Another new Brexit thread

[hgblue]

Behave there have been thread after thread with debates on both sides . Arguments during the referendum and after where both sides debated the pros and cons of leaving on tv radio and bluemoon.

You just choose not to listen to the other side of the argument

Yet to see any leaver....

What bollox

Try posting about the £8 billion per year in contributions we're saving, the freedom to negotiate our own trade deals with the growing economies outside the EU, the restoration of Parliamentary sovereignty, the supremacy of the British courts, the ability to control who and how many are allowed into this country, the ability to set our own farming policy outside the CAP, the ability to regain control of our own fishing waters, the possibility of reducing tariffs on goods coming from outside the EU, not to mention the common sense of getting out now before the federalists start chipping away further at the rebate and opt outs or deciding that a trading bloc needs it's own army, and see what happens ;)

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

Give us just one example of why we’ll be better off out then?

I refer you to hgblue post below . Take your pick of those

You may not agree with them but for that poster to say no leaver has ever said a good reason for leaving the Eu is well as I said bollox

It’s was debated over and over again to the point of boredom

 

[yerwot?]

I refer you to hgblue post below . Take your pick of those

You may not agree with them but for that poster to say no leaver has ever said a good reason for leaving the Eu is well as I said bollox

It’s was debated over and over again to the point of boredom

The crucial word is Good, not the airyfairy shite the mail/sun bojiac erg far-right thatcher idolisers pump out, and swallowed by the brexit at any cost foot-stampers. plainly addicted to lies and lying x

 

[Ban-jani]

I refer you to hgblue post below . Take your pick of those

You may not agree with them but for that poster to say no leaver has ever said a good reason for leaving the Eu is well as I said bollox

It’s was debated over and over again to the point of boredom

Yeah it’s pure shite to be honest. The only one that is a potential is fishing and even that isn’t clear cut if it will benefit as an industry or not. For the record it’s 0.12% of GDP, our fishing industry so if we’re doing all of this to potentially benefit this one industry, it’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.

“£8million contributions we’ll save” - and as a net benefit of our membership we annually make +4% of GDP, as an average. It’s paying to be a member of a trading club where you constantly win more than it costs to be a member. Ridiculous point.

“Setting up our own trade deals” - trade will be diminished significantly and we trade freely with major markets all around the world through the EU, who act on our behalf and to our benefit in this area. We’re about to see how much we’ve fucked up in this area.

“The restoration of parliament sovereignty” - we have that now and always have done, well for hundreds of years. Parliament has always been able to trigger A50 and leave the EU, that is the essence of sovereignty. The reason it’s taken us 3 years and we haven’t done is because leaving the most lucrative club on the planet is a bad idea. We can always leave without a deal though which is the way it’s going, and you’ll see how shit that is.

“The ability to control who and how many come and go..” - we have immigration controls now and don’t use them. Immigration will go down from the EU but up from elsewhere when we’re desperate for trade deals, countries will ask for visas.

The argument on future federalism is just a “what if” argument and it doesn’t make sense to absolutely ruin ourselves because of what might happen in the future. I don’t think federalism is a bad thing anyway, globalisation and fluidity between nations is the future and inevitable generally speaking around the world.

 

[stonerblue]

I'm happy how I voted, and it wasn't from fear, unlike the remain side who voted because they were scared
witless by all the false statements.

wrong.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

Yeah it’s pure shite to be honest. The only one that is a potential is fishing and even that isn’t clear cut if it will benefit as an industry or not. For the record it’s 0.12% of GDP, our fishing industry so if we’re doing all of this to potentially benefit this one industry, it’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.

“£8million contributions we’ll save” - and as a net benefit of our membership we annually make +4% of GDP, as an average. It’s paying to be a member of a trading club where you constantly win more than it costs to be a member. Ridiculous point.

“Setting up our own trade deals” - trade will be diminished significantly and we trade freely with major markets all around the world through the EU, who act on our behalf and to our benefit in this area. We’re about to see how much we’ve fucked up in this area.

“The restoration of parliament sovereignty” - we have that now and always have done, well for hundreds of years. Parliament has always been able to trigger A50 and leave the EU, that is the essence of sovereignty. The reason it’s taken us 3 years and we haven’t done is because leaving the most lucrative club on the planet is a bad idea. We can always leave without a deal though which is the way it’s going, and you’ll see how shit that is.

“The ability to control who and how many come and go..” - we have immigration controls now and don’t use them. Immigration will go down from the EU but up from elsewhere when we’re desperate for trade deals, countries will ask for visas.

The argument on future federalism is just a “what if” argument and it doesn’t make sense to absolutely ruin ourselves because of what might happen in the future. I don’t think federalism is a bad thing anyway, globalisation and fluidity between nations is the future and inevitable generally speaking around the world.

I am beyond caring those arguments have been done to death these in every thread

It’s summer and when anything new am happy to debate the new position

And I don’t want a no deal Brexit !!

 

[Ban-jani]

I am beyond caring those arguments have been done to death these in every thread

It’s summer and when anything new am happy to debate the new position

And I don’t want a no deal Brexit !!

The last line is very positive.

 

[Ban-jani]

I am beyond caring those arguments have been done to death these in every thread

It’s summer and when anything new am happy to debate the new position

And I don’t want a no deal Brexit !!

To be fair though he made the points, you liked them and agreed with them and then pointed me in their direction as an answer on your behalf.

I’m only trying to explain to you, in black and white, why these consistent points from leave supporters are utter rubbish.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Michael Gove 2016 “if we do vote to leave, we’ll be able to dictate the terms to the EU”.

How’s that going Michael?

Of all the politicians currently pontificating about the stance of the EU, this ****'s definitely got the most egregious chutzpah, apart from Johnson possibly.

He's got a fucking nerve, I'll give him that.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

I'm happy how I voted, and it wasn't from fear, unlike the remain side who voted because they were scared
witless by all the false statements.

I was literally shitting my pants as I cast my vote.

 

[blueinsa]

I was literally shitting my pants as I cast my vote.

10 pints of bitter at lunch is never a good idea before an evening vote mate.

 

[Ban-jani]

10 pints of bitter at lunch is never a good idea before an evening vote mate.

10 pints and he still made the right decision ;-)

 

[Zuriblue]

Ive yet to see any Leaver , brexit minister, Tory ERG MP... list a positive other than the 'ethereal Sunny Uplands'

Blue passports?

 

[yerwot?]

Yeah it’s pure shite to be honest. The only one that is a potential is fishing and even that isn’t clear cut if it will benefit as an industry or not. For the record it’s 0.12% of GDP, our fishing industry so if we’re doing all of this to potentially benefit this one industry, it’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.

“£8million contributions we’ll save” - and as a net benefit of our membership we annually make +4% of GDP, as an average. It’s paying to be a member of a trading club where you constantly win more than it costs to be a member. Ridiculous point.

“Setting up our own trade deals” - trade will be diminished significantly and we trade freely with major markets all around the world through the EU, who act on our behalf and to our benefit in this area. We’re about to see how much we’ve fucked up in this area.

“The restoration of parliament sovereignty” - we have that now and always have done, well for hundreds of years. Parliament has always been able to trigger A50 and leave the EU, that is the essence of sovereignty. The reason it’s taken us 3 years and we haven’t done is because leaving the most lucrative club on the planet is a bad idea. We can always leave without a deal though which is the way it’s going, and you’ll see how shit that is.

“The ability to control who and how many come and go..” - we have immigration controls now and don’t use them. Immigration will go down from the EU but up from elsewhere when we’re desperate for trade deals, countries will ask for visas.

The argument on future federalism is just a “what if” argument and it doesn’t make sense to absolutely ruin ourselves because of what might happen in the future. I don’t think federalism is a bad thing anyway, globalisation and fluidity between nations is the future and inevitable generally speaking around the world.[/QUOTE
Wish i had posted that, even though it is basically what the remainers have said for three years. Over and over again, brexit boils down to we won you lost....and fairy tales.

 

[i kne albert davy]

10 pints and he still made the right decision ;-)

And all the time I thought he'd voted to stay in, he's gone up in my estimation now I know he didn't.

 

[Ban-jani]

And all the time I thought he'd voted to stay in, he's gone up in my estimation now I know he didn't.

:-)

 

[Saddleworth2]

Try posting about the £8 billion per year in contributions we're saving, the freedom to negotiate our own trade deals with the growing economies outside the EU, the restoration of Parliamentary sovereignty, the supremacy of the British courts, the ability to control who and how many are allowed into this country, the ability to set our own farming policy outside the CAP, the ability to regain control of our own fishing waters, the possibility of reducing tariffs on goods coming from outside the EU, not to mention the common sense of getting out now before the federalists start chipping away further at the rebate and opt outs or deciding that a trading bloc needs it's own army, and see what happens ;)

Yeah it’s pure shite to be honest. The only one that is a potential is fishing and even that isn’t clear cut if it will benefit as an industry or not. For the record it’s 0.12% of GDP, our fishing industry so if we’re doing all of this to potentially benefit this one industry, it’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.

“£8million contributions we’ll save” - and as a net benefit of our membership we annually make +4% of GDP, as an average. It’s paying to be a member of a trading club where you constantly win more than it costs to be a member. Ridiculous point.

“Setting up our own trade deals” - trade will be diminished significantly and we trade freely with major markets all around the world through the EU, who act on our behalf and to our benefit in this area. We’re about to see how much we’ve fucked up in this area.

“The restoration of parliament sovereignty” - we have that now and always have done, well for hundreds of years. Parliament has always been able to trigger A50 and leave the EU, that is the essence of sovereignty. The reason it’s taken us 3 years and we haven’t done is because leaving the most lucrative club on the planet is a bad idea. We can always leave without a deal though which is the way it’s going, and you’ll see how shit that is.

“The ability to control who and how many come and go..” - we have immigration controls now and don’t use them. Immigration will go down from the EU but up from elsewhere when we’re desperate for trade deals, countries will ask for visas.

The argument on future federalism is just a “what if” argument and it doesn’t make sense to absolutely ruin ourselves because of what might happen in the future. I don’t think federalism is a bad thing anyway, globalisation and fluidity between nations is the future and inevitable generally speaking around the world.

And there we have it friends and fellow blues. The clearest articulation of the benefits of both sides after all this time. Feel free to strengthen the case for either side but I think @hgblue and @Ban-jani have pretty well articulated the case for Leave and Remain.

 

[BlueHammer85]

And there we have it friends and fellow blues. The clearest articulation of the benefits of both sides after all this time. Feel free to strengthen the case for either side but I think @hgblue and @Ban-jani have pretty well articulated the case for Leave and Remain.

except the fact @Ban-jani has totally debunked @hgblue points

 

[Saddleworth2]

What the EU does for its citizens

Since 1957, the European Union has benefited its citizens by working for peace and prosperity. It helps protect our basic political, social and economic rights. Although we may take them for granted, these benefits improve our daily lives.

Peace & Security
Central and western Europe has never known so long a period without war. The EU is the most successful peace project in human history and has been awarded the Nobel Peace Prize. Europeans are closely linked economically and culturally, and through the democratic values we share.

Single Market
The single market is the world's most highly developed and open marketplace. It is based on the EU’s 4 key freedoms, which enable you and other citizens to:

1. live or work in any EU country
2. move your money
3. sell goods without restrictions
4. provide services on the same basis.

High food & environmental standards
Because EU countries cooperate so closely, our food and our environment meet some of the world's highest quality standards. Unscrupulous companies can't get away with selling contaminated food or polluting our rivers and countryside.

Consumer benefits
Shoppers can now feel safe in the knowledge that they will get their money back if they return products. Travellers can buy train or plane tickets, knowing they can get a refund if their journey is delayed or cancelled. And the standards which goods in EU shops are required to meet are among the world's most stringent, in terms of both quality and safety.

Human Rights
The EU protects all minorities and vulnerable groups, and stands up for the oppressed. Regardless of a person's nationality, gender, language group, culture, profession, disability or sexuality, the EU insists on equal treatment for all.

Global Power
EU countries acting in unison have much more of a voice on the world stage than 28 small and medium-sized nations acting separately. We have political clout. As regards trade, our regulatory and product standards are adopted worldwide as the global norm.

Other benefits the EU brings its citizens are:

• You can use your phone and online services at no extra cost wherever you are in the EU. You can also access your online video and music streaming services across the EU, safe in the knowledge that your personal data is protected under EU law.
• Your rights are protected while you're travelling: EU rules protect your rights in the event of delays or cancellations. Whether travelling by plane, train, boat or bus, you are entitled to fair treatment.
• You can benefit from training and support for your business: EU programmes like Erasmus+ help you get training to make the most of your career. The EU also helps you get the most out of your business – from finance to coaching, and from business networks to exchange schemes.
• As a worker, you're protected from unfair treatment in the workplace under the EU Charter of Fundamental Rights. This bans discrimination, including in the areas of pay and dismissals.
• As an EU citizen, you're protected against the downsides of globalisation by EU support for small businesses and rules to make sure that big companies pay their fair share of tax.

 

[Saddleworth2]

except the fact @Ban-jani has totally debunked @hgblue points

and your point is? ;-)