The Album Review Club - Week #195 (page 1310) - A New World Record - ELO

BimboBob said:
It doesn't matter what the context was, I'm sure most of the people had no idea what she was banging on about when they bought it in their droves. It's background music. Hence ideal for a dinner party. And the kooky one from Friends.
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It’s not dinner party music mate. As my wife said to me over our venison casserole (one of my specialties) yesterday evening. ‘Will you put that screechy bloody woman off. Sadly Justin and his partner and then the others agreed by requesting me to put Supertramp on instead (with the volume at 2).
 
Saddleworth2 said:
Don’t worry mate. I didn’t think it would be that popular.

It’s a bit rich coming from someone that nominated ‘War of the Worlds’ though :-)
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Saddleworth2 said:
It’s not dinner party music mate. As my wife said to me over our venison casserole (one of my specialties) yesterday evening. ‘Will you put that screechy bloody woman off. Sadly Justin and his partner and then the others agreed by requesting me to put Supertramp on instead (with the volume at 2).
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I think the Friends and dinner party music analogies have been overplayed.

If you don't like the album, fine, but to say that this is a dinner party album is absurd. Mind you, I haven't been to one of BimboBob's dinner parties.

"Can you pass the gravy, please?"

"Fuck off you spineless bastard. And while I'm at it, you're wife is an ugly bitch. Arrrrrrrggggggggggghhhhhhhhhh!"
 
RobMCFC said:
I think the Friends and dinner party music analogies have been overplayed.

If you don't like the album, fine, but to say that this is a dinner party album is absurd. Mind you, I haven't been to one of BimboBob's dinner parties.

"Can you pass the gravy, please?"

"Fuck off you spineless bastard. And while I'm at it, you're wife is an ugly bitch. Arrrrrrrggggggggggghhhhhhhhhh!"
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Possibly your most amusing post.

TBH I’m now kinda thrilled at 4/10 for CotC from BB.
 
RobMCFC said:
I think the Friends and dinner party music analogies have been overplayed.

If you don't like the album, fine, but to say that this is a dinner party album is absurd. Mind you, I haven't been to one of BimboBob's dinner parties.

"Can you pass the gravy, please?"

"Fuck off you spineless bastard. And while I'm at it, you're wife is an ugly bitch. Arrrrrrrggggggggggghhhhhhhhhh!"
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yep, been some very odd suggestions for 'dinner party' music.
 
BlueHammer85 said:
yep, been some very odd suggestions for 'dinner party' music.
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My point is that at a dinner party you want something on low in the background so everyone can have a good natter without being interrupted. If it's on low then theoretically it doesn't matter what is playing so therefore it can be shite. This album is perfect for that.

Lift music is different because no one talks in a lift so the music is more banal.

Da, de der der, da, da der der...
 
Straight away the voice annoyed me along with the opening line.Do i stress you out,my sweater is on backwards and inside out this was never going to be my cup of tea.
Then add in annoying harmonica playing and we are of to a crap start.
Couple of okay tunes spoilt by her vocals.
You Oughta know Hand in my pocket,Head over feet but that was about it.
Not my cup pf tea but this pick really annoyed me and 2 plays was enough
2/10.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
Jagged Little Pill - 1995.

Alanis Morissette


I have always been a sucker for female songwriters. Kate, Joni, Carol King, Patti Smith. I find the life perspective in their songs enlightening and honest and it’s difficult for me to think of a male artist that gets to the emotional truth quite as well.

I was driving back from a fishing trip in Rutland and I put this album on the more in an attempt to inject some energy as much as anything. I hadn’t listened to it for a long, long time and I was surprised at how much I enjoyed it again and thought it would be an interesting nomination for this thread. I’m putting this forward with zero expectation that everyone will like it and indeed some may really really dislike it, but what the hell.

The album, released in 1995 is ‘Jagged little Pill’ by Alanis Morissette. I first heard the album through my 19 year old daughter who was playing it incessantly and I quite liked what I heard with its singable songs, mix of grunge and pop and a bit of country thrown in. So unlike most of the kids music I actually sat and listened to it and liked it even more. For a twenty year old unknown it was pretty astonishing. Some songs gentle, some absolutely spitting poison but all of them imbued with a refreshing honesty. As I listened to it again on the car system it struck me how well the music had stood up 30 years later

I think some people are a little prejudiced regarding ‘popular’ albums, and by that I mean evergreens that have sold by the truckload over many months or even years. How can music that’s loved by the masses be artistically interesting? Looking at the albums nominated in this thread I suspect that there is a little bias going on to avoid those type of albums although there are notable exceptions. Certainly back in 95, this album was overexposed - when it was released it was overplayed on radio and constantly on MTV, it spawned six hit singles as well. So I do get that maybe this will not float everyone’s boat. Jagged Little Pill was never meant to be hip or edgy, it’s more meaningful for what it represents — a smart young woman talking honestly about her feelings and finding herself as an artist. That’s a good starting point. In a more gentle way, Carol King did that with Tapestry, Joni with Blue, more recently the torch has passed to Billie Eilish and Chappell Roan.

All I ask is listen to it fresh as if for the first time and then make your mind up.

Also, as an aside, please god let’s not debate the meaning of ‘Ironic’ - that one’s been done to death :-).

A little background to the album; Just two years after Madonna co-founded the Maverick record label back in 1992, the company signed a then relatively unknown 20-year-old Morissette. Just over a year later and her debut album for the label had been released and proved to be as successful as the record label had envisioned. With total sales now in excess of 33 million units globally, the album not only cemented Morissette’s star status, but went 16x platinum in the US and garnered the singer five out of the nine GRAMMY Awards she was nominated for in 1996, not to mention reaching the number one spot in many charts around the world. The album has since been re-issued several times, has an acoustic version and even a broadway show. It’s been a double edged sword for her as although she has made some fine music since, Jagged Little Pill towers over her back catalogue like an albatross.

The production (and co- writing) was by Glen Ballard who had worked with Wilson Phillips, Michael Jackson and Paula Abdul (amongst many, many others). Ballard had collaborated very closely with Morissette with the demo recording sessions starting in 1994 at Ballard's home studio, and included only Morissette and Ballard as the producer, who recorded the songs as they were being written. Ballard provided the rough tracks, playing the guitars, keyboards, and programming drum machines and Morissette played harmonica. The duo sought to write and record one song a day, in twelve- or sixteen-hour shifts, with minimal overdubbing later. All of Morissette's singing on the album respects that rule, each recorded in one or two takes. The tracks that were redone later in a professional studio used the original demo vocals. Ballard also helped tout the demos round various record labels until Maverick agreed to sign up Morissette.

So to the album itself. Released on June 13th 1995. It was the first Morissette album to be released worldwide (her previous two featured dance music) and it marked a significant change in musical direction for her. On release it received mainly positive reviews regarding in particular the lyrics, vocal performance and emotional honesty of the delivery.

I’m not going to go through track by track. I don’t think there is a bad one on the album but some stand out for me in particular:

All I really Want
The opening track sets out what this young woman wants and doesn’t want. I read it as a reflection of an argument with her partner who refuses to engage in ‘intellectual intercourse’ Like most of the album it succeeds through the lyrics and the vocal delivery set over grunge guitars and a pulsing drum commentary.

I really like the literary reference as she compares herself to Estella, from Great Expectations.

I'm like Estella,
I like to reel it in and then spit it out,
I'm frustrated by your apathy."

You Oughta Know
This one still hits me between the eyes. The second best major-label debut single of the ‘90s, after “Smells Like Teen Spirit,”. The lyrics came from a diary entry Morissette wrote during what she described as a ‘very devastated time’ . In interview she said When I hear that song, I hear the anger as a protection around the searing vulnerability. I was mortified and devastated. It was a lot easier for me to be angry and feel the power from that anger versus the broken, horrified woman on the floor." She absolutely hammers the vocals which are spat out with such venom that you have to believe the song is based on personal experience. There was a lot of conjecture about who the song was about (she dated an American TV actor when she was 17) but that has never been revealed by her. Flea and Dave Navarro both play on this track which builds in intensity and anger both vocally and musically. The use of dynamics and loud/soft make the track even more effective.

‘And every time you speak her name
Does she know how you told me
You’d hold me until you died?
’Til You died
But you’re still alive…’

‘And every time I scratch my nails
Down someone else's back, I hope you feel it
Now can you feel it?’

Perfect
An anthem to overbearing parents chasing perfection. It’s a simple melody and again the vocals carry the song. She demonstrates what a pure tone she has in the first verse but her vocal mannerisms soon return to covey frustration, sadness and disappointment. The acoustic guitar backing, played by Ballard is unobtrusive but compliments the song perfectly.

This was the first song Morissette performed in her audition for Guy Oseary at Maverick Records. "Within, I don't know, 20 or 30 seconds into the song, I was done," Oseary recalled. "I was already blown away and never heard anything like it and wanted to sign her. That was really it, for me." Morissette said in interview that unlike some of the songs on the album, this one was not autobiographical.

‘We’ll Love you
Just the way you are
If you’re perfect’

Hand in my pocket
A far more optimistic song and another mega single hit. It was written by her and Ballard in 15 minutes. The lyrics in the chorus use a poetry technique, "rhyme juxtaposition", as its primary lyrical structure. That’s not carried through the song consistently but it does make it more interesting. There is also an ok mouth organ solo from Morissette.

Right Through You
A partner piece for ‘You Oughta know’ its a blistering biting critique of the sexism and objectification she experienced in the music industry. Aimed squarely at a particular executive who dismissed and underestimated her prior to her success. The lyrics are angry, direct, and unapologetically confrontational.

"You took me for a joke
You took me for a child
You took a long hard look at my ass
And then played golf for a while"

I particularly like the redemptive pay back of the last verse.

Forgiven
While not as commercially prominent as "You Oughta Know" or "Ironic," “Forgiven” is an honest confrontation with taboo themes. It resonates with those who’ve struggled with guilt and rigid religious upbringings. Alanis was brought up in the catholic faith.

Mary Jane
A song to a friend. Sang simply with more than a touch of sadness and poignancy. I like the bass line on this track

The album is an uncensored diary of a raw young adult experiencing life in all its messy, painful, glory for the first time. There’s a feminist potency to it that I found compelling at the time and still do today. One of the reasons the album so struck a chord with millions is its broad thematic content. She tackles life head on, exploring religious hypocrisy, jealousy, parental expectations, drinking, mental illness, co-dependence, the patriarchy, friendship, self-esteem, infidelity and on. Pretty Universal themes tackled honestly by a young woman of 20, who until then had produced bubble gum music. It’s not without its flaws, her vocals can sometimes teeter on the edge of being overwrought but to me it was some album and some achievement.
Hope you like it too.
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It's a great album. Always liked it.
 
James King and the Lonewolves one of my earliest picks have a new album out on Spotify called The Mortality Arcade.
Loving it great to hear them again.
 
bennyboy said:
James King and the Lonewolves one of my earliest picks have a new album out on Spotify called The Mortality Arcade.
Loving it great to hear them again.
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After what I read about them at the time of that nomination I'm pleasantly surprised they're all still alive, a new album is a big bonus.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
It’s not dinner party music mate. As my wife said to me over our venison casserole (one of my specialties) yesterday evening. ‘Will you put that screechy bloody woman off. Sadly Justin and his partner and then the others agreed by requesting me to put Supertramp on instead (with the volume at 2).
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Slap Rory on and turn it up to 11.
When they moan just shrug and gesture, ‘What?. I can’t hear you!’
‘What? You want your coats?’
 
There's got to be a playlist thread theme in all of this discussion - best/worst dinner party music.

Back to Bimbo's comment around context being irrelevant and that people will have bought this without being aware of any of it. It's a fair comment because at the time I don't think much of her experience was in the public domain and as someone who came to this some time after it was released I am definitely listening to it with the benefit of hindsight which does colour my response to it. The whole question of what the artist is trying to convey versus how it is received is always interesting (another playlist thread - most misunderstood songs?).

In this case and guessing who she was looking to speak to, I suspect the demographic on here may have been as much the target of her ire than her intended audience. The very fact it ended up selling well beyond the more obvious audience I'd have said was more to her credit than her detriment (and they'll be a small segment who bought it where their purchase of it genuinely is ironic). In that sense it seems almost 'Swiftian' in it's popularity versus who it should appeal to on a paper.**

Like others I really don't get the dinner party comment and to me, like capitalism, there were some inherent contradictions in Bimbo's position; surely if someone is on the one hand a shrieking harridan then they can't also be distraction free dinner party fare? I suppose if you play something at low enough volume then most stuff can probably fit into that category.


OB1 said:
Possibly your most amusing post.

TBH I’m now kinda thrilled at 4/10 for CotC from BB.
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I'd agree it was very funny and also vivid ! Vindication too of Rob's view on using profanity occasionally and sparingly for better effect.

** on the point above, now is probably as good a time as any to share my abandoned idea/experiment for my next nomination. Inspired by SouthamptonBlue's approach with Sleep Token, I thought it might be interesting to put up the biggest selling (or second best depending on source) artist of this century for discussion, so I read up on what the top 5 ranked Taylor Swift albums were and listened to each of them 3 times with a view to nominating the one I thought had most merit. TLDR is that, though I thought there was an album that was very worthy of discussion that imo showcased her strengths and weaknesses (and was very different from the Chappell Roan album) I binned off the idea because I couldn't get past the feeling that where many of her strengths lie are simply too unrelatable to many of us on this thread so we'd probably end up discussing only the negatives.
 
threespires said:
Not sure what kind of dinner parties you're going to but the context of a song like Right Through You is the sexual abuse she encountered as a 14 year old when she started out in the music industry. It's fairly veiled but as her career went on and she got more secure she talked and wrote about it more openly.

She ended up quite accomplished at it in the end imo. There's a later song called 'hands clean' that has a very hooky chorus you can easily singalong to until you listen to the words you are singing and realise they are essentially describing papaedophilia.
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It's an abhorrent thing to point out especially as abuse of the nature she suffered is horrendous but Canada's consent law was 14 at the time I think. Which in itself is pretty disgusting. And I doubt she was the only one. God there are some sick people in this world.
 
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