A Thought On Stadium Expansion

[Shauntheprofitmachine]

Easy way to fill it, in the upper tiers make tickets 15 quid adults and 10quid kids, it would be full in no time. We would start to rake in fans in a packed out Etihad Stadium, with 60,000 fans roaring City on.

 

[Metal Biker]

What's that old saying?

"It's better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it"

 

[Anonymous]

Looking at the average attendances since we moved in 2003 i am flabergasted that we averaged more in the first season than we did last year, we do indeed have static support and if anything it proves we have minimal day trippers.

The club have done a lot in my opinion to improve attendances at cup games but for whatever reason we do seem to have a lot of "can't be arsed" supporters it would seem, probably more than comparably sized clubs, no idea why this may be bearing in mind the changes in the alst few years...finance or lack of it?, lack of passion?????.

There must be tens of thousands of fans in Greater Manchester who used to do but haven't been for years the question is how do we attract them back.

Skewed figures Phil. In 2003 we didn't have a rake of cup replays against no-mark teams and didn't have games in the very much un-fancied europa cup.
Doesn't take many low attendance games to pull the averages down.

Can you provide the figures for home league games only for the 2 seasons? Think you'll see a difference if you can.

 

[philiph20]

We did have a few EUFA cup games in the first season at COMS- TNS,Lokeren and Groclin but i do take your point about League Cup games as had two away games that season ( i had to consult my complete record book :-) , my memory isn't that great ). You could argue that the away attendances were higher back then but still this season in games such as Stoke when we pleyed just after the final we couldn't fill the South stand section normally allocated to away fans so the actual increase in home fans since the stadium move despite the takeover and big names we could only have previously dreamed of is relatively small. The question is how do we get the fans back because the club seem to be doing their very best with sensible pricing, cup tie offers etc, what kind of crowds would similar sized clubs be getting if they were in our shoes?.

 

[Anonymous]

Average league home game attendances have risen steadily from 32,088 in 2002 to 45,905 in 2011. did peak above that in 2004 (? I think) but that was a season without the distraction of domestic cup and european competition.

Our overall seasonal attendance has certainly grown very well and league game averages are on the upward trend despite the extra games we now play at home (on the back of our success).

 

[philiph20]

You could argue that our gate have not increased to the same level that Newcastle and Sunderlands have since the expansion os SJP and Sunderland's move from Roker Park, SJP had a capacity of 360000 the ground was expanded to 52000 and they filled it and have virtually every season since. Sunderland had gates of 20000 and then went to 46000, they have dropped to around 40000 now but bearing in mind the takeover and the player we have i would have thought that EVERY home league game would have sold out minus the away section.The question is are we less passionate, poorer or maybe more cynical than the fans of those two clubs?.

 

[Blue Moon 2011]

These are the average Premier League attendances for the stadium, amazing that in our first season there we did better averages than last season. Suggests that our fanbase is rather static that we're still in a similar place with no real demand for extra seats.

2010–11 - 45,949 (96.2% capacity)
2009–10 - 45,512 (95.4% capacity)
2008–09 - 42,900 (89.9% capacity)
2007–08 - 42,126 (88.3% capacity)
2006–07 - 39,997 (83.8% capacity) <-- Pearce effect
2005–06 - 42,856 (89.8% capacity)
2004–05 - 45,192 (94.7% capacity)
2003–04 - 46,834 (98.1% capacity)

Does someone have similar figures going back to say 1990 with what percentage of capacity we were running at and stating maximum capacity due to the number of changes to Maine Road during this time (new and temporary stands)
It would be interesting to see what percentage of capacity we were running at before moving as we obviously found the fans to fill the leap in capacity for the Ethiad stadium.

The average attendances also show a steady increase with the improvements over the last few years with not much spare capacity for this to continue, with the fa cup win, marque players (Ageuro) increased exposure (Champions league, marketing and media) and expectation we could be running even closer to capacity this season? If this were to continue where would this leave us?

Increased capacity is also not just ticket revenues but food drink revenues, merchandise and sponsorship. Also the number of increased games and quality opponents the champions league will bring means the effect is multiplied further. If you compare the matchday income with other top clubs (matchday income shown halfway down link) we have a lot of room to expand and improve this revenue stream with ffp upon us.

<a class="postlink" href="http://swissramble.blogspot.com/2011/07/manchester-citys-incredible-deal-know.html?utm_source=BP_recent" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://swissramble.blogspot.com/2011/07 ... =BP_recent</a>

 

[pauls]

My view on Newcastle is their catchment area is significant, ther is only one team to support, for us even Liverpool is only 30 miles away. Their promotion back at the first attempt was crucial or their "fans" would have deserted them in droves.

 

[bluestevei]

These are the average Premier League attendances for the stadium, amazing that in our first season there we did better averages than last season. Suggests that our fanbase is rather static that we're still in a similar place with no real demand for extra seats.

2010–11 - 45,949 (96.2% capacity)
2009–10 - 45,512 (95.4% capacity)
2008–09 - 42,900 (89.9% capacity)
2007–08 - 42,126 (88.3% capacity)
2006–07 - 39,997 (83.8% capacity) <-- Pearce effect
2005–06 - 42,856 (89.8% capacity)
2004–05 - 45,192 (94.7% capacity)
2003–04 - 46,834 (98.1% capacity)


in 2003-04 coms was a new ground to go to, thats why there was more then, plus away teams dont bring that many to us nowadays as most have been here

 

[dowty]

These are the average Premier League attendances for the stadium, amazing that in our first season there we did better averages than last season. Suggests that our fanbase is rather static that we're still in a similar place with no real demand for extra seats.

2010–11 - 45,949 (96.2% capacity)
2009–10 - 45,512 (95.4% capacity)
2008–09 - 42,900 (89.9% capacity)
2007–08 - 42,126 (88.3% capacity)
2006–07 - 39,997 (83.8% capacity) <-- Pearce effect
2005–06 - 42,856 (89.8% capacity)
2004–05 - 45,192 (94.7% capacity)
2003–04 - 46,834 (98.1% capacity)

You have to remember that some away support only fill the lower tier, sometimes not evan that, which reduces attendances considerably

 

[Roger Ringpiece]

Which would be the same for future seasons as well as the past ones that have clearly not come close to being full on average since the first season. As someone else said, it's bizarre that the average for a season we only guaranteed our Premier League safety with 2 weeks of the season to go is 900 higher than our most successful season in over 30 years.

These are the average Premier League attendances for the stadium, amazing that in our first season there we did better averages than last season. Suggests that our fanbase is rather static that we're still in a similar place with no real demand for extra seats.

2010–11 - 45,949 (96.2% capacity)
2009–10 - 45,512 (95.4% capacity)
2008–09 - 42,900 (89.9% capacity)
2007–08 - 42,126 (88.3% capacity)
2006–07 - 39,997 (83.8% capacity) <-- Pearce effect
2005–06 - 42,856 (89.8% capacity)
2004–05 - 45,192 (94.7% capacity)
2003–04 - 46,834 (98.1% capacity)

You have to remember that some away support only fill the lower tier, sometimes not evan that, which reduces attendances considerably

 

[Irwell]

My view on Newcastle is their catchment area is significant, ther is only one team to support, for us even Liverpool is only 30 miles away. Their promotion back at the first attempt was crucial or their "fans" would have deserted them in droves.

Greater Manchester has around three times the population of Tyneside and a higher population than the entire North East region... Their catchment area isn't all that big really.

 

[BlueAnorak]

The torsion ring pulled taught by cables to the four pillars at the corners of the ground supports a lot of the weight of the roof. The rest is held in place by suspension cables from the pylons atop the 8 circular walkways. As such the weight of the roof redirected through the back of the stand structure is minimal. It would therefore not take too much effort to remove the roof at one end put a third tier on and put a new roof on. The issue is the increased attendance generated at both ends would only be around 9,600 (8 blocks at each end with around 600 in each block) increasing capacity to around 58,100.
Note: Only 8 blocks could be added at each end in this way as the corners of the ground would have to be open as they are now for lighting and ventilation reasons.

To do this you remove the roof at one end during an close-season, build during the season and put a new roof on during the following close-season. The club would lose revenue from one dining room for a season and the back rows of the 2nd tear (up to around 2000 would have to be relocated).

The work wouldn't be as expensive as some have suggested but is the limited extra capacity achieved worth the effort?

The cheapest way to increase capacity however would be to resurface the concrete slopes with less space between rows. We have an extra 2-3 inches of leg-room compared with most clubs in the Prem and if this was reduced in one tier all the way round, I reckon we would get an extra 5000 in the ground as it is.

The alternative would be to build 4 massive towers outside the ground at the corners of the ground and put a new roof on this structure (as per the San Siro). Maybe even with a closable roof. This would be a separate structure to the Stadium and would allow more extension room at each end - with even an eventual 4th tier possible. This could boost ground capacity to 70k or even 80k.

If I was the club, with the wealth they have, then I'd do the later as it gives them so many more options. I think it more likely that a combination of the first two options will happen however.

Costs could be separated from UEFA FFP as costs could be incurred by a third party building the extensions and renting the extension back to us.

 

[pauls]

thats the point, there are only 3 teams if you include Middlesbrough 30odd miles away to support, City have competition from many other teams, even Stoke is around 30 miles away given the greater "population".