PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

[Boris Yeltsin]

If we are genuinely found guilty, I'll be extemely disappointed in the club. I've always felt the club was operated correctly.

Did we use money to get to where we are? Yes, it played a big part but also because the club had made good decisions with that money. If we find out we broke so many rules along the way, that would be shameful.

Let's be honest, if this was United, we would be tearing into them non-stop. So we can't really expect to be call anything other than cheaters if we are guilty, because we would do exactly the same, let's not pretend otherwise

Not sure how I'll feel about supporting any longer if it emerges we won that we did while not playing by the rules.

If we are genuinely found guilty, I'll be extemely disappointed in the club. I've always felt the club was operated correctly.

Did we use money to get to where we are? Yes, it played a big part but also because the club had made good decisions with that money. If we find out we broke so many rules along the way, that would be shameful.

Let's be honest, if this was United, we would be tearing into them non-stop. So we can't really expect to be call anything other than cheaters if we are guilty, because we would do exactly the same, let's not pretend otherwise

Not sure how I'll feel about supporting any longer if it emerges we won that we did while not playing by the rules.

Do you genuinely have faith in the premier league's ever changing rules?

 

[mexico1970]

I don’t get this mate.

Let’s say we are guilty - that is on the owners. CITY was here long before them and will be here long after they’re gone. They are custodians.

If we’re found guilty and are really bang to rights, I personally won’t support the board anymore but I could never stop supporting CITY.

I support City fans, the rank and file of the supporters who were born wearing the shirt. As you say owners come and go as do players and staff.

Fans however they are very much a constant.

 

[ufo]

I can't believe that people are in a panic over something Simon fucking Jordan of all people has said...

Give your head a wobble lads.

simon fucking jordon is a uncircumcised silicone dildo inside turtle neck

 

[Gone for a Burton]

Ditto my exact thoughts. This shit is not going to settle unless city go on full out offense , medieval style

Heads on spikes, boilng tar, the rack, drawn & quarterd .

No istreee....we'd soon fucking get some !!

 

[spinney]

if the documents are bullshit you must acquit

Which is why I would think hmrc etc would only get involved if the evidence proven we were in the wrong


They don't need to to get involved in the PL bogus cases , they have enough of their own

 

[deano ou812]

Are we still expecting this to finally come out around March time was the estimation if I’m right ?

 

[chesterbells]

Fucking embarrassing.

We have gone from a club probably going to enter administration pre takeover to one of the biggest sports groups in the world whilst smashing hundreds of records on the way, winning trophies we never thought possible, whilst having various corrupt organisations in European and Domestic football stack the odds ever higher against us, all in the last 17 years.

Not to mention, that no other clubs prior to our takeover had fuck all budget restrictions in their whole history, but you would feel let down, fucking pathetic…

Superb mate. A Like just isn’t enough.

 

[calumdown]

Not sure how I'll feel about supporting any longer if it emerges we won that we did while not playing by the rules.

then you have no idea whatsoever what the word supporter means

 

[ufo]

who thinks about ffp , club accounting , club cheated us fans ..etc etc when haaland is scoring hattrick or when our defense is leaking goals? ffs some here

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

thats assuming he didnt actually hold a consultancy role within abu dhabi, im not sure why the idea of him or anybody else holding two similar positions is such a mind blowing concept, but yes if thats what it was used for it could be used as a creative way of topping up his salary but so could a multitude of other ways so it doesnt effectively mean anything.

It is routine and perfectly legal. It is a legal way of reducing your tax burden and happens in all industries with the full knowledge of HMRC. The Mancini payment structure is commonplace in football and was initiated even before FFP existed. The same is true of players' and image rights deals. This happened at all major clubs in Europe for the last 20 years. I am not aware of UEFA or the PL asking any other clubs about these sort of arrangements, certainly not to the extent of going back 16 years. What has happened to City is nothing more than a witchunt. It is discrimination and that's why the club will not budge an inch from their position.

 

[Gone for a Burton]

Many of us FOCs were City fans before the UAE existed. Makes a difference methinks.

Can you explain what difference it would've made and why please ?

 

[blue by birth]

So what if clubs prior to our takeover had no restrictions? You don't live by the law of 100 years ago do you?

If there's clear rules in place and we broke them with dodgy financial dealings, then it does taint our success,whether you like it or not.

Do you not think city fans would be calling for the relegation of rival clubs if they were in our position?

So if the Premier League introduce rules stating that teams that play in blue from Manchester aren't allowed to win trophies..would you still think we should abide by the said rule??
The rules keep getting rewritten to hinder us ..I don't think we have done anything wrong but if we have then it's because of the fucking ridiculous rules they keep trying to impose on us.
There were no fucking ffp or fsr rules when the rag cunts and the murderers were cleaning up the silverware..so fuck them..

 

[jrb]

 

[Eric Hitchmough]

Jesus wept. Scholes and Carragher struggling to hide their hard-ons as soon as that other City-hating **** mentions the word “fraud”.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

I support the team on the pitch.

Financials mean nothing to me. Football is corrupt all the way up to FIFA. I dont care about transfer fees or wages as its not my money.

Tbf if ethics were ever a real problem, you should have jumped ship once the UAE consortium took over.

If we're found guilty, then it's whatever and ill move forward with it. You still have to go out and win those games. United have proved high expenditure only gets you so far.

Agree with your broad point. But we were not taken over by a UAE consortium and, even if we had, what difference would that make to any ethical concerns? City were purchased by Sheikh Mansour and since then US-based investors Silver Lake have also bought about 25 per cent. We also had a small investment from a Chinese consortium for a brief period but they seem to have pulled out.

 

[Gone for a Burton]

Human rights in the United Arab Emirates - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Take your time.

I'm not saying this has ever been a sticking point to me. My phone is made via slave labor and I probably buy a shit ton of stuff that's tied to some type of international evil as well, but im not going to claim the UAE is some glorious haven of democracy just because one of their higher-ups bankrolled us winning the Champions League.

The UAE has never been,or claimed to be, a democracy.

Its a Union of ruling families governing in an elighted and 'benevolent' manner.

Simple, clear and understandable laws for business and the internationl population.

Break the rules (Your contract with the Union), and the sanctions will be swift, appropriate and warranted.

It enjoys almost zero levels of crime, anti-social behaviour or illegal immigration.

Its a beautiful, diverse 'country', a great place to live, work or holiday !!

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

You never asked me this when you interviewed me for that chief make-up artist role?

Part time second assistant to the deputy chief make-up artist. And you didn’t get the job.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

No change in my camp.

We know nothing with any certainty, I fall back on do I believe the clubs leadership when they say they have done nothing wrong and they have irrefutable evidence to prove it.

There was no "evidence" to prove practically the same serious charges at CAS.

IMO the scandal is in fact UEFA circumvented its own rules to impose a ban for which there was no evidence (12 times) to sufficiently support their charges.

There is no "evidence" in the public domain to suggest otherwise. Have the PL acquired more documents, yes, but nobody knows what they are or if they prove City did anything wrong with respect to any of the charges, let alone the more serious allegations of fraud, to the necessary standard.

So now we learn from the APT case that the PL's rules in some aspects are unlawful and unfair, also have treated us like pariahs, have been disgraceful in the dealings with our sponsorships and been disingenuous and deliberately instigated delays in at least two cases.

Read their interpretation of the findings - Premier League Statement

Contrast this to the actual findings where their behaviour in dealing with us is outlined:

The APT Decisions​

As set out above, the APT Rules dictate that the PL must make a final decision as to all APT applications within a specific timeframe. City claimed that the PL had exceeded this limit in respect of the APT Decisions. The Tribunal decided that, in two of these instances, the PL had exceeded the time limit due to a lack of resources within their regulatory team, whilst the PL accepted that it had created a delay in the third instance.

The Tribunal decided that there was no evidence that City had been unable to make any APT transaction because of these delays, and that no potential sponsorships were compromised by them. However, the Tribunal also found that the PL had created an "unreasonable delay" in respect of the FAB APT (by three months) and the EP APT (by two months). City may seek damages because of these delays, although given the findings of the Tribunal, the loss suffered is not immediately apparent. It is noteworthy that the PL here was found to have broken the APT Rules rather than the rules themselves being found to be deficient, and that the Board subsequently revised its decision in respect of the EP APT following representations made by City.

The Tribunal also found that the Board's decisions relating to the EAG APT and the FAB APT should be set aside on the grounds of procedural unfairness. In relation to the EAG APT, the Tribunal found that procedural unfairness arose because the Board did not give City an opportunity to respond to the FMV benchmarking analysis before reaching its decision. Regarding the FAB APT, the Tribunal ruled that, prior to the Board's final determination, it did not give City access to the Databank transactions completed by other clubs to which the Board referred in its final determination.


The outfall of this is the current regulator the PL have been found to have treated us with utter disdain and with deliberate intent to use procedures unfairly. I believe this is utterly contemptible on their part, yet the media in this country have shovelled that part of the decision under the carpet.

I sincerely hope Lord Pannick was able to point this out to the Independent Commission members in charge of the 115 case. Whilst having no evidential effect it certainly portrays a "mindset" of the regulator in respect of legal matters with MCFC.

Now we await the IC's decision on the PL's rushed resolution to the APT deficiencies voted in by the usual suspects. Lets hope for another positive outcome for City.

So, do I believe our owners and executives, sponsors, auditors, accountants and other third parties have acted fraudulently, dishonestly, conspiratorially and knowingly submitted false accounts for a period of 10 years or more? Do I believe Simon Pierce and others including Etihad senior executives lied under oath at CAS? Do I believe those same individuals submitted false evidence in support of their statements and witness testimony?

No i do not! What's more if you can take that leap of faith you must therefore believe that there will be no smoking gun evidence to prove that they did any of those things.

I honestly believe that if City had been guilty of any of those major charges there would have been a settlement before litigation. It makes no sense to me to argue a case for which there would be clear evidence to substantiate the accusations.

However as anyone who knows anything about either criminal or civil court procedure and the legal system knows, entities can be found to have done things they did not on the balance of probabilities if they are unable to submit sufficient rebuttal evidence to that of their accusers or in the case of perverse findings by the judge, judges, panel or Commission. There are of course procedural appeal remedies in some cases of but findings of fact interpreted by the Commission would be difficult to overcome unless it was clearly perverse. These are the perils of litigation.

Let's all hope Lord Pannick and his team have presented our irrefutable evidence sufficiently well to be successful in repudiating the PL's accusations of financial impropriety, malfeasance, obfuscation and obstruction.

What a brilliant post. It sums up the current situation perfectly and why we should remain positive. You are right to stress the tone of the APT Judges' statements. Of course is a different case to the "115" but the fact that the PL has been found to have behaved unlawfully and unfairly re-inforces City's position in general. The media have ignored it but the wording of the APT statement supports my belief that the PL has acted in bad faith throughout. The independent Judges in the "115" case are not stupid people. I believe they will treat us fairly.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Very poor phrasing from Kieran there. Owners putting money in isn't in itself fraud. That would make King Power, and other sponsors related to a club's owners, fraudsters. He is also well aware that the allegation of our owners putting in money via the Etihad sponsorship was demolished at CAS.

That undid the good work he did in saying it was only 3 charges.

 

[Big mals fedora]

Very poor phrasing from Kieran there. Owners putting money in isn't in itself fraud. That would make King Power, and other sponsors related to a club's owners, fraudsters. He is also well aware that the allegation of our owners putting in money via the Etihad sponsorship was demolished at CAS.

That undid the good work he did in saying it was only 3 charges.

Ffs, is it now 3 charges, dressed up as 115. Or 130. Or is it 5 charges dressed up as 115. Or 130???….