Henry Nowak murder

[We've got Guardiola]

The officer made that decision based on what information he had-rightly or as it turned out, wrongly. My point is officers have to make decisions -its not an automated process-once he made one erroneous decision the rest then followed..that's how things go badly. And he didn't know he was dying-it was probably the last thing on his mind..wrongly again as it turned out. But in those circumstances it likely wouldn't have crossed my mind-once I had skipped past his pleas..which the officer (wrongly) did. It was a catalogue of errors that will be unpicked.

Unconscious bias may have been a huge factor in those initial decisions that set of the sequence.

When I watched the footage last night my thoughts were in the cold light of day the throwaway comment made by the officer dismissing the plea that he had been stabbed looks and sounds awful-and the officer will reflect on that for the rest of his life. That remark gives insight into a path of decisions that he had made and went onto make.

I also questioned whether the use of handcuffs was proportional and necessary as the 'offender' (in the eyes of the officer) at that time posed little threat-but again, he has to justify that through his use of force form and statement, and it may been subjectively justified.

But I also thought that once they realised his health was rapidly deteriorating that they did react accordingly-calling for an ambulance and commencing CPR.

It went horribly wrong. No officer goes to work expecting things to go so catastrophically wrong. But I'm not ready for the pitchforks just yet.

I'm not one for pitchforks or taking sides. I just think we're quite clearly at a fork where we don't seem to treat people equally and worryingly it's because of the nonsense and unrest precipitated by the extremes of the right and left.

The evidence of this is obvious because why did the murderer play the race card in the first place? He did so because he knew this would lend him favour with the Police... and it did. The Police bought that because of bias and then acted to perform a wrongful arrest of a dying person despite no knowledge of the facts.

It's just really sad.

 

[bert38]

I'm not one for pitchforks or taking sides. I just think we're quite clearly at a fork where we don't seem to treat people equally and worryingly it's because of the nonsense and unrest precipitated by the extremes of the right and left.

The evidence of this is obvious because why did the murderer play the race card in the first place? He did so because he knew this would lend him favour with the Police... and it did.

people will play any card and lie through their teeth- in this case the allegations of racist behaviour appears to have caused a kind of group think that followed.

 

[SWP's back]

We’re a finished country, that’s why. Half the people actively want it to go down the pan and the other half have given up doing anything about it.

Considering the decline in my short life, I dread to think what it will be like when my kids are adults.

Said every fucker every twenty years since Caesar was a kid.

 

[Heartofoakes64]

Said every fucker every twenty years since Caesar was a kid.

I dispute that statement. Here is one who has never said it, until now.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Who the fuck are you to say no one should have strong views on this heinous crime, the dead boy’s family? The dead boys friends? Ordinary people who are scared of increasing knife crime?
Those police officers who believed the murdering scumbag when he played the race card & subsequently handcuffed a dying boy should be subjected to a disciplinary hearing immediately.

Where does your rage get you?

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Said every fucker every twenty years since Caesar was a kid.

Even if it were true, why say it? What does it achieve?

 

[The blue phantom]

Who knows what his motive was? One thing I think we can all agree on is that he probably played the race card in a desperate attempt to get away with carrying out such a horrific murder. Murdering cunts usually come up with all manner of pathetic excuses as to why they did it and this is no exception

Saved me typing pretty much the same thing.

 

[Pingu the Penguin]

Where does your rage get you?

I can understand why people have strong views on this

"No one should have such strong views on this."

I can't understand where apathy get us either. The battle against racism requires us to bear down on racism wherever it lives, including in the bias of police officers.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

I can understand why people have strong views on this

"No one should have such strong views on this."

I can't understand where apathy get us either. The battle against racism requires us to bear down on racism wherever it lives, including in the bias of police officers.

Let’s see the how the inquiry concludes before second guessing conspiracy theories.

However much social media demands this or that, nothing will happen now until the inquiry has finished.

There’ll be lots of noise from the rage baiters, but that’s just to make people angry. That’s not good for society either.

 

[Pingu the Penguin]

Let’s see the how the inquiry concludes before second guessing conspiracy theories.

However much social media demands this or that, nothing will happen now until the inquiry has finished.

There’ll be lots of noise from the rage baiters, but that’s just to make people angry. That’s not good for society either.

Yeah agree with that. The videos in this case are awful and I can totally understand the reaction to them. It sounded to me like you thought people should be entirely neutral to what they've seen, which I thought was a bit odd. Maybe I misunderstood?

Hopefully this will be a catalyst for change and something good can come out of something so awful.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Yeah agree with that. The videos in this case are awful and I can totally understand the reaction to them. It sounded to me like you thought people should be entirely neutral to what they've seen, which I thought was a bit odd. Maybe I misunderstood?

Hopefully this will be a catalyst for change and something good can come out of something so awful.

You can be appalled at a heinous crime on video and also believe that due process has to play out before demanding sackings and suggesting systemic racism is definitive.

 

[Cityboy1972]

I'm surprised a Sikh stooped to this level. I always had them as a peaceful faith. Interesting to hear Starmer's response to this evil murder later

 

[SWP's back]

I'm surprised a Sikh stooped to this level. I always had them as a peaceful faith. Interesting to hear Starmer's response to this evil murder later

Because a religion, or a lack of one, does not make someone good or bad.

This guy is a ****. He’s been jailed. It’s no reflection on his religion, race nor ethnicity. It’s a reflection on his character and him as a person.

If more people understood this then the political landscape would a great deal less full of cunts.

 

[Pingu the Penguin]

You can be appalled at a heinous crime on video and also believe that due process has to play out before demanding sackings and suggesting systemic racism is definitive.

Yeah agree. But I was commenting on your point that no one should have strong views on the case. Is that what you meant, or did you mean that no one should have strong views until the facts are fully investigated?

In this case the video shows the lad dying, telling the police he's been stabbed multiple times, is told "no you haven't", at one point the police officer drags him to position him to handcuff him, and then handcuffs him as he is bleeding out. It's actually quite difficult not to feel angry about that. I do.

 

[SWP's back]

Yeah agree. But I was commenting on your point that no one should have strong views on the case. Is that what you meant, or did you mean that no one should have strong views until the facts are fully investigated?

In this case the video shows the lad dying, telling the police he's been stabbed multiple times, is told "no you haven't", at one point the police officer drags him to position him to handcuff him, and then handcuffs him as he is bleeding out. It's actually quite difficult not to feel angry about that. I do.

Me too. Who are you angry at though?

 

[Bluesince1979]

Yeah agree. But I was commenting on your point that no one should have strong views on the case. Is that what you meant, or did you mean that no one should have strong views until the facts are fully investigated?

In this case the video shows the lad dying, telling the police he's been stabbed multiple times, is told "no you haven't", at one point the police officer drags him to position him to handcuff him, and then handcuffs him as he is bleeding out. It's actually quite difficult not to feel angry about that. I do.

Whilst the guy who stabbed him stands there saying “nah he hasnt been stabbed”.

Its fuckin awful and i can only imagine the people on here, always the same people, not understanding why people are angry , dont have kids

Maybe then they wouldnt be taking some weird high ground

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Yeah agree. But I was commenting on your point that no one should have strong views on the case. Is that what you meant, or did you mean that no one should have strong views until the facts are fully investigated?

In this case the video shows the lad dying, telling the police he's been stabbed multiple times, is told "no you haven't", at one point the police officer drags him to position him to handcuff him, and then handcuffs him as he is bleeding out. It's actually quite difficult not to feel angry about that. I do.

The latter. It’s the certainty of the view. The police officers have to give their account of why they reacted as they did and if that then breaches protocol, then they should face whatever sanction is appropriate.

My initial reaction to the video was shock and sadness for the victim.

 

[Pingu the Penguin]

Me too. Who are you angry at though?

I'm angry at the murderer as his dealings with the police inhibited the victim getting help. I'm also angry that the police's reaction as it is presented on the video.

 

[1961_vintage]

I'm surprised a Sikh stooped to this level. I always had them as a peaceful faith. Interesting to hear Starmer's response to this evil murder later

You're right and they are. They were very quick as a community to formally call this murdering twat out for what he is.

The sad reality is that every community has it's share of absolute nut-jobs, regardless of religion, skin colour, race, creed, gender etc etc etc.

 

[Pingu the Penguin]

The latter. It’s the certainty of the view. The police officers have to give their account of why they reacted as they did and if that then breaches protocol, then they should face whatever sanction is appropriate.

My initial reaction to the video was shock and sadness for the victim.

Great, thanks for clarifying.