The Album Review Club - Week #191 (page 1286) - Harlequin Dream - Boy & Bear

mrbelfry said:
You wouldn't know them. Jamaica? I hardly knew her.

Hmmm you could do the world a favour and pick something bad or be selfish and pick something just for you. I'll pick The Smiths
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Not sure if that's the favour or selfish option in your world? Either way were it to happen I'd like to think that you would choose Quilloughby for your stage name.
 
RobMCFC said:
Did the Spice Girls even have any proper instruments on their songs?
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I assume they had session musicians on some of them and the rest of it was done by the production team? I picked The Monkees for comparison because though they were a manufactured band too (a) anyone listening to last train to Clarksville and ziggazig ah and thinking the latter is the better is completely deranged and (b) because though they didn't play their instruments initially The Monkees really wanted to give it a go as proper band rather than see the next step as starting a fashion brand, or marrying a rag or a wrong 'un or whatever. In fairness to the scouse one she seemed interested in having a career in music and I think ended up on the stage?
 
mrbelfry said:
Once again you prove how ignorant I am with a joke I don't understand. It's not you it is me babe.

I was purposely ambiguous with The Smiths.
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Quilloughby is a character in The Simpsons episode 'Panic on the Streets of Springfield' . Even if you're not a fan of the Simpsons it's quite funny and the man himself was not amused which can only be a good thing.

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threespires said:
Tbf the 1/10 I can understand but the worse than the spice girls part is completely baffling. Surely just happy memories of time spent with your daughter?

Thinking about it, culturally and commercially they probably tilled the soil that Swift has then been able to grow zillions of dollars in but musically they were just a very very gash version of The Monkees but without the eventually bothering to become good themselves bit. Along with the likes of boyzone they were also probably instrumental in convincing Simon Cowell he could make shit loads of money doing stuff like the X factor.
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I maintain that her popularity has least to do with her music. A bit like Oasis, really.

If I could be bothered I'd make a pie chart of the contributing factors, lipstick and boots woukd probably be bigger wedges.
 
Coatigan said:
I maintain that her popularity has least to do with her music. A bit like Oasis, really.

If I could be bothered I'd make a pie chart of the contributing factors, lipstick and boots woukd probably be bigger wedges.
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That's why I said they'd cultivated the soil she's making the big bucks in, there's plenty of parallels around image, brand and other none musical stuff being more important, but nonetheless she is still a way more capable musician than them and imo her music is much less dire.
 
Speak Now – Taylor Swift

Whilst I knew some of the songs on this album before last week, when I had the idea to make this the editor’s choice, I had never sat down and listened to it as a full album. These full listens do reveal mostly strengths and a few weaknesses as well.

Let’s start with the country/not country thing. I think people labelling this country are doing so because of Taylor Swift’s country background. “Mean” is definitely country, with its banjo, fiddle, and other stringed instruments. What I thought was a mandolin on “Mean” is probably a ukelele, but either way, the mix of country instruments on this song is very good, but it’s not just the instruments, it’s the bluegrass pacing that signals it as a country song. Other than this, it’s basically a combination of acoustic-based confessionals (“Back To December”, “Dear John”, Enchanted” and the title track.) and stadium soft-rock songs (“Mine”, “The Story of Us”, “Haunted” and “Long Live”).

Speaking of stadiums, although not the same type of music, some of the songs on this album reminded me of Bon Jovi’s Slippery When Wet and New Jersey – albums full of anthemic songs, built to take on the road when you know your audience will be singing along and punching the air.

As @threespires has already mentioned, she is very good at crafting those middle-8s and bridges and on this album, they often lead to anthemic choruses. “Haunted” is the best song on the album. Loved it the first time I heard it because it’s such a brilliantly constructed song with a singable chorus. The drums guitar and strings play their part here as well.

Even though it’s a bit bombastic, “The Story of Us” really works: with its clever lyrics about “not knowing what page we’re on” and the quickly delivered “next chapter” between verses, it’s a clever construct. I think there are some very good moments musically that reward repeated plays. For example, “Enchanted” with its simple acoustic guitar that is backed by a moody synth. I think that this song might have been better without the kitchen-sink chorus though.

There are a couple of negatives. At sixty-seven minutes, this is definitely three or four songs too long. Much as I enjoyed the listen overall, I don’t think there’s enough variety to support the running time and I did feel that I was listening to a couple of songs for a second time on the single listen. There are no significant instrumental parts. The guitar solos, when they arrive, are short and quickly give way to a bridge, and the band are very much in service of their singer and the song. What I will say is that given that this is a fairly modern album, I think the mix and arrangements are well done, particularly on the slower numbers where the sound of each instrument is distinct. This is not always the case in some of her later albums.

The lead vocals are very good throughout – they are not, for example, like Whitney Houston or Celine Dion who like to draw out every note and make each one last four ice ages. Whilst technically clever, this always ruins a song for me, so it’s good that there was none of that here. I don’t get the “breathy” comment that somebody made, it’s just a straightforward vocal performance without any affectations (apart from all the voices in the background on “Better Than Revenge”). Let’s face it, her voice is much better than most of the artists we listen to on this thread week after week.

What is most striking about this album is the articulate lyrics, and it’s incredible that a 20-year-old could write such melodic music and lyrics this good. OK, so they’re not aimed at me, but it doesn’t mean I don’t appreciate the effort that went into them. Whilst it’s a bit long and can get samey, there’s more than enough for a good listen and “Haunted” is one of the best pop songs I’ve heard for years. 7/10.
 
threespires said:
That's why I said they'd cultivated the soil she's making the big bucks in, there's plenty of parallels around image, brand and other none musical stuff being more important, but nonetheless she is still a way more capable musician than them and imo her music is much less dire.
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Interesting take. Hard to disagree with, although I surprisingly would like to.

Signles and hits for singles and hits, maybe. But after this album, I might disagree as far as actual albums go.
 
RobMCFC said:
Speak Now – Taylor Swift

Whilst I knew some of the songs on this album before last week, when I had the idea to make this the editor’s choice, I had never sat down and listened to it as a full album. These full listens do reveal mostly strengths and a few weaknesses as well.

Let’s start with the country/not country thing. I think people labelling this country are doing so because of Taylor Swift’s country background. “Mean” is definitely country, with its banjo, fiddle, and other stringed instruments. What I thought was a mandolin on “Mean” is probably a ukelele, but either way, the mix of country instruments on this song is very good, but it’s not just the instruments, it’s the bluegrass pacing that signals it as a country song. Other than this, it’s basically a combination of acoustic-based confessionals (“Back To December”, “Dear John”, Enchanted” and the title track.) and stadium soft-rock songs (“Mine”, “The Story of Us”, “Haunted” and “Long Live”).

Speaking of stadiums, although not the same type of music, some of the songs on this album reminded me of Bon Jovi’s Slippery When Wet and New Jersey – albums full of anthemic songs, built to take on the road when you know your audience will be singing along and punching the air.

As @threespires has already mentioned, she is very good at crafting those middle-8s and bridges and on this album, they often lead to anthemic choruses. “Haunted” is the best song on the album. Loved it the first time I heard it because it’s such a brilliantly constructed song with a singable chorus. The drums guitar and strings play their part here as well.

Even though it’s a bit bombastic, “The Story of Us” really works: with its clever lyrics about “not knowing what page we’re on” and the quickly delivered “next chapter” between verses, it’s a clever construct. I think there are some very good moments musically that reward repeated plays. For example, “Enchanted” with its simple acoustic guitar that is backed by a moody synth. I think that this song might have been better without the kitchen-sink chorus though.

There are a couple of negatives. At sixty-seven minutes, this is definitely three or four songs too long. Much as I enjoyed the listen overall, I don’t think there’s enough variety to support the running time and I did feel that I was listening to a couple of songs for a second time on the single listen. There are no significant instrumental parts. The guitar solos, when they arrive, are short and quickly give way to a bridge, and the band are very much in service of their singer and the song. What I will say is that given that this is a fairly modern album, I think the mix and arrangements are well done, particularly on the slower numbers where the sound of each instrument is distinct. This is not always the case in some of her later albums.

The lead vocals are very good throughout – they are not, for example, like Whitney Houston or Celine Dion who like to draw out every note and make each one last four ice ages. Whilst technically clever, this always ruins a song for me, so it’s good that there was none of that here. I don’t get the “breathy” comment that somebody made, it’s just a straightforward vocal performance without any affectations (apart from all the voices in the background on “Better Than Revenge”). Let’s face it, her voice is much better than most of the artists we listen to on this thread week after week.

What is most striking about this album is the articulate lyrics, and it’s incredible that a 20-year-old could write such melodic music and lyrics this good. OK, so they’re not aimed at me, but it doesn’t mean I don’t appreciate the effort that went into them. Whilst it’s a bit long and can get samey, there’s more than enough for a good listen and “Haunted” is one of the best pop songs I’ve heard for years. 7/10.
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Fair play to you for being able to detach and listen to this 'cold', and analyse it, as spires once put it, like dissecting a frog. I couldn't do it.

All I got out of this album, was an epic fight with the skip button!
 
Coatigan said:
Fair play to you for being able to detach and listen to this 'cold', and analyse it, as spires once put it, like dissecting a frog. I couldn't do it.

All I got out of this album, was an epic fight with the skip button!
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I think the sad truth is that not enough people appreciate melody and well-constructed songs.
 
RobMCFC said:
I think the sad truth is that not enough people appreciate melody and well-constructed songs.
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Speaking for myself, that's not true.

It is more that it is (sometimes) just not enough!

Neither is being able to play their instruments, or sing. As a standalone thing.

It has to work as a whole for me, strengths or weaknesses, and at the end of the day, has to move me.

The truth is there are thousands of bands/artists that can construct songs and melodies, and play instruments. Some have an effect on me, some don't.
 
RobMCFC said:
Speak Now – Taylor Swift

Whilst I knew some of the songs on this album before last week, when I had the idea to make this the editor’s choice, I had never sat down and listened to it as a full album. These full listens do reveal mostly strengths and a few weaknesses as well.

Let’s start with the country/not country thing. I think people labelling this country are doing so because of Taylor Swift’s country background. “Mean” is definitely country, with its banjo, fiddle, and other stringed instruments. What I thought was a mandolin on “Mean” is probably a ukelele, but either way, the mix of country instruments on this song is very good, but it’s not just the instruments, it’s the bluegrass pacing that signals it as a country song. Other than this, it’s basically a combination of acoustic-based confessionals (“Back To December”, “Dear John”, Enchanted” and the title track.) and stadium soft-rock songs (“Mine”, “The Story of Us”, “Haunted” and “Long Live”).

Speaking of stadiums, although not the same type of music, some of the songs on this album reminded me of Bon Jovi’s Slippery When Wet and New Jersey – albums full of anthemic songs, built to take on the road when you know your audience will be singing along and punching the air.

As @threespires has already mentioned, she is very good at crafting those middle-8s and bridges and on this album, they often lead to anthemic choruses. “Haunted” is the best song on the album. Loved it the first time I heard it because it’s such a brilliantly constructed song with a singable chorus. The drums guitar and strings play their part here as well.

Even though it’s a bit bombastic, “The Story of Us” really works: with its clever lyrics about “not knowing what page we’re on” and the quickly delivered “next chapter” between verses, it’s a clever construct. I think there are some very good moments musically that reward repeated plays. For example, “Enchanted” with its simple acoustic guitar that is backed by a moody synth. I think that this song might have been better without the kitchen-sink chorus though.

There are a couple of negatives. At sixty-seven minutes, this is definitely three or four songs too long. Much as I enjoyed the listen overall, I don’t think there’s enough variety to support the running time and I did feel that I was listening to a couple of songs for a second time on the single listen. There are no significant instrumental parts. The guitar solos, when they arrive, are short and quickly give way to a bridge, and the band are very much in service of their singer and the song. What I will say is that given that this is a fairly modern album, I think the mix and arrangements are well done, particularly on the slower numbers where the sound of each instrument is distinct. This is not always the case in some of her later albums.

The lead vocals are very good throughout – they are not, for example, like Whitney Houston or Celine Dion who like to draw out every note and make each one last four ice ages. Whilst technically clever, this always ruins a song for me, so it’s good that there was none of that here. I don’t get the “breathy” comment that somebody made, it’s just a straightforward vocal performance without any affectations (apart from all the voices in the background on “Better Than Revenge”). Let’s face it, her voice is much better than most of the artists we listen to on this thread week after week.

What is most striking about this album is the articulate lyrics, and it’s incredible that a 20-year-old could write such melodic music and lyrics this good. OK, so they’re not aimed at me, but it doesn’t mean I don’t appreciate the effort that went into them. Whilst it’s a bit long and can get samey, there’s more than enough for a good listen and “Haunted” is one of the best pop songs I’ve heard for years. 7/10.
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Haunted was my low point. The strings aggravate me
 
Coatigan said:
Speaking for myself, that's not true.

It is more that it is (sometimes) just not enough!

Neither is being able to play their instruments, or sing. As a standalone thing.

It has to work as a whole for me, strengths or weaknesses, and at the end of the day, has to move me.

The truth is there are thousands of bands/artists that can construct songs and melodies, and play instruments. Some have an effect on me, some don't.
Click to expand...

I think that's the challenge with this pick, it's squarely in the "says nothing to me about my life" territory for this thread so unless you're preparecd to get the scalpel out there's nowhere to go with it.

That said, if music is ultimately about communication and connection then she does this for a huge number of people who just happen to be not us. Though I don't disagree about the other stuff that drives her succes, I promise you her fans pore over her lyrics and narratives with a fine tooth comb to an obsessional level. Imo it's a pretty weird asymmetric view of what constitutes music but I suppose as they are lyrics they are engaging with the music.

Picking up on a point @mrbelfry made, despite I think decent wordsmithing the emotional depth is pretty puddle like and immature and he quite fairly puts this down to age and experience. However I'm not sure that aspect of her writing has progressed that much. Even Folklore that is more grown up often has a very stylised and idealised view of relationships, good and bad. Now I need to take the splinter from my eye when it comes to commenting on other people's emotional maturity and I suspect she has more of an excuse than me. She's lived an utterly atypical life from her teens that had got increasingly removed from reality as most people experience it and I think you can tell this in her writing. It's a bit like elite footballers a significant proportion of whom have never grown up because they've never needed to. But the bit that confuses me is that she seems to take her older fans with her when I'd have thought the artifice of the relatability would begin to erode at some point. Maybe it's as simple as a bit of idealised romance / misery for the escapism is what really gets to people.

Anyway I think I've said more than enough on Swift, I've just listened to Ninth Night and its quite trippy so I might have a bit more of a listen.
 
threespires said:
I think that's the challenge with this pick, it's squarely in the "says nothing to me about my life" territory for this thread so unless you're preparecd to get the scalpel out there's nowhere to go with it.

That said, if music is ultimately about communication and connection then she does this for a huge number of people who just happen to be not us. Though I don't disagree about the other stuff that drives her succes, I promise you her fans pore over her lyrics and narratives with a fine tooth comb to an obsessional level. Imo it's a pretty weird asymmetric view of what constitutes music but I suppose as they are lyrics they are engaging with the music.

Picking up on a point @mrbelfry made, despite I think decent wordsmithing the emotional depth is pretty puddle like and immature and he quite fairly puts this down to age and experience. However I'm not sure that aspect of her writing has progressed that much. Even Folklore that is more grown up often has a very stylised and idealised view of relationships, good and bad. Now I need to take the splinter from my eye when it comes to commenting on other people's emotional maturity and I suspect she has more of an excuse than me. She's lived an utterly atypical life from her teens that had got increasingly removed from reality as most people experience it and I think you can tell this in her writing. It's a bit like elite footballers a significant proportion of whom have never grown up because they've never needed to. But the bit that confuses me is that she seems to take her older fans with her when I'd have thought the artifice of the relatability would begin to erode at some point. Maybe it's as simple as a bit of idealised romance / misery for the escapism is what really gets to people.

Anyway I think I've said more than enough on Swift, I've just listened to Ninth Night and its quite trippy so I might have a bit more of a listen.
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It is not that. Not for me.

This is not in the slightest bit 'I can't relate due to my age, and I don't get trenage puppy love'. I happily listen to other albums by young artists for young artists, and was a teenager once, and can also detach or place myself there as needed.

It is simply that musically, it does nothing for me. And I want to skip it. That's all.
 
Coatigan said:
It is not that. Not for me.

This is not in the slightest bit 'I can't relate due to my age, and I don't get trenage puppy love'. I happily listen to other albums by young artists for young artists, and was a teenager once, and can also detach or place myself there as needed.

It is simply that musically, it does nothing for me. And I want to skip it. That's all.
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Can't argue with that.

Edit: and it also strengthens my view it's country!
 
Coatigan said:
To my ears, there's definitely hunners of country on this album.

Not the proper redneck wail and drawl, but the Shania Tawin country-lite for men of all boot sizes type.
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Duly noted that redneck wail and drawl is 'proper' , so I'll see what I can do for the pick after next :-)
 
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