Denton and Gorton by-election - Green Party wins

[Johnny Mars Bar]

I hope Labour manage to hold it but I’ll be amazed if Reform don’t win it.

Polls always, always underestimate the right wing count.

 

[Blue and true]

I'm sure Mancunians will make the correct decision. But our politics being splintered like this is a proper sorry state of affairs.

 

[blueparrot]

I'm sure Mancunians will make the correct decision. But our politics being splintered like this is a proper sorry state of affairs.

Not sure it is a bad thing, I posted yesterday we could well be heading towards a coalition government in the next election and it could well be a 3 party coalition. If that splintering shatters and ends the 2 party safe seat aways vote X of the past,where one party with 30% of the vote gets total power,is that bad? It would probably eventually lead to some sort of PR if it was a 3 party coalition ,is that bad ?

 

[hilts]

Here's the thing.

Our hospitals are falling down.
You can't get an appointment with a doctor nor dentist for love nor money.
The police are missing in action.
Our rivers are full of shit.
Our coastlines are crumbling into the sea.
Our roads are full of pot holes.
Our railways are not fit for purpose.
Our social services have been in crisis mode for decades.
Our schools are overcrowded and understaffed.
Our armed forces have been pared to the bone.
The alliances that have ensured our security for 80 years are coming apart.
There is war in Europe.
We are under attack from Russia in a variety of non-combative ways.

How did immigration become the issue so many people obsess about?

Because larger populations create

A need for more hospitals
More doctors
More police
More sewage
More cars
More lorries
More pot holes
More social services
More crimes
More police...........

You get the general idea

Plus some people are more adverse to the extra risks of importing 'trouble'

Add in the xenophobic or the good old racist element and there you go.

All the above have been discussed quite often. Its not that much of a surprise its discussed either here or in other countries.

Governments are painfully slow at reacting to change so you are forever playing catch up through population increase, and there is the cost. Throw in major economic knock backs like the economy crashing, covid, shit govts and the biggest of all in the history of mankind and probably the universe Brexit which according to estimates released is 10 trillion pounds per day.

At least :-)

 

[Inter Me Nan]

Hopefully the fasicts get a good fisting today.

 

[hilts]

I'm sure Mancunians will make the correct decision. But our politics being splintered like this is a proper sorry state of affairs.

Centrists have long held the belief they are the sensible ones, the adults, the vanilla middle ground. In effect the risk adverse muddling through direction we have been on is starting to lose traction. Its the same arguments and parties claiming they can deliver something they can't. A country that makes enough money to make everything good or even passable.

Unfortunately Labour(the cabinet) lied to its own members and the left in this country, and the right have other options and Labour are trying to fight this off by being a bit more like them which just adds more annoyance to the left.

Their support is melting away from both sides since the election which was a mirage of seats over actual support. I still believe there is enough support to the left of this Labour cabinet to win a general election but those parties including Labour need to get their act together.

Unfortunately I think this won't happen and reform eventually will lose support and we will be left with centre right Labour next time and after that the usual risk averse status quo fiddling round the edges towards an inevitable slow decline.

 

[bluethrunthru]

ANYONE BUT REFORM.
May my fellow Mancunians make good choices because you can be certain that those Reform voters will be at the ballot box.

DON'T FALL FOR THEIR LIES

 

[bluejon]

voted. fingers now crossed.

 

[bluejon]

DON'T FALL FOR THEIR LIES

and that includes grok, which is saying the figure is true, quoting the times, the telegraph and gb news as the gospel truth. musk is a ****.

 

[Palerider]

Not sure it is a bad thing, I posted yesterday we could well be heading towards a coalition government in the next election and it could well be a 3 party coalition. If that splintering shatters and ends the 2 party safe seat aways vote X of the past,where one party with 30% of the vote gets total power,is that bad? It would probably eventually lead to some sort of PR if it was a 3 party coalition ,is that bad ?

I'm coming around to PR but I really do doubt whether it will work. My favourite political words are 'compromise' and 'reasonable' but many politicians now seem to champion their political purity and moral steadfastness. Bottom line for me is that for PR to work we would need elected politicians who are a lot more 'open minded' than ideology led.

 

[hilts]

Simple is right, at least.

Both are in fairness but most most feel the need to pretend one isnt.

Less people less cost of public services

More people, more growth, more money for services.

Both are true in their most basic form but neither solve anything.

 

[Palerider]

voted. fingers now crossed.

Many there?

 

[blueparrot]

I'm coming around to PR but I really do doubt whether it will work. My favourite political words are 'compromise' and 'reasonable' but many politicians now seem to champion their political purity and moral steadfastness. Bottom line for me is that for PR to work we would need elected politicians who are a lot more 'open minded' than ideology led.

Yes I agree, though PR works perfectly well in many countries, and many of those have their share of idiology led politicians.

 

[hilts]

Bad feeling about tomorrow. Think the green/labour split will let the racists in

Seems its a pretty even split by polls but not by bookies for some bizarre reason, the simple truth appears to be no one knows.

The only advice I could give is put your x against the party you would prefer. Its how its supposed to work and it removes the dropped a bollock remorse afterwards.

In this life eventually one has to accept the world is full of cunts who don't see things the way you or I do.

Daft twats:-)

 

[hilts]

Many there?

8 and 2 thumbs

 

[Elbow beards]

voted. fingers now crossed.

At least Lord oink-a-lot has got 1 vote :)

 

[bluejon]

At least Lord oink-a-lot has got 1 vote :)

Fucking right. It's the tactical choice.

 

[hilts]

Good look to the constituents tomorrow. For my perspective, I just hope that it doesn’t turn to Reform for its governance, would hate to look at those neighbourhoods as ill informed people.

Wow

If only the people in those neighbourhoods were as informed and correct as you.

Btw Reform has about 28% in the polls, loads don't or Can't vote, even if they win it will probably be something daft like 15% of the total population in this seat at the very most. That may seem ridiculous but thats fptp for you.

You know the one that Labour continues with, the lot you support.

Thats how informed you are.

Pmsl

 

[bluejon]

Many there?

Not mega busy but i turned up a bit late to avoid the queues. Did bump into 2 neighbours which was really lovely.

 

[threespires]

I'm coming around to PR but I really do doubt whether it will work. My favourite political words are 'compromise' and 'reasonable' but many politicians now seem to champion their political purity and moral steadfastness. Bottom line for me is that for PR to work we would need elected politicians who are a lot more 'open minded' than ideology led.

I think it might take a new generation of politicians for it to settle down but that will be no bad thing.

Yes I agree, though PR works perfectly well in many countries, and many of those have their share of idiology led politicians.

I reasonably sure all of the worlds most stable democracies use PR. We'll need some other changes to ensure we have mechanisms for BAU to continue in the instances when it takes time for coalitions to be formed etc, but again that will be no bad thing.

Transition won't come without challenges but we'll be fitter for the modern world afterwards. If nothing else, what this by-election does show is how unfit for purpose our current electoral system is.