US & Israel attack Iran

[Tb1981]

The history of Western involvement in the region is not a happy one. The problem has always been that creation of countries like Iraq, Lebanon, Jordan and the partition of the British mandate in Palestine were arbitrarily done, cynical and rewarded British & French allies rather than supporting self-determination. Same in Africa and South and SE Asia particularly in the partition of India) in many instances.

However Iran/Persia has always been relatively homogeneous, rather than being an unstable collection of competing tribal and religious elements. In places like Iraq, Syria and Lebanon, one clan or group established control and maintained that autocratically. When that autocracy was removed, there was conflict and chaos. We even saw this in Europe, with the fracturing of Yugoslavia after Tito died and the splintering of the old Soviet union. One problem is that many of these places don't have a history of the democratic processes that we in the West take for granted.

The US has never been known for its longer-term thinking but I'd like to think that Iran would be better placed for a transition to a more democratic solution than the other countries mentioned.

I hope for the people of Iran they get what they deserve

We don’t appreciate how good we have got it
Here and in America we can vote them out four years later. The people of Iran did not get what they wanted in 1979 and have suffered ever since

unfortunately I don’t see this ending as we hope without a lot of bloodshed and issues.

 

[Metal Biker]

Didn't realise greens were in control of local council or police.

Be interesting to see precisely how Spencer represents us in Parliament to address these issues then, won't it.

Very pedantic you, aren't you.

 

[Keith Moon]

The information war on social media is crazy. Wonder if our in-house AD bots are involved.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Hand it to whom?
Zack Polanski is a breath of fresh air in my view, and speaks of issues that affect us all: inequality, taxation, public services and the terror inflicted by Israel. Those issues unite because ALL of us are affected by them. Avoiding speaking about them is to the detriment of the main parties.

How the fuck does that affect you, or most in Gorton & Denton, any more than the war in Ukraine, the civil war in Sudan, or any other conflict? With the current action in Iran, if the regime is toppled and replaced by non-religious fanatics, the likelihood is that it makes you safer by removing the threat of the terror networks sponsored by the current Iranian regime.

It's just a dog-whistle for latent antisemitism.

 

[Manchester_lalala]

Maybe the deputy leader can explain his attendance here then.

Jesus fucking Christ. That’s potentially the deputy prime minister.

 

[blueinsa]

Jesus fucking Christ. That’s potentially the deputy prime minister.

It’s single issue politics.

That single issue is Israel is the enemy.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Google alert

I cede that matins aren’t sung as regularly as they used to be, but it doesn’t mean that some people are more knowledgeable than others. ;-)

 

[Protein Junkie]

When that autocracy was removed, there was conflict and chaos. We even saw this in Europe, with the fracturing of Yugoslavia after Tito died and the splintering of the old Soviet union. One problem is that many of these places don't have a history of the democratic processes that we in the West take for granted.

Yugoslavia was just a sticking plaster. There was plenty of chaos before its formation.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

Be interesting to see precisely how Spencer represents us in Parliament to address these issues then, won't it.

Very pedantic you, aren't you.

It's not pedantic, it's that you're judging her on things she as zero control over and almost no influence on.

 

[Kush45]

Before and After. Precision

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Zak (err I mean Dave the pretentious ****) Polanski is a complete and utter fucking knob.... and there are those who want him as PM? FFS, we might as well throw in the towel and hand our country over now.

Dave Paulden - get it right. I know some of the Paulden family. They're very decent people and quite ashamed of his antics. Even his old head at King David Junior School (who isn't Jewish) lambasted him in a newspaper article.

 

[hilts]

Maybe the deputy leader can explain his attendance here then.

Gonna need to look into this

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Yugoslavia was just a sticking plaster. There was plenty of chaos before its formation.

And that's the point. Many of these countries were sticking plasters that relied on a small, linked group to keep a lid on things, often via terrible repression.

 

[Metal Biker]

It's not pedantic, it's that you're judging her on things she as zero control over and almost no influence on.

You are, and it's the main reason why threads tend to divert or splinter off into pointless, non-related discussions. On a thread about Iran, from a comment I made, that's the thing you pick out and focus on?

Not interested.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

They just asked him how he would deal with the situation. His response was, summed up as, "I don't know".

Some leader. He's full of the same soundbites and phrases that get people clapping without any actual plan as to how to execute them. It's Reformesque, anyone can do that. "I'm going to bring about the change we need in this country!" How, and what specifically needs changing? "I'll get back to you on that!"

Let's be real, I voted Green in the G&D by-election to keep Reform out, that's all. I don't want the Greens anywhere near running the country. Right now they're under the microscope, locally; i'll see how good they are at addressing the issues in the area, potholes, fly-tipping, drug deals, fallowfield loop scrotes etc.

Fair play to the people of G&D for keeping Reform out, but from that interview on BBC, Polanski is not the answer, and I’d go as far to say, his mindset is quite dangerous.

 

[hilts]

They just asked him how he would deal with the situation. His response was, summed up as, "I don't know".

Some leader. He's full of the same soundbites and phrases that get people clapping without any actual plan as to how to execute them. It's Reformesque, anyone can do that. "I'm going to bring about the change we need in this country!" How, and what specifically needs changing? "I'll get back to you on that!"

Let's be real, I voted Green in the G&D by-election to keep Reform out, that's all. I don't want the Greens anywhere near running the country. Right now they're under the microscope, locally; i'll see how good they are at addressing the issues in the area, potholes, fly-tipping, drug deals, fallowfield loop scrotes etc.

Can you give me the name of the political leader who actually has given a satisfactory answer on how we deal with the situation?

I think in general everyone is good at saying what shouldn't happen but what should gets left out.

There is a reason for that, ive said it before but sometimes all roads lead to a bad place. We just argue about the direction not the destination.

*posts relating to the Greens should be on the relevant thread.

 

[Metal Biker]

Fair play to the people of G&D for keeping Reform out, but from that interview on BBC, Polanski is not the answer, and I’d go as far to say, his mindset is quite dangerous.

Exceptionally naive, i'd say, if I were being polite about him.

I see him as like Ed Davey, only less goofy.

 

[Metal Biker]

Putin: "Assassination of Khamenei violates International Law"

Now International Law is important, you goblin?

 

[dickie davies]

They just asked him how he would deal with the situation. His response was, summed up as, "I don't know".

Some leader. He's full of the same soundbites and phrases that get people clapping without any actual plan as to how to execute them. It's Reformesque, anyone can do that. "I'm going to bring about the change we need in this country!" How, and what specifically needs changing? "I'll get back to you on that!"

Let's be real, I voted Green in the G&D by-election to keep Reform out, that's all. I don't want the Greens anywhere near running the country. Right now they're under the microscope, locally; i'll see how good they are at addressing the issues in the area, potholes, fly-tipping, drug deals, fallowfield loop scrotes etc.

trump's stock answer to any questions on the US economy on the run up to the election

With groceries inflation so high, what are your plans to help US families?

Well we're going to do something about that

 

[Blue and true]

I hope for the people of Iran they get what they deserve

We don’t appreciate how good we have got it
Here and in America we can vote them out four years later. The people of Iran did not get what they wanted in 1979 and have suffered ever since

unfortunately I don’t see this ending as we hope without a lot of bloodshed and issues.

If only the US could attest to a solid track record of enforced regime change in that region, then yes, the Iranians would get their country back. As such, they don't. Motive is key; are the US and Israel crusaders for a better, safer world? Trump's relationship with Putin, and the actions of Israel against the Gazan people should tell you otherwise. It's self-interest, self-interest, self-interest.

I'll paraphrase a poster from yesterday, this is analogous to Ian Huntley being attacked by another lowlife in prison; the US helping one terrorist state remove the head of another terrorist state should augur joy and revulsion in equal measure.