Denton and Gorton by-election - Green Party wins

bluejon said:
for this bi-election, 100%. it's been a perfect storm of people generally fucked off with starmer and the shenanigans with not allowing burnham to run. spoke to a lad yday who's voting green but we both agreed we'd probably be back to labour in the future.
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Tomorrow is the future.
 
urban genie said:
I voted Green and did inthe last election, last time there was 2 reasons first was I no longer support labour or it's shifted ideology, second the boundary chamge force Gwynne upon us and I was never voting for that fucker.

tbf no party really represents me anymore fully.

labour - too much. like camerons soft tory era
Your party - cobyns a cockwomble and can fuck off
Greens - liked their policies in the GE but they are a little vague at times
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Whatever Gwynne did, he didn't force a boundary change.
 
urban genie said:
Abbey Hey, round Sunny Brow and High bank way could well stay labour, not really any indication as not many posters up, but from talking to local CLP members who all love round there they don't feel support has been lost amongst many neighbours
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I went for a walk around there last week, and as you say not many posters up, but more than in central gorton, and more labour than the others. Voter motivation is what Labour need to be doing to get people down to the voting stations.
 
johnny crossan said:
Under Polanski the Greens in Denton/Gorton have put their important core environmental agenda aside and used profoundly divisive issues like drugs and Gaza as their flagship policies. This deliberately polarising tactic is from the same populist playbook as Farage, exploiting a complex problem in order to target a specific group of voters but without any genuinely new plans to provide a solution.
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I can understand campaigning on Gaza among Muslims but who are they targeting on legalising drugs?
 
johnny crossan said:
Where and when did Starmer say that? On recreational drugs legalization you are clearly not familar with the economic law of increasing supply creating increased demand. Who do you think most legal fags are illegally sold by these days?
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In an interview in Denton i think. It’s available online anyway.

It’s pretty widely accepted by people far more qualified than us that if the government brought the drugs in it would be far cheaper to do than it is for the gangsters because of all the hoops they have to jump through etc. We can just knock them out cheaper John!:)

You’ll always have a black market but this one would be massively reduced.

What they did with tobacco a few years ago has worked well and seen a big reduction in people smoking. Outright banning it wouldn’t have worked as it hasn’t with drugs.Only problem with tobacco my guess would be they seen a big reduction in tax from what they did regarding advertising etc. So they’ve just completely turned a blind eye to Vaping and that’s broadly on display and advertised. So the amount of people on that has gone through the roof.

5 things that people have always done and always will are gambling, drugs, smoking, prostitution and alcohol. Basically the other 4 are legal. Why because banning them never worked and never can. Drugs being illegal clearly doesn’t work either but none of our politicians that are high up have the balls to say it.
 
Vic said:
I can understand campaigning on Gaza among Muslims but who are they targeting on legalising drugs?
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the drug vote is a young one

"Though both parts of the seat have long voted Labour, they are poles apart demographically. The four Manchester wards are on average nearly 60% non-white and 40% Muslim, and 42% of the residents are either students or graduates. These wards resemble places Labour has struggled in the last couple of years with challenges on the left. The three Tameside wards of Denton are on average 83% white, 86% UK born, and with a high share of residents doing working class jobs. Reform UK made hay in wards like this in last May’s local elections. But the two chunks of the seat are not equally matched – about two thirds of the population live in the more diverse, graduate and student heavy Manchester wards."

ukandeu.ac.uk

Gorton and Denton: A three cornered fight in a seat of two halves - UK in a changing Europe

Ahead of the Gorton and Denton by-election on Thursday 26 February, Rob Ford analyses the prospects for Labour, Reform and the Green...
ukandeu.ac.uk ukandeu.ac.uk
 
bluejon said:
Had loads of stuff come through through our door, palestine barely mentioned by the greens.

100% agree though with the merger making no sense. Can blame the tories i think for that decision.
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Nationally it’s been one of their main talking points. Unless I’m mistaken, I’m pretty sure I’ve seen pro Palestine/ green party posters around longsight over the last few months. They are probably put up by members though.
 
Craig said:
In an interview in Denton i think. It’s available online anyway.

It’s pretty widely accepted by people far more qualified than us that if the government brought the drugs in it would be far cheaper to do than it is for the gangsters because of all the hoops they have to jump through etc. We can just knock them out cheaper John!:)

You’ll always have a black market but this one would be massively reduced.

What they did with tobacco a few years ago has worked well and seen a big reduction in people smoking. Outright banning it wouldn’t have worked as it hasn’t with drugs.Only problem with tobacco my guess would be they seen a big reduction in tax from what they did regarding advertising etc. So they’ve just completely turned a blind eye to Vaping and that’s broadly on display and advertised. So the amount of people on that has gone through the roof.

5 things that people have always done and always will are gambling, drugs, smoking, prostitution and alcohol. Basically the other 4 are legal. Why because banning them never worked and never can. Drugs being illegal clearly doesn’t work either but none of our politicians that are high up have the balls to say it.
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this one I presume, fully in agreement with him and so is most of this country I suspect

 
johnny crossan said:
this one I presume, fully in agreement with him and so is most of this country I suspect

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Yeah, the stupid twat doesn’t even make sense and contradicts himself!

If you enjoy reading can i suggest a book to you? It’s called Good Cop, Bad War by Neil Woods. He was an undercover drugs cop during the 90’s. If nothing else it’s a very interesting book but i suspect it might give you another perspective on this pointless and extremely costly drugs war.
 
Craig said:
Yeah, the stupid twat doesn’t even make sense and contradicts himself!

If you enjoy reading can i suggest a book to you? It’s called Good Cop, Bad War by Neil Woods. He was an undercover drugs cop during the 90’s. If nothing else it’s a very interesting book but i suspect it might give you another perspective on this pointless and extremely costly drugs war.
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What does he say that doesn't make sense or is contradictory?
 
johnny crossan said:
this one I presume, fully in agreement with him and so is most of this country I suspect

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So clearly the Greens actually believe in this then and aren’t seeing it as a cheap vote winner. As you say and i agree most of the country wouldn’t be on board with it!
 
Craig said:
So clearly the Greens actually believe in this then and aren’t seeing it as a cheap vote winner. As you say and i agree most of the country wouldn’t be on board with it!
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Unlike what they think appeals to the young voters in Gorton/Denton I don't think you'll see legalizing crack cocaine front and centre of their next GE campaign - not a vote winner in most of this country.
 
johnny crossan said:
What does he say that doesn't make sense or is contradictory?
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He tried to say there would be drugs all over the school playground. He then went on about his 17 year old son would be able to buy them in 6 months and that’s frightening. Oh, so the evil Polanski isn’t on about selling them in the school canteen then?

The stuck up moron on must assume drug dealers ask for ID and he’s clearly not aware of county lines. The better the police get at catching drug dealers the more dangerous the streets get. Also there is never a reduction in drug supply! Please make our current policy make sense?
 
Craig said:
Yeah, the stupid twat doesn’t even make sense and contradicts himself!

If you enjoy reading can i suggest a book to you? It’s called Good Cop, Bad War by Neil Woods. He was an undercover drugs cop during the 90’s. If nothing else it’s a very interesting book but i suspect it might give you another perspective on this pointless and extremely costly drugs war.
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There’s a follow up book called Drug Wars by the same authors which is really good at laying out the policy stuff.

Still I think Polanski is a bit childish with his comments because he knows that the idea isn’t to have a free for all and legalise dealing, but he never gets into any proper detail about decriminalisation, special prescriptions etc. and so he allows Starmer to say things like he does above. Starmer knows what he’s saying is a dishonest characterisation of the Green’s likely policy, but they hadn’t officially published one so it’s an open goal.
 
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