham on here but he only went to Madrid for £88m in the end.

This season is just one of an ongoing infinite number of future football seasons. Yes, it would be magic to win a fourth PL title in a row and b2b CLs. I’ll be gutted if we don’t, but football carries on forever and City aren’t going anywhere in the near future in terms of being a top club and in five years’ time we will look back on this season (if we don’t achieve what we want) and not really care about it.

Football isn’t about individual seasons, it’s about a long term legacy. Nobody cares about 2019-20 anymore even though we missed out on three PL titles in a row and still hadn’t won the CL and it was only four years ago. It was just one season out of all past seasons, just like this season is just one season out of all future seasons.
 
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Psychedelic Casual said:
Look at the players though:
Rice - decent enough but only worth around £70m, we bid £80m and he went for £105m. Glad we didn’t get him.
Paqueta - not bad but I said back during the World Cup that Brazil wouldn’t do owt in the tournament because their midfield is bobbins and he was the major part of it, only worth around £50m, we bid £70m, WH asking for around £90m. Glad we didn’t get him.
This lad - meh, a bottom half player playing at the quality of a bottom half player, not standing out once last season. worth around £40m even if he performed to a higher standard than he did last season. we’ve put a bid in at £47m which is more than enough but they want £60m and for someone who’ll be a squad player who’s done nothing in 38 PL games to justify that price tag.

I know we really want to win a record fourth PL title in a row and back-to-back CLs, but at what price long term in relation to how much money we have to spend?
We were right to back out of the Koulibaly deal because the price was too high for the actual quality of player and wait 12 months for Dias, we were right to back out of the Kane deal because the price was too high due to his injury record and his age and wait 12 months for Håland… we are right to back out of these deals this Summer because the quality of the players do not match the selling clubs’ valuations. If we have to wait 12 months for another midfielder (hello, Mr Wirtz!), long-term we’ll be right to do so.
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The prices this summer are crazy. I can understand the Paqueta move, there's enough in his performances to see how he could fit in with us. Nunes seems a bit raw still. Very good under pressure, very quick, strong on the ball and excellent at driving forwards with it. But his final ball or shot is lacking, and he probably takes a fair bit of coaching to get to where we need him to. For the money quoted I'd expect more, but that's the market. Like you say, if we can get someone for better value next summer we'll probably wait.

Eze was the one that was possibly "best value" and even then he's overpriced. But he is the one I would understand us paying that money for, because of the English factor and he got a good number of goals and assists for Palace last season.
 
jrb said:
So, we’ve become Barcelona this transfer window. We’ll be constantly pulling levers next.
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Chelsea have fucked the market no doubt but our CEO breaking the professional norm by announcing our forecasted turnover for the financial year and how the business brand is growing so quickly probably wasnt to best business idea with regarding transfers etc?
 
Psychedelic Casual said:
Look at the players though:
Rice - decent enough but only worth around £70m, we bid £80m and he went for £105m. Glad we didn’t get him.
Paqueta - not bad but I said back during the World Cup that Brazil wouldn’t do owt in the tournament because their midfield is bobbins and he was the major part of it, only worth around £50m, we bid £70m, WH asking for around £90m. Glad we didn’t get him.
This lad - meh, a bottom half player playing at the quality of a bottom half player, not standing out once last season. worth around £40m even if he performed to a higher standard than he did last season. we’ve put a bid in at £47m which is more than enough but they want £60m and for someone who’ll be a squad player who’s done nothing in 38 PL games to justify that price tag.

I know we really want to win a record fourth PL title in a row and back-to-back CLs, but at what price long term in relation to how much money we have to spend?
We were right to back out of the Koulibaly deal because the price was too high for the actual quality of player and wait 12 months for Dias, we were right to back out of the Kane deal because the price was too high due to his injury record and his age and wait 12 months for Håland… we are right to back out of these deals this Summer because the quality of the players do not match the selling clubs’ valuations. If we have to wait 12 months for another midfielder (hello, Mr Wirtz!), long-term we’ll be right to do so.
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This sums it up for me very well. I don't see the point of paying over the odds for an average squad player. He's did didly squat at Wolves the past season. City have judged his value and its nowhere near what Wolves think it is. So you move on. Who is to say one of our academy players couldn't do the same job as he did last season. Seems to be the same level of risk compared to what he achieved, aside from the fact that Pep clearly likes the player to a degree.
 
Psychedelic Casual said:
Look at the players though:
Rice - decent enough but only worth around £70m, we bid £80m and he went for £105m. Glad we didn’t get him.
Paqueta - not bad but I said back during the World Cup that Brazil wouldn’t do owt in the tournament because their midfield is bobbins and he was the major part of it, only worth around £50m, we bid £70m, WH asking for around £90m. Glad we didn’t get him.
This lad - meh, a bottom half player playing at the quality of a bottom half player, not standing out once last season. worth around £40m even if he performed to a higher standard than he did last season. we’ve put a bid in at £47m which is more than enough but they want £60m and for someone who’ll be a squad player who’s done nothing in 38 PL games to justify that price tag.

I know we really want to win a record fourth PL title in a row and back-to-back CLs, but at what price long term in relation to how much money we have to spend?
We were right to back out of the Koulibaly deal because the price was too high for the actual quality of player and wait 12 months for Dias, we were right to back out of the Kane deal because the price was too high due to his injury record and his age and wait 12 months for Håland… we are right to back out of these deals this Summer because the quality of the players do not match the selling clubs’ valuations. If we have to wait 12 months for another midfielder (hello, Mr Wirtz!), long-term we’ll be right to do so.
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Sensible logic there PC.
 
jrb said:
So, we’ve become Barcelona this transfer window. We’ll be constantly pulling levers next.
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I know it is a joke but I can't ever see City becoming like Barca in the way that they do their "business ".

Despite the fascination they hold with players. they really look small time in their dealings.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
How did you arrive at your conclusion that 25% to 50% mark up is reasonable ?

You seem to think that just because a player has been in the PL a year and done nothing , his value should automatically go up a huge amount? Seems a very odd conclusion to me.

Do you think the same applies to Calvin Phillips ?

We have tabled an offer of a bit more than Wolves paid. But personally I doubt we are going to just up the fee to anywhere near that.
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Kalvin with a K please.

You know what, IF Kalvin was listed today I do think we would at the very least get our money back and if a couple of clubs wanted him, maybe even a slight profit.

That's how crazy this market has gone, Phillips is a very decent player at a certain level.

As said I have no idea about Nunes the footballer, but that irrelevant in a negotiation for a player that is not up for sale.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
How did you arrive at your conclusion that 25% to 50% mark up is reasonable ?

You seem to think that just because a player has been in the PL a year and done nothing , his value should automatically go up a huge amount? Seems a very odd conclusion to me.

Do you think the same applies to Calvin Phillips ?

We have tabled an offer of a bit more than Wolves paid. But personally I doubt we are going to just up the fee to anywhere near that.
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What Wolves paid and what they want now is their business and whether he has been there ten months or ten years is irrelevant. They can put whatever figure they want on his head
 
If this doesn't happen, here's a thought about Phillips. I guess Pep has decided he can't play the Rodri role ( I agree) as single holding midfielder. However now we've got Kovacic, can he play along side him in the same way as he has done with with Rice for England, the 2 +2 box midfield might suit him better and give an option to play without Rodri in some games. Maybe that's Plan B (or C etc.) if Nunes deal is off. As Corporal Jones said, "Don't panic!"
 
melrose40yarder said:
Lets go the utd and chelsea way and scattergun bids all over the place.Or shall City bid what they think a players worth and if it is not good enough for the selling club walk away.
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Correct look at the business we have done and the Docu one where it looked like other clubs were starting to get interested and we just said yep pay the fee they want even though think it was 5/10m more Than we thought we could get him for..
 
jrb said:
I don‘t think it’s Txiki, or however you spell his name. I think it’s come from higher up. And Txiki has to work within those new transfer guidelines.
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There is nobody higher up in terms of transfers, he’s top dog
 
jrb said:
Neither are other clubs. But if City keep on treating selling clubs as mugs with an initial low ball offer that a club won’t accept and will genuinely be insulted by, don’t expect that club to make the sale of a player we want to buy easy. By all means go in with an initial offer slightly below or below their valuation of the player, but don’t continue taking the piss out of clubs. City will soon get reputation for doing that. It’s a shit and insulting transfer strategy.
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We bid for a player who until recently had a £45m buy out clause, we offered £10m more than they had wanted until this summer. It was removed on the promise if a CL club came calling he’d be allowed to leave for similar money! We have come calling and they now want £15-20m more? That’s mugging City off not the other way round.
We are playing the game, they say £60m, we offer £50m with the realistic belief of a compromise of £55m! We would not have bid that had we not been given a nod to that being accepted. We don’t have time or patience to piss about going to and fro, it serves no purpose.
As for us taking the piss, how? We value him at a set price so bid, they won’t budge so we move on.. it’s standard practice in any negotiating, you never go in at the asking price nor expect to ever pay that. I e never bought a telly without some money off! It’s far from insulting, it’s standard.
 
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