SC Branch ticket allocation - What is the process?

[Mad Eyed Screamer]

It varies, but I got told last week I had one for Paris.

Yes but when you were told that, was that before tickets were on sale, on the 1st day or a day or two after? (sorry I have no idea when they went on sale)
My point is if branches find out beforehand how many they are getting then yes it does give branches the opportunity to then allocate tickets to non qualifiers and the qualifiers can sort themselves out. However, the qualifiers are left taking a risk if branches find out on the day of or after the day of sales for the big games where tickets are gold dust

 

[squirtyflower]

This is causing all sorts of problems on the forum for the moderating team, with accusations being thrown around that may or may not be warranted so it's time we understood the actual process. As I understand it (and if I'm wrong then feel free to correct me if you're involved) it's somethng like this:

1) The club tells branches when they need ticket applications for games and the minimum points criteria.

2) Branches submit the number of tickets they want, together with the supporter number of qualifying members. So if the points needed are 12,000 and they apply for 10 tickets, they must have 10 members with 12k or more. In theory this ensures no one without the required points can apply for a ticket. Applying does not commit them st this stage though.

3) The club decide on the SC allocation and inform the branch. So the branch applying for 10 might get 5.

4) The branch can then allocate the ticket to whoever they want once they've got them (although some may be strict and only allocate to numbers that originally applied)

5) This is the bit I'm a bit unclear on. The branch has to tell the club the supporter numbers of the 5 who have the tickets so they get the points. Those 5 aren't necessarily the 10 whose numbers supported the application so any of these 10 whose numbers weren't actually confirmed to the club could just get their own tickets (and the OSC may well have told branches that this is the best course of action for popular games).

6) The tickets go on sale through the normal route and anyone who qualifies via the points route can buy as long as their number hadn't been confirmed as a ticket recipient by the branch

If that's the case, the process appears to be OK up to and including step 3 and anyone saying branches can't apply unless the members meet the points criteria is actually correct. However there is no control over allocation once tickets are in the hands of the branch. Some may be strict and only allocate tickets to those who had the required points. But some clearly don't. But if my step 5 is right the club must know that supporter numbers they're being given didn't meet the criteria, so they're effectively complicit in this. And if they know, then the OSC certainly do.

I'm not interested in whether people believe the process is fair or not, any stories they have about abuse (unless they add anything to the understanding of the process) or any other opinions. Any posts that add nothing to the understanding will be deleted. We just want the facts and anyone who knows the process to tell us if it's right or wrong. If the latter, why it's wrong and what the right answer is. If people want to pm me that's fine. Their name won't be used.

1. Correct, the branch sometimes applies weeks in advance of them going on sale, they ask the members who wants a ticket
2. They submit the number they want, no other info is needed at that time
3. The club tell the SC who then divi up the tickets to the branches depending on application. Sometimes it's oversubscribed and allocations are reduced, however this isn't a transparent process
4. The branch allocates them to who they want, perhaps based on loyalty points (lol), usually based on their own criteria. It has been known for non citizens members to be allocated a ticket.
5. Most of the time the branch informs the club who has been allocated the ticket. Although there have been times when the points have been gerrymandered to someone else completely. There was no original supporter numbers given, see point 2. The branch always knows in advance who has been allocated the tickets. The ones without can apply in their own right through normal channels if they have the points.
6. Correct

In response to whyalwaysste's point that is nonesense. Some branches have all their members in the Secretary's Friends and Family. This person knows how many tickets have been allocated, say seven, but they asked for twelve. So what they do is apply for the top five loyalty points members ensuring they have the twelve. Or, alternatively, they will buy as many as possible until it has sold out and then offer the tickets out or sell them on.

You are completely wrong in your summation about the branch getting tickets allocated based on the number of members with the correct loyalty points. On the first level how do the club know what number they will sell out at? On the second I have personal knowledge of at least five people with Bournemouth tickets who haven't reached the dizzy heights of 10,000 points, in fact two of the branches don't even have a member with that many points yet they got an allocation. So what you posted there was actually incorrect.

Having tickets collected in the venue of the game doesn't stop the Supporters Club's little scam though, as evidenced by some getting tickets for PSG away already who hardly ever go. Yet the independent people with 15,000 points or more are still sweating on tomorrow.

 

[squirtyflower]

Yes but when you were told that, was that before tickets were on sale, on the 1st day or a day or two after? (sorry I have no idea when they went on sale)
My point is if branches find out beforehand how many they are getting then yes it does give branches the opportunity to then allocate tickets to non qualifiers and the qualifiers can sort themselves out. However, the qualifiers are left taking a risk if branches find out on the day of or after the day of sales for the big games where tickets are gold dust

They go on sale tomorrow. Therefore clearly he knows in advance. However Bilbo travels from Southampton to Machester to home games with his seasoncard and can be seen at most aways. Hardly undeserving.

Branches do exactly that, tomorrow they will be hovering up as many as possible to ensure they can fill their allocation. The difference is they won't be buying extra as they can't offload them this time.

 

[Corky]

Cronyism rather than meritocracy then. The only solution is not to allow branches an allocation, they can use their points like everyone else.

 

[blueyorkie]

Anyone going to Paris has to satisfy requirements, the tickets will only be valid for the nominated name. So they are not transferable, that applies to Supporters Clubs and individual applicants.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Anyone going to Paris has to satisfy requirements, the tickets will only be valid for the nominated name. So they are not transferable, that applies to Supporters Clubs and individual applicants.

The only requirement they have to satisfy is that the club has issued them a ticket and they are the person who is collecting it.

If a branch tells the club that x, y & z have been issued tickets, then I don't believe the club will check or even care that they qualify on the points criteria they issued for others. Why would they?

 

[squirtyflower]

The only requirement they have to satisfy is that the club has issued them a ticket and they are the person who is collecting it.

If a branch tells the club that x, y & z have been issued tickets, then I don't believe the club will check or even care that they qualify on the points criteria they issued for others. Why would they?

They don't

And that's one of the issues I left off your questions.
At normal away games the person given a ticket doesn't have to be member of the branch, but the person who's name is handed in has to be.
Therefore it's possible for someone on high points to get a ticket which is passed on to someone who's not a member but the high points person gets the points added to theirs.

At some of the games you really do ask yourself how some there have got tickets.

 

[cleavers]

At what point do supporters clubs find out they have received x amount of tickets?

Generally before they go on sale, but if its a limited allocation, they generally get told that we're not getting many (if any) before they apply for them.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

They don't

And that's one of the issues I left off your questions.
At normal away games the person given a ticket doesn't have to be member of the branch, but the person who's name is handed in has to be.
Therefore it's possible for someone on high points to get a ticket which is passed on to someone who's not a member but the high points person gets the points added to theirs.

At some of the games you really do ask yourself how some there have got tickets.

You don't have to be a member of a branch to do that though do you? There's a Facebook page, Twitter account and even here where that happens.

 

[squirtyflower]

You don't have to be a member of a branch to do that though do you? There's a Facebook page, Twitter account and even here where that happens.

I think you may find the branches have been doing it a lot longer and they are doing it with the allocation given to them by the club, I'm sure they would be please. And as I said before this is on an industrial scale, not someone posting on Facebook, which is not the subject of the thread you asked posters to respond to.

 

[cleavers]

You don't have to be a member of a branch to do that though do you? There's a Facebook page, Twitter account and even here where that happens.

Correct, and any SC branch knowingly giving AWAY tickets that they applied for, to none SC members should be reported, it shouldn't be happening.

If anyone wants to PM me any info, I'll happily do it for you, give me the name of the SC, and any other info that is legit, and I'll report it to the SC. Its wrong.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

I think we now understand the process, as far as one actually exists. Clearly the part of it most open to manipulation is the allocation of tickets within the branch, where there appear to be a range of ways of allocating tickets and the members depend, as someone says, on the integrity of the branch system or executive.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

I did tell people that posts that added nothing to the understanding of the process would be deleted. The point of this was to gain an understanding of that process because, as a moderating team, we have to deal with all sorts of accusations and arguments on this topic that we have no knowledge of. We've got that now so I'm locking the thread.