Another new Brexit thread

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Vic said:
I think that's marginally better than being persuaded to vote into power an undemocratic snob who detests the working class who dared to obey him.
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By gum Vic, you must have gonads like cricket balls if your door knocking spiel
revolved around telling working people stuff like this.
'Dared to obey him.'
Not persuaded to, wanted to, or decided to, they plucked up courage to do it.
Fucking wonderful is this place.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
By gum Vic, you must have gonads like cricket balls if your door knocking spiel
revolved around telling working people stuff like this.
'Dared to obey him.'
Not persuaded to, wanted to, or decided to, they plucked up courage to do it.
Fucking wonderful is this place.
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You’re a scumbag unless you vote for which way Vic tells you to.
 
bluethrunthru said:
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Do you know why Barnier is saying this?
He's not (Yet), accepted the fact that this country is now an independent nation, and will not discuss ceding it's territory, or subscribe to what he calls a level playing field, as a basis for discussion. Which means the UK won't accept EU diktats regarding state aid, or competition regulations, in other words, their rules, not ours.
The UK did not leave the EU with the conditions attached that mean we're still bound by their authority, which is pretty fucking obvious, really.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
Do you know why Barnier is saying this?
He's not (Yet), accepted the fact that this country is now an independent nation, and will not discuss ceding it's territory, or subscribe to what he calls a level playing field, as a basis for discussion. Which means the UK won't accept EU diktats regarding state aid, or competition regulations, in other words, their rules, not ours.
The UK did not leave the EU with the conditions attached that mean we're still bound by their authority, which is pretty fucking obvious, really.
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Bit too long for an Express headline. Maybe you could shorten it.
 
Anyway back on topic, it’s now becoming evident a deal likely won’t be reached, there’s too much both parties are at odds with and no deal is likely coming (heard that before haven’t we).

With the dire position of the economy now I think we may as well get it over and done with and start building again in 2021.
 
Ban-jani said:
Anyway back on topic, it’s now becoming evident a deal likely won’t be reached, there’s too much both parties are at odds with and no deal is likely coming (heard that before haven’t we).

With the dire position of the economy now I think we may as well get it over and done with and start building again in 2021.
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You may be right, but I think there will be a FTA, it's not over yet.
 
Ban-jani said:
Anyway back on topic, it’s now becoming evident a deal likely won’t be reached, there’s too much both parties are at odds with and no deal is likely coming (heard that before haven’t we).

With the dire position of the economy now I think we may as well get it over and done with and start building again in 2021.
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‘No deal’ isn’t an end state. It’s base zero which the UK will then spend a decade or so trying to climb out of. It will make the customs border between GB and NI a major impediment to internal trade, the Scots and the Welsh will make political capital out of it and we will be bound by the terms of the Withdrawal Agreement and the NI protocols which gives the EU remit over UK sovereign territory.

Irrespective of what happens, deal, no deal, tiny deal etc., these negotiations with the EU will run and run for decades. It doesn't end on 31st December. There will always be negotiations.
 
BobKowalski said:
‘No deal’ isn’t an end state. It’s base zero which the UK will then spend a decade or so trying to climb out of. It will make the customs border between GB and NI a major impediment to internal trade, the Scots and the Welsh will make political capital out of it and we will be bound by the terms of the Withdrawal Agreement and the NI protocols which gives the EU remit over UK sovereign territory.

Irrespective of what happens, deal, no deal, tiny deal etc., these negotiations with the EU will run and run for decades. It doesn't end on 31st December. There will always be negotiations.
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Thanks for the lesson Bob, I really appreciate you telling me what no deal means, I’d never ever thought about it or debated it on here at all, in fact the years 2016-2019 never happened.
 
Blue Hefner said:
Whilst I agree, I have faith in my fellow man/women. You are right as social media seems to put people in camps of pro Brexit/anti Brexit, pro mask/anti mask, pro help for refugees/they should stay in France, pro equality/just let the best person get the job. Pro BLM/Lewis Hamilton wears Hugo Boss, pro statues/anti statues etc

However, social media isn’t everyone but even if it was it’s very reactionary. Not many actually care about a particular subject just pick a side and re-hash convenient articles I.e here today gone tomorrow and onto the next ‘debate’ - I don’t think debates in the pub or workplace are half as hostile and I believe people can and do change their minds

The US election will be interesting to put this to the test. It seems lots of Republicans will be happy to vote Biden because he talks of the real issues rather than shower heads and walls etc. - trouble with the U.K. is that Brexit and the fallout is ongoing and will continue for years. If it is a disaster, will we as a country look at ourselves and our own decisions or blame someone/something else. Time will tell....
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I don't think it's as simple as social media because many wanted this from the outset. Whenever I used to go into the pub with my dad and his mates and we chatted about Brexit, they all had the same view to leave and none of them would consider anything else. Some of them can barely work their phones let alone social media and they knew exactly what they wanted before the referendum was even called and that still hasn't changed.

It needs to be remembered that leave won a victory to have the referendum in the first place. Labour suffered a defeat in 2015 because Miliband refused to offer a referendum. We've had 2 elections since and the only time Labour did well is when they offered to accept and honour the referendum result. That one time they wouldn't honour the referendum (last year) they suffered their worst election loss in almost a century.

I have never changed my mind that Brexit is indeed a bad idea but I also haven't changed my mind that we have to go through with it if only to put it to bed. The consequences of cancelling Brexit would be beneficial in most respects but regardless of anything else it's a fact that it would be exceptionally damaging to us as a democracy and society.

God only knows what's to come but the only small good in all of it is that more people wanted it and they made it so. For whatever reason that was we can never fully know nor can we judge.
 
inbetween said:
I don't think it's as simple as social media because many wanted this from the outset. Whenever I used to go into the pub with my dad and his mates and we chatted about Brexit, they all had the same view to leave and none of them would consider anything else. Some of them can barely work their phones let alone social media and they knew exactly what they wanted before the referendum was even called and that still hasn't changed.

It needs to be remembered that leave won a victory to have the referendum in the first place. Labour suffered a defeat in 2015 because Miliband refused to offer a referendum. We've had 2 elections since and the only time Labour did well is when they offered to accept and honour the referendum result. That one time they wouldn't honour the referendum (last year) they suffered their worst election loss in almost a century.

I have never changed my mind that Brexit is indeed a bad idea but I also haven't changed my mind that we have to go through with it if only to put it to bed. The consequences of cancelling Brexit would be beneficial in most respects but regardless of anything else it's a fact that it would be exceptionally damaging to us as a democracy and society.

God only knows what's to come but the only small good in all of it is that more people wanted it and they made it so. For whatever reason that was we can never fully know nor can we judge.
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It woz the Sun wot won it !

Thanks to the lovable Aussie.
 
inbetween said:
I don't think it's as simple as social media because many wanted this from the outset. Whenever I used to go into the pub with my dad and his mates and we chatted about Brexit, they all had the same view to leave and none of them would consider anything else. Some of them can barely work their phones let alone social media and they knew exactly what they wanted before the referendum was even called and that still hasn't changed.
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I agree with you mate. My Dad and his brother bang on about how better off we will be without the EU sponging off us and that post WW2 we did alright. My Dad was 4 at the end of the war and his brother yet to be born so fuck knows how they know that.
You then engage in further conversation they tell you how poor they were - how hungry - how my Granddad worked 2 jobs to try and make ends meet and how he died young, worked to death by dirty jobs with little or no protection from dust/fumes/toxic materials.
I have given up trying to point out how workers protections have come in with the EU rights we acquired through membership and they just flatly deny it.
You talk about phones well he knows how to work his alright. He gets everything via his phone - he has binned off the TV ( BBC bias, tax on the elderly - usual bollocks - he gets a free license anyway! ) and has binned off the BT phone ( the govt are listening in to your calls it seems ) and just uses his phone for everything. You can imagine what thats done to his thinking. I seldom speak to him now.
 
bluethrunthru said:
I agree with you mate. My Dad and his brother bang on about how better off we will be without the EU sponging off us and that post WW2 we did alright. My Dad was 4 at the end of the war and his brother yet to be born so fuck knows how they know that.
You then engage in further conversation they tell you how poor they were - how hungry - how my Granddad worked 2 jobs to try and make ends meet and how he died young, worked to death by dirty jobs with little or no protection from dust/fumes/toxic materials.
I have given up trying to point out how workers protections have come in with the EU rights we acquired through membership and they just flatly deny it.
You talk about phones well he knows how to work his alright. He gets everything via his phone - he has binned off the TV ( BBC bias, tax on the elderly - usual bollocks - he gets a free license anyway! ) and has binned off the BT phone ( the govt are listening in to your calls it seems ) and just uses his phone for everything. You can imagine what thats done to his thinking. I seldom speak to him now.
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None of my business, but it's tragic if either of your view points on the EU have put distance between you. I'm going to risk offending you by telling you to get a grip/sense of perspective as you only have one dad and he won't be here forever.
 
Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese said:
None of my business, but it's tragic if either of your view points on the EU have put distance between you. I'm going to risk offending you by telling you to get a grip/sense of perspective as you only have one dad and he won't be here forever.
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He is not the man who brought me up. People change and not always for the better.
 
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