Another new Brexit thread

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mcfc1632 said:
Really - have you got mirrors in your house?

You do not come one here that often. Invariably when you do you make a post like this attacking me - I guess because you are seeking to provoke/goad me into a personal argument with you.

No thanks - I have better things to do.
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Gosh - would that you'd said that many times before.
 
Ban-jani said:
I did actually say they had better arguments than those that call the show.

The people that call the show talk about three-pronged plugs and bendy bananas.

The arguments on here about a further federal Europe and the ability to actually leave the bloc in future are seemingly looking to be true.

The fact that the economy is predicted to outgrow the Eurozone proves some were correct.

Debating the likes of these two examples is better than what JOB has to contend with.
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Saddleworth2 said:
I haven't seen a killer post or anything that approaches it but I think a pretty consistent theme emerges from most posters on here of fundamental future risk to our sovereignty and an unstoppable march to a centralist european union that overrides our own parliament. That there is a fundamental economic risk to individual country's economy from the Euro project. Add to that the inability to trade on our own terms with the rest of the world which is seen as a missed opportunity. That would be the way I would describe it if asked and I put that forward sincerely as my distillation of the Brexit position on here.

I do think the case is made more eloquently on here than it is on the JO'B radio show. At least I understand where posters on here are coming from even if I don't agree with their position.

I listen to James pretty often. Like him a great deal. Like the way he shines a spotlight on stuff that needs a spotlight shone on it, not just Brexit. Find him refreshingly different to most mainstream media and feel he does the kind of challenge that the BBC used to do and have lost in their quest for balance (giving equal air time to lies than they do to truths is not balance imo). Unlike some on here I don't find him arrogant, indeed he comes across as extremely principled and even if you don't agree with him his logic is consistent and I certainly haven't ever caught him lying. For me he embodies what I hold precious in what I thought was the overwhelming DNA of the UK, truth, honesty, compassion, openness to other cultures - that kind of 'old fashioned' stuff.
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What very good answers

The remorseless drive to a federal EU that would include the UK was a major reason for people voting for Brexit - this was rubbished on here in 2016-2018 but has been proven to be spot-on.

Also the predictions of doom and gloom to immediately descend in 2016 and beyond which Remainers screamed from the rooftops has been proven to be utterly false / bollocks.

Good answers, but given the facts it seems strange that anyone should need it explaining.
 
Vic said:
That's an odd riposte to a fact.
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Fact?

Its not because you have zero clue as to what future agreements will be in place.

If you want to believe because it suits your narrative that UK airlines wont be able to set up routes in the EU then knock yourself out.

Im not buying it nor agreeing with it though, sorry.
 
Vic said:
If Gove got through, O'Brien would ask what happened to the promise that we'd still be in a free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border.
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I actually have a lot of time for others on LBC (other than Farage). Eddie Mair and Sheila Ferguson are particularly good. Even Ian Dale who is mates with Johnson is a cut above most you would listen to on BBC.
 
mcfc1632 said:
Well apart your post being generally incorrect...…..

FWIW - given that a lot of people do not bother with facts, the facts are:

1. Yes I did indeed post many time that there was not need for the UK to take responsibility for implementing a hard border along the ROI border. I was clear that there was not need and that if there was to be such a border introduced then we should leave it to Ireland to implement at the EU behest.

So, yes I was proven to be wholly correct

2. Months before the WA agreed by Johnson I stated that the outcome would be the Irish Sea border

So, yes I was proven to be wholly correct on that one as well.

Anyway - as there is a tendency for some posters to get locked into 'camps' and to show that I see myself as more objective - I post the following article which I feel you would have a lot of empathy with

http://eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=87508 ​
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1. Incorrect. The UK has a responsibility to manage its own borders as we expect other countries to manage theirs. The UK also accepted this responsibility. The idea that this was going to be solely down to the EU and/or Ireland was always a nonsense and was deservedly treated with contempt for its lack of honesty.

2. I cannot attest to this either way so I will accept your assertion. However it does feel somewhat at odds with your prior statement specifically we had no obligation to impose and manage a land border but we had an obligation to impose and manage a sea border?

A good article and if we start accepting that the upcoming ‘trade negotiations’ are not just about trade but a projection of power, and in our case also falls under the ‘EU’s Good Neighbourhood Policy’, then we can stop mentioning trade surpluses, German carmakers or whatever.
 
mcfc1632 said:
What very good answers

The remorseless drive to a federal EU that would include the UK was a major reason for people voting for Brexit - this was rubbished on here in 2016-2018 but has been proven to be spot-on.

Also the predictions of doom and gloom to immediately descend in 2016 and beyond which Remainers screamed from the rooftops has been proven to be utterly false / bollocks.

Good answers, but given the facts it seems strange that anyone should need it explaining.
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You should tutor those that Phone in to James O’Brien. Or try it yourself? I would pay good money to listen to that ;-)
Ps. My post in no way indicates I have flipped by the way. Just distilling what I thought was the most consistent messages heard on here from those that voted to leave the EU.
 
blueinsa said:
Why? We are in a transition phase and as such still qualify to live and work in the EU and when we dont at the end of that transition phase they will update their ads as seen in the article.

No one is stopping anyone applying for the roles advertised.
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He will likely be back with an apology for being again misleading - you think?
 
Ifwecouldjust....... said:
So .... you think Ryan Air (as tight as they are ) are going to onboard an employee , train them for months on the chance that the Eu will allow freedom of movement and the ability to work after the transition period without reciprocity from the UK?
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Are you saying that recruitment / employee regulations and rights - as set out by the UK and EU in 2020 - are to be simply ignored by O'Leary

If you are not saying that then there are logical conclusions I am afraid
 
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Saddleworth2 said:
I just don’t get that from listening to him. I listen to him three or four times a week while I’m In the gym and I think he is fairer to people than most. His style is to mirror back words and comments and ask what they mean (many don’t get past that) and then ask for facts to back it up (even more fail with that one). He certainly accepts informed opinion and opinion backed up with facts. Now I accept that it’s possible that they filter folk coming on but you would have thought that some would get through that can give as good as they get. Sadly not whilst I have been listening.
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Ban-jani said:
He has improved over the last 5-6 years.

I always remember him getting battered by Lampard over the phone, live on air. He was slagging Lampard off for his relationship ending and his kids living away from him in an apartment, without knowing any of the facts.

Lampard actually rang in and gave him hell but you could hear the arrogance, smugness and self-entitlement pouring out of him.

He’s much better now.
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Fair enough - I admit my opinion of him was formed some time ago - and it was not just based on his views - it was more the way he was playing to the audience and simply talked over people.

Surely the role of a 'proper commentator/presenter' should be to interact with those that call in and engage them with debate - and if they are struggling to get their points across help them.

I see/hear Sheila Fogharty, Ian Dale and others do that - O'Brien just seeks the opportunity (or at least used to) to ridicule and abuse.

I understand that Remainers will have enjoyed his shows over the years. That will be a mix, I suggest, of genuine admiration from some and for others it will be just that he was championing their cause and that was enough.

But I will make a point of turning on (rather than on) next time I am driving somewhere at the appropriate time and test what he is like in 2020
 
mcfc1632 said:
Fair enough - I admit my opinion of him was formed some time ago - and it was not just based on his views - it was more the way he was playing to the audience and simply talked over people.

Surely the role of a 'proper commentator/presenter' should be to interact with those that call in and engage them with debate - and if they are struggling to get their points across help them.

I see/hear Sheila Fogharty, Ian Dale and others do that - O'Brien just seeks the opportunity (or at least used to) to ridicule and abuse.

I understand that Remainers will have enjoyed his shows over the years. That will be a mix, I suggest, of genuine admiration from some and for others it will be just that he was championing their cause and that was enough.

But I will make a point of turning on (rather than on) next time I am driving somewhere at the appropriate time and test what he is like in 2020
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Iain Dale is the best on LBC, even as a leave voter, in the height of the Brexit chaos, I completely respected him.
 
blueinsa said:
He too will be proven to be wrong.
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It entirely depends on how the negotiations go. Assuming there is no legal impediment to granting this access I doubt if it’s high on the EU’s ‘must have’ list more on its ‘happy to trade this so make me an offer’ list.
 
Vic said:
If Gove got through, O'Brien would ask what happened to the promise that we'd still be in a free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border.
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What would you suggest Gove's answer would be?

I am guessing something like...….

"That was clearly our ambition, but it was predicated on the EU acting in good faith and not seeking to use the negotiations to date, supported by their sycophants at Westminster, to hamstring and coerce the UK into positions that are detrimental to the UK's interests.

Also James, I am sure that you will have clear recall of the promises made by the key Remain representatives - including the PM and Chancellor - that a vote to Leave certainly meant that the UK would Leave the SM and CU...….

It is just a fact that the attitude of the EU has meant that not all ambitions can be realised - but certainly I would think that the majority of the Leave voters that I represented would place the realisation of the Remain commitments of leaving the SM and CU are the priority. I am also sure therefore that they would forgive me if my scope of ambition is 'perhaps' not going to be realised due to the attitudes - to date - of the EU.

Surely only a pedantic and boring person would be going on and on about it years later - you are not such a person are you James?"

That seems a likely and appropriate response don't you think?
 
blueinsa said:
Fact?

Its not because you have zero clue as to what future agreements will be in place.

If you want to believe because it suits your narrative that UK airlines wont be able to set up routes in the EU then knock yourself out.

Im not buying it nor agreeing with it though, sorry.
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Shock / horror No.1

The lead negotiator of the EU, during key period leading up to commencement of negotiations and recognising the sycophancy at Westminster that undermines the UK, chooses to suggest a range of possible outcomes that will set hares running and feed the sycophancy and be possibly debilitating to the UK's negotiating position.

Shock / horror No. 2

Remainers desperately scraping around for something / anything - no matter now weak - seek to use it as if it represents some 'nugget' - even if it is really nothing more than yet more mineral pyrite
 
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