Another new Brexit thread

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ric
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
abu13 said:
Could the EU not bring this to a close by just refusing another extension?

They could argue that we have had over 3years to sort this, 3 PM's, 2 deals agreed with the EU already and is it 2 or 3 extensions already, if we can't sort our politics out then that is our problem.

Take the deal on the table now or fuck off, although i suspect they may be more diplomatic than this.

I struggle with the general election arguement as well, what if i agree with a parties stance on Brexit but nothing else? This seems a major and obvious flaw to me.
Click to expand...


Well the EU either have the patience of a saint and must really like us Brits or they are pretty desperate for us to stay. I’m going the latter. You are right a general election with 4 parties having different policies resulting in no over all control will not help at all. A referendum is a shocking idea and no one agrees with what the question would be.

We need a deal to get through before national madness sets in.
 
Rascal said:
Dominic Raab on Marr, totally confusing high levels of employment with workers rights.

There is simply no correlation between them.

Marr as usual doesn't follow up and question his ridiculous statement
Click to expand...

780,000 people on zero hours too, it might suit some people but others are there on a whim of the employers.
 
Chippy_boy said:
However Bob, there are two conflicting imperatives here and unfortunately one of them has to go, or at least be compromised.

We cannot simply ignore the result of a democratic referendum mandating that we should leave the EU. And it was entirely obvious that control of immigration was at the very core of that entire debate and it would be a total betrayal to implement a Brexit with open borders. This rules out CU membership and then we are stuck with the compromise currently on the table.

Is it perfect? No. But none of the options are perfect. MPs need to reflect upon the fact that the perfect solution does not exist, and the Johnson deal is about as good as it gets. Unless you just want to can the whole thing, which we just CANNOT do.
Click to expand...

Based on that logic I agree. But I would also appreciate some honesty about it. If this is all about immigration then we should just say so and if imposing internal borders within our own Union is the only solution then let’s say that instead of claiming ‘it’s a good deal for NI’ because if it is then the rest of would like some of that deal too and if we can’t have it then tell us why. Immigrants. And if Scotland say well we ain’t bothered by the immigration argument because we voted Remain so let’s have a slice of what NI is having then why are we going to say no you can’t? Precedent? Well that’s gone. Can’t be done? Ditto.

And how long will it take to get these new arrangements up and running? HMRC said 5-7 years when tasked with looking at it for May’s CU bespoke partnership. Transition is 14 months. It took us 6 years to roll out the Universal Credit system and its barely fit for purpose. Bearing in mind HMRC will also be be preparing the rest of the UK for different customs and trading arrangements with the EU and beyond if trade deals aren’t rolled over. And we are doing all this in 14 months?

And what are we obsessing over? Votes on whether we can ok a deal or not oblivious to the fact we still had to pass the bloody Act afterwards which the Letwin Amendment has thankfully brought back into focus. Not that the media noticed. All they can do is wank about Johnson sending three letters and not signing one as if it was some sort of masterstroke. Anything else like how transition is no where near long enough or how we have put up an internal border and compromised our own sovereignty or the liklihood of NI going up in flames seems to have escaped the media’s attention.
 
As attention (finally) turns to the European Withdrawal Bill Starmer sets out Labour’s position. From the Times.

‘Keir Starmer reveals Labour will take three-pronged approach to amendments to Brexit legislation next week
* Backing a second referendum amendment tabled by backbenchers
* Customs Union amendment
* Closing 'trapdoor to no-deal' at end of transition’
 
Ban-jani said:
Do you not think we look an international embarrassment because of Parliament not being able to find a way through ?
Click to expand...
I would be more ashamed if that 'deal' had been waved through with insufficient scrutiny. The only thing I am truly ashamed of is having Johnson as a PM and displaying the behaviours of a playground bully.
 
mcfc1632 said:
Yep - people dress it up - but that is the truth of it
Click to expand...

They have started sowing the seed today in intervies how Theresa May deal is better / softer.

Expect another motion asking for a vote on Theresa May’s deal as well. If it does I expect bercow will allow it to be voted on again.
 
hilts said:
Well the EU either have the patience of a saint and must really like us Brits or they are pretty desperate for us to stay. I’m going the latter. You are right a general election with 4 parties having different policies resulting in no over all control will not help at all. A referendum is a shocking idea and no one agrees with what the question would be.

We need a deal to get through before national madness sets in.
Click to expand...

I get the real feeling that Brexit will be the death of politics as we know it, one way or another something has to change. I agree that a referendum would cause chaos as i now think remain would win based on two key points, firstly the number of youngsters who could not vote last time that now can and the complete lack of trust in our politicians to move forward.
You then have the issue that if remain won then the leave support would be rightfully up in arms.

It's a clusterfuck however it is viewed.
 
kevin horlocks wand said:
They have started sowing the seed today in intervies how Theresa May deal is better / softer.

Expect another motion asking for a vote on Theresa May’s deal as well. If it does I expect bercow will allow it to be voted on again.
Click to expand...
It would be pointless the DUP and ERG would vote against it.
 
Vic said:
Yeah but ...

Those who want to "respect" the referendum don't care. They want empathy, but do not grasp the sense of outrage at the illegal practices that led to the result.
Click to expand...
They simply do not understand the strength of feeling amongst those that have never seen the outcome of the referendum as legitimate.
 
Minister Michael Gove has insisted the UK will still leave the EU by 31 October, despite a government letter sent to Brussels asking for a delay.

Boris Johnson sent the letter - unsigned - after a major setback in the Commons to his Brexit strategy.

But the request was accompanied by a second letter, signed by the PM, saying he believed a delay would be a mistake.

Mr Gove told Sky News the government still had "the means and ability" to leave on 31 October.

The minister, who as chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster is in charge of no-deal planning, said "the prime minister's determination is absolute" and the government's "determined policy" was to meet that deadline.

"We know that the EU want us to leave, we know that we have a deal that allows us to leave," he told the Sophy Ridge programme.

From BBC 'Breaking News'

So he is basically saying to hell with Parliament. The Government will do exactly as it wants. Not sure thats what 'taking back democracy' means.
 
Vic said:
Yeah but ...

Those who want to "respect" the referendum don't care. They want empathy, but do not grasp the sense of outrage at the illegal practices that led to the result.
Click to expand...

They are all liars. They ignore the truth and carry on lying to themselves and anyone who will listen. Critical thinking appears to be completely beyond them.

Leavers - we won get it done
Me - but it will be massively damaging
Leaver - yeah but we voted and we won
Me - the promises leave made were nonsense
Leaver - yeah but we voted
Me - why are we doing this ? It’s madness, we are all going to be worse off in so many ways
Leaver - fuck off ! We want our prize !
Me - but there is no prize, not for ordinary people anyway
Leaver - fuck off ! I don’t care I wanna crash out !
Me - you’re deranged
Walks away
 
BobKowalski said:
As attention (finally) turns to the European Withdrawal Bill Starmer sets out Labour’s position. From the Times.

‘Keir Starmer reveals Labour will take three-pronged approach to amendments to Brexit legislation next week
* Backing a second referendum amendment tabled by backbenchers
* Customs Union amendment
* Closing 'trapdoor to no-deal' at end of transition’
Click to expand...

@blueinsa told you....

On and on it will go.
 
Vic said:
Yeah but ...

Those who want to "respect" the referendum don't care. They want empathy, but do not grasp the sense of outrage at the illegal practices that led to the result.
Click to expand...

The scouse victim mentality is strong Vic.

The CPS and the Met police found no evidence, none despite you saying it was there and people would be going to jail etc etc.

Like the Trump thread in which he is being impeached in the next hour for certain this time, you post up tweets as some sort of proof when in reality it reaffirms your own victim mentality and nothing else.
 
BobKowalski said:
As attention (finally) turns to the European Withdrawal Bill Starmer sets out Labour’s position. From the Times.

‘Keir Starmer reveals Labour will take three-pronged approach to amendments to Brexit legislation next week
* Backing a second referendum amendment tabled by backbenchers
* Customs Union amendment
* Closing 'trapdoor to no-deal' at end of transition’
Click to expand...

So the Letwin amendment wasn't to make time to discuss the deal and pass it then?

Well I never Bob.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top