The rebuild has started. Who goes?

Gone for a Burton said:
The players are the (relatively) straight forward decisions....young players for old ones, poor players for elite ones.

The elephant in the room imo is Pep....style, intensity & temperament.

He is our 'football CEO'.

In business CEOs are recruited and retained for 5/7 year cycles before both parties change for new challenges.

Pep celebrates 10 years this year.

Do he, the club and the players need a change and who would fit the bill ?

A reasonable question.
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It sure is a reasonable question. One you get shot at for asking on here. But its for sure a question that should be allowed to be asked
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Foden gets a free pass because "he's one of our own" but he should be judged the same way as players like Nunes and others. We know what he is capable of and I thought he had a better claim to the Balon D'Or than Vinicius Jr based on the season he had. But he's gone to pieces this season, bar a few recent goals.

His weaknesses have become all too apparent. Feeble in the tackle, reluctance to put right his numerous mistakes by chasing back, lack of meaningful involvement in games. He needs to get back to doing what he does best (although I feel it's a complete waste sticking him out wide). Hopefully he can do that soon but if we see the same Foden next season then we should get rid. We can't afford passengers if we want to resume our trophy-gathering, regardless of whether they've been with us since they were just out of nappies or not.
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I think the summary of your post would be: "great player, poor form".

You don't get rid of someone under those conditions
 
noseve said:
So why are you on a forum, where you'll have to suffer actual opinions from others?

Christ it's tedious when posters get all precious because we have the cheek to query something Pep does.

Pep's terrific - of course he is - but are you telling me that we wouldn't have another UCL if he'd played Fernandinho against Chelsea (who'd barely threatened in any of the previous encounters that season with him in the team?).

And have you agreed with every starting line-up, every substitution during the past 2-3 months??

Bollocks, have you :-)
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Why are you as a Southampton fan on a City forum talking about our rebuild? Or are you just based in Southampton and have a poor attention to detail, which explains why you don't see merit in having a squad with players who aren't necessarily world class but will knuckle down and do their best on the pitch. Pep isn't flawless but singling out Nunes for criticism in a season where nearly everyone has been absolutely shite and, when played where he's more comfortable, he's been pretty good is ridiculous.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Foden gets a free pass because "he's one of our own" but he should be judged the same way as players like Nunes and others. We know what he is capable of and I thought he had a better claim to the Balon D'Or than Vinicius Jr based on the season he had. But he's gone to pieces this season, bar a few recent goals.

His weaknesses have become all too apparent. Feeble in the tackle, reluctance to put right his numerous mistakes by chasing back, lack of meaningful involvement in games. He needs to get back to doing what he does best (although I feel it's a complete waste sticking him out wide). Hopefully he can do that soon but if we see the same Foden next season then we should get rid. We can't afford passengers if we want to resume our trophy-gathering, regardless of whether they've been with us since they were just out of nappies or not.
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Probably worth pointing out that Foden has been mostly excellent for several seasons ever since he debuted. This is the first big drop off in quality he’s ever had in his still young career, which is absolutely outstanding all things considered.

My understanding is that Foden was physically exhausted when he returned to the club following a short break after the Euros. This was followed by a bad case of covid and a severe case of food poisoning. This combined to create a perfect tonic which knocked him down good and proper for a long while.

Quite frankly though, the idea we should get rid is absolutely preposterous. If we were getting rid of players this season who hadn’t performed anywhere near their level then we’d only have about 1-2 players left because quite frankly no one has been good enough - and some never have been or will be. Put it this way, Foden wouldn’t be near the top of players we’d be looking to lose…

I must say I do find the going straight for the throat personality trait to be quite disturbing considering all players (and managers) will have peaks and lows across several seasons. You’re never going to get anyone who is amazing all the time and drop offs should be expected from everyone. In Foden’s case I’m amazed it took so long for him to have a major dip, but I guess that just goes to show how good of a player he really is. Why anyone would want to go on the attack against him in such circumstances is beyond me and I have zero doubts that Foden (and others) will be back to their best and winning leagues and titles soon enough.
 
Walker
Stones
Gundo
Phillips
Kdb
Grealish

Would leave us

Ederson
Ortega
Carson

Lewis
Kushanov
Akanji
Reis
Dias
Ake
Gvardiol

Kovacic
Rodri
Gonzalez
Bernie
Oreilly
Foden
Doku
Savio
Bobb
Haaland
Marmoush

I'd like to a
Rb
Cm
No 10

To come in hopefully a couple of them are leaders.
 
uwe rosler 28 said:
Walker
Stones
Gundo
Phillips
Kdb
Grealish

Would leave us

Ederson
Ortega
Carson

Lewis
Kushanov
Akanji
Reis
Dias
Ake
Gvardiol

Kovacic
Rodri
Gonzalez
Bernie
Oreilly
Foden
Doku
Savio
Bobb
Haaland
Marmoush

I'd like to a
Rb
Cm
No 10

To come in hopefully a couple of them are leaders.
Click to expand...

Off the bat? Doubt it, frankly. Strongly doubt it. Rúben's already a natural leader, and he's there. So is Rod. And he's there. Two people who, as they mature over time, may become useful ‘seconds’ to the natural leaders: Josko and (less certainly) Erling. As for who may be brought in, yes, they may emerge as natural leaders — but it'll take them a couple of seasons at best to be listened to in the dressing room as having natural authority over the whole team.
 
Gone for a Burton said:
The players are the (relatively) straight forward decisions....young players for old ones, poor players for elite ones.

The elephant in the room imo is Pep....style, intensity & temperament.

He is our 'football CEO'.

In business CEOs are recruited and retained for 5/7 year cycles before both parties change for new challenges.

Pep celebrates 10 years this year.

Do he, the club and the players need a change and who would fit the bill ?

A reasonable question.
Click to expand...

This might sound crazy but similar posts were made about Pep in his first season and in the 19/20 season when Liverpool won the league. Hell, people on here wanted Pep sacked in the treble season as late as February 2023.

If we’re wanting to lose our manager every time we don’t win the league then we’re going to be sacking someone every other season and more without Pep, especially considering how strong the opposition is these days.

Pep has won the league 6 times in 7 seasons and 4 times in a row. This is absolutely unsustainable within the PL and bound by the current financial regulations.

We’ve been playing with no dm, no right back and midfielders in their 30’s with little to no engine of them. If the PL was a race to get a full bucket of water to the top of a hill, we’ve got a bucket with 2-3 big holes in it. No matter how big that bucket is, or how good it looks, we’re not winning that race until those holes are patched up, and until then, it doesn’t matter who’s carrying it in the mean time.

So in reality here’s what is going to happen. City will strengthen the squad and Pep and the team will go again - winning multiple titles - even if it’s not always 3 or 4 in a row. This season will be seen as a blip and we’ll look back and people like me will say ‘remember when people wanted Pep gone because we had a disappointing season after winning 4 in a row? Where are you now that we’re champions again ole ole?’.
 
the blue panther said:
Phil can only do what he does best in a functioning team. We've been far from that this season, and hence his shortcomings have been on display more than his attributes. If the Gonzales experiment comes off, I think we'll see the best of him again very soon.
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Let's hope so. He gets some harsh criticism on here especially because of his past performances, but this is by far his poorest season.
 
uwe rosler 28 said:
Walker
Stones
Gundo
Phillips
Kdb
Grealish

Would leave us

Ederson
Ortega
Carson

Lewis
Kushanov
Akanji
Reis
Dias
Ake
Gvardiol

Kovacic
Rodri
Gonzalez
Bernie
Oreilly
Foden
Doku
Savio
Bobb
Haaland
Marmoush

I'd like to a
Rb
Cm
No 10

To come in hopefully a couple of them are leaders.
Click to expand...
No argument with that but you 've missed Echeverri.
 
uwe rosler 28 said:
Walker
Stones
Gundo
Phillips
Kdb
Grealish

Would leave us

Ederson
Ortega
Carson

Lewis
Kushanov
Akanji
Reis
Dias
Ake
Gvardiol

Kovacic
Rodri
Gonzalez
Bernie
Oreilly
Foden
Doku
Savio
Bobb
Haaland
Marmoush

I'd like to a
Rb
Cm
No 10

To come in hopefully a couple of them are leaders.
Click to expand...

Probably not far off. I'd keep Stones if he can prove by the end of this season we could rely on him for 20 games or so next season. Made such a difference in the Chelsea and Brugge games.

We've possibly got Echeverri and McAtee to factor into the above as well, although I think the latter will go permanently with a buy back. His contract expires in 2026 so we either need to renew it or sell him and I can't see him wanting to renew given this season's playing time.

I happen to think at least one of Ederson and Ortega will go as well but I don't know enough about goalkeepers across Europe to know who might be a replacement.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Foden gets a free pass because "he's one of our own" but he should be judged the same way as players like Nunes and others. We know what he is capable of and I thought he had a better claim to the Balon D'Or than Vinicius Jr based on the season he had. But he's gone to pieces this season, bar a few recent goals.

His weaknesses have become all too apparent. Feeble in the tackle, reluctance to put right his numerous mistakes by chasing back, lack of meaningful involvement in games. He needs to get back to doing what he does best (although I feel it's a complete waste sticking him out wide). Hopefully he can do that soon but if we see the same Foden next season then we should get rid. We can't afford passengers if we want to resume our trophy-gathering, regardless of whether they've been with us since they were just out of nappies or not.
Click to expand...
Very fair comment and watching early Marmoush , Foden has serious competition for his place, for me they are similar and I am not sure they can play together.
 
Sack the backroom staff and the board all of them (jokes)
Ederson - I get the sense he is half bored at the club, maybe wrong. Be great to keep him
Ortega - He's not an Ederson, but I do rate him. Undecided.
Carson - Clearly a good egg in the background, maybe its time for the younger keepers to have his spot on the bench

Walker - Gone, should of gone last season
Dias - Keep him, but injuries are frustrating
Stones - same as above
Akanji - Having too many brain farts lately, but keep him.
Ake - Same as Stones & Dias
Gvardiol - Love to see him in the centre of defence
Khusanov - Too soon to make a decision on
Reis - Too soon to make a decision on
Wilson-Esbrand - sadly dont think he is good enough
Simpson-Pusey - Not good enough
Doyle - Was keen for him to stay at the club, looked impressive but dont think he has a future.
Braithwaite - liked the look of him, keep him for sure

Rodri - Keep him
Gonzalez - Too soon to make a decision on
Lewis - Needs to bulk up but keep him
Nunes - Likely sell him, but would like to see him in his rightful position
Kovacic - Keep for now
De Bruyne - Paid too much for not doing many games, keep around but hes like Bernie & Gundo keeping him more sentimental
Bernardo - Keep him around. But needs a massive rest.
Gundogan - same as KDB
Foden - King Phil!
Grealish - Clearly something going on for lack of game time, can see him gone next season on loan
Doku - Hit & miss player, reminds me too much of Siberiski
Savinho - Keep him
Bobb - Keep him, but can't see him getting in the team now
McAtee - same as Bobb
Perrone - get rid
Philips - He wont play for us, even with a season like we have where we have cried out for DM.
O'Reilly - Looked impressive in pre-season, and games he's played, keep

Haaland - Still be here
Marmoush - Too soon to make a decision on
Claudio Echeverri, heard great things of him will we see him in a city shirt this season?
Mubama - Not City level
Kayky - don't think we will see him play for City moving forward
 
Goater101 said:
Phil Foden for me is untouchable. Too see his name mentioned as someone to be sold is bad. Granted he’s not having a good season but to get rid of him because of that? Fucking nonsense.
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Yep he's probably one of our most in form players at the moment. 6 goals in 5 in the league. He isn't untouchable but he's the last player I'd be thinking of selling. He'd easily be worth £100m+ at his age and nobody is going to pay that anyway.

The one player we're really carrying going forward is Haaland and he's just a spare part at the moment except for poaching the odd goal. Pep had Ibrahimovic at Barcelona and he never really worked in that team. It feels like there's just not enough energy or control in midfield so maybe it's worth trying something different?

Maybe Pep could try a false 9 for a game (Marmoush?) and see how it goes as Haaland needs competition too. Teams know how we'll play now and they just put two centre backs against Haaland and he's basically isolated, didn't he have only 10 or so touches for the entire Arsenal game?
 
Gone for a Burton said:
The players are the (relatively) straight forward decisions....young players for old ones, poor players for elite ones.

The elephant in the room imo is Pep....style, intensity & temperament.

He is our 'football CEO'.

In business CEOs are recruited and retained for 5/7 year cycles before both parties change for new challenges.

Pep celebrates 10 years this year.

Do he, the club and the players need a change and who would fit the bill ?

A reasonable question.
Click to expand...

CEOs tend to stay longer than that in business.

But that’s by the by.

I agree Pep looks fried. It’s going to take a lot for him to dig us out of this. Viana coming in with some fresh ideas will be a welcome change IMO.
 
Man_City_Loyal said:
Sack the backroom staff and the board all of them (jokes)
Ederson - I get the sense he is half bored at the club, maybe wrong. Be great to keep him
Ortega - He's not an Ederson, but I do rate him. Undecided.
Carson - Clearly a good egg in the background, maybe its time for the younger keepers to have his spot on the bench

Walker - Gone, should of gone last season
Dias - Keep him, but injuries are frustrating
Stones - same as above
Akanji - Having too many brain farts lately, but keep him.
Ake - Same as Stones & Dias
Gvardiol - Love to see him in the centre of defence
Khusanov - Too soon to make a decision on
Reis - Too soon to make a decision on
Wilson-Esbrand - sadly dont think he is good enough
Simpson-Pusey - Not good enough
Doyle - Was keen for him to stay at the club, looked impressive but dont think he has a future.
Braithwaite - liked the look of him, keep him for sure

Rodri - Keep him
Gonzalez - Too soon to make a decision on
Lewis - Needs to bulk up but keep him
Nunes - Likely sell him, but would like to see him in his rightful position
Kovacic - Keep for now
De Bruyne - Paid too much for not doing many games, keep around but hes like Bernie & Gundo keeping him more sentimental
Bernardo - Keep him around. But needs a massive rest.
Gundogan - same as KDB
Foden - King Phil!
Grealish - Clearly something going on for lack of game time, can see him gone next season on loan
Doku - Hit & miss player, reminds me too much of Siberiski
Savinho - Keep him
Bobb - Keep him, but can't see him getting in the team now
McAtee - same as Bobb
Perrone - get rid
Philips - He wont play for us, even with a season like we have where we have cried out for DM.
O'Reilly - Looked impressive in pre-season, and games he's played, keep

Haaland - Still be here
Marmoush - Too soon to make a decision on
Claudio Echeverri, heard great things of him will we see him in a city shirt this season?
Mubama - Not City level
Kayky - don't think we will see him play for City moving forward
Click to expand...
"Doku - Hit & miss player, reminds me too much of Siberiski"

Joker Not Sure if Serious Meme Generator - Imgflip
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Foden gets a free pass because "he's one of our own" but he should be judged the same way as players like Nunes and others. We know what he is capable of and I thought he had a better claim to the Balon D'Or than Vinicius Jr based on the season he had. But he's gone to pieces this season, bar a few recent goals.

His weaknesses have become all too apparent. Feeble in the tackle, reluctance to put right his numerous mistakes by chasing back, lack of meaningful involvement in games. He needs to get back to doing what he does best (although I feel it's a complete waste sticking him out wide). Hopefully he can do that soon but if we see the same Foden next season then we should get rid. We can't afford passengers if we want to resume our trophy-gathering, regardless of whether they've been with us since they were just out of nappies or not.
Click to expand...
I think Phil needs to be given time. He has been suffering this season with his health which has not helped him one bit.

I do agree he needs to look to improve his pressing, tracking back and tackling. I also think he is easily knocked off the ball when teams are overly aggressive with him. Maybe down to the health issues he's had this season.
 
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