Another new Brexit thread

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Vic said:
We might as well start the US trade deal thread now.

Favourable to whom? UK farmers or US farmers?

I'll be on the side of UK farmers who think we should have a red line and say we will not have lower standards on imports. If I don't understand why giving that up as a negotiating starting point is stupid, I'll be in very good company - significantly lots of rural Tory voters. And most big supermarkets. And the RSPCA. In fact most people.

Anyway, the Tory peer chair of Red Tractor is quitting after voting against the Lords amendment.

www.fwi.co.uk

Red Tractor chair to quit after food standards fiasco - Farmers Weekly

Red Tractor chair Lucy Neville-Rolfe is to stand down after opposing measures to protect British farmers against substandard food imports. Baroness
www.fwi.co.uk www.fwi.co.uk

The red tractor line.
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Both of those are the wrong side.
 
Vic said:
We might as well start the US trade deal thread now.

Favourable to whom? UK farmers or US farmers?

I'll be on the side of UK farmers who think we should have a red line and say we will not have lower standards on imports. If I don't understand why giving that up as a negotiating starting point is stupid, I'll be in very good company - significantly lots of rural Tory voters. And most big supermarkets. And the RSPCA. In fact most people.

Anyway, the Tory peer chair of Red Tractor is quitting after voting against the Lords amendment.

www.fwi.co.uk

Red Tractor chair to quit after food standards fiasco - Farmers Weekly

Red Tractor chair Lucy Neville-Rolfe is to stand down after opposing measures to protect British farmers against substandard food imports. Baroness
www.fwi.co.uk www.fwi.co.uk

The red tractor line.
Click to expand...

Another Brexit Ultra - happy to take the Red Tractor cheque when all along prepared to vote against the interests of those who she is supposed to represent.

Two stand out quotes

“Over time I am sure standards will, rightly, become more rigorous,” - over time? How much damage will be done over that time to farming, to public health?

And this beauty to show how deluded she is

“We have also successfully navigated Covid.”

Coz its all gone swimmingly hasn't it?
 
mcfc1632 said:
Spot on

Time to all look forwards and support our negotiating team
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You live in a f**king dream.

This is from the Daily Telegraph today......

Business representatives on a conference call with Boris Johnson, the Prime Minister, and Michael Gove, the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, last week were invited to get ready for the opportunities of Brexit, which Mr Gove compared to the process of moving house to one with a different view.....

Neither Government representative could say what those opportunities are supposed to be, other than making trade with our nearest neighbours more difficult......

The collective psychology of the nation is, I fear, going in exactly the wrong direction to meet challenges as big as those of Brexit, or to exploit its supposed “opportunities”. The great irony is that despite our imminent divorce, we look more like France every day.....

But it is small wonder business leaders are in a state of such high alarm. On multiple fronts, we are taking huge risks with our future. In so doing, we disobey one of the first rules of battle; never fight on more than one front at a time.

I’m reminded of Edward Lear’s poem, The Jumblies. “They went to sea in a sieve they did, in a sieve they went to sea, in spite of all their friends could say, on a winter’s morn, on a stormy day, in a sieve they went to sea!”

Please don't reply, I find your little england bullshit intensely irritating.
 
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bluethrunthru said:
Another Brexit Ultra - happy to take the Red Tractor cheque when all along prepared to vote against the interests of those who she is supposed to represent.

Two stand out quotes

“Over time I am sure standards will, rightly, become more rigorous,” - over time? How much damage will be done over that time to farming, to public health?

And this beauty to show how deluded she is

“We have also successfully navigated Covid.”

Coz its all gone swimmingly hasn't it?
Click to expand...
£700 a day, one day a week. She's probably got a consultant job lined up with the government at three times that.

Taken £100,000 off farming in three years before betraying them. But then she is a Tory.
 
The perfect fumble said:
You live in a f**king dream.

This is from the Daily Telegraph today......

Business representatives on a conference call with Boris Johnson, the Prime Minister, and Michael Gove, the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, last week were invited to get ready for the opportunities of Brexit, which Mr Gove compared to the process of moving house to one with a different view.....

Neither Government representative could say what those opportunities are supposed to be, for other than making trade with our nearest neighbours more difficult......

The collective psychology of the nation is, I fear, going in exactly the wrong direction to meet challenges as big as those of Brexit, or to exploit its supposed “opportunities”. The great irony is that despite our imminent divorce, we look more like France every day.....

But it is small wonder business leaders are in a state of such high alarm. On multiple fronts, we are taking huge risks with our future. In so doing, we disobey one of the first rules of battle; never fight on more than one front at a time.

I’m reminded of Edward Lear’s poem, The Jumblies. “They went to sea in a sieve they did, in a sieve they went to sea, in spite of all their friends could say, on a winter’s morn, on a stormy day, in a sieve they went to sea!”

Please don't reply, I find your little england bullshit intensely irritating.
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What is the best realistic answer from here if it isn't a FTA like the one I described earlier. To get that we do need Frost and his team to continue to fight for it? I might not like some of his rhetoric or tactics although I have seen worse in negotiations. Its better than the alternative though.
 
bluethrunthru said:
I was referring to the platform upon which Johnson stood claiming it was a brilliant new oven ready deal and all you suckers believed him - nobody bothered to read it - IDS actually encouraged MP's not to bother reading it - and so they were elected on a false premise that 9 months later they were - comically - whining it was not fit for purpose.

Oh and if you genuinely believe believe the WA was a document simply dictated by the EU then you are really down and ant-EU warren hole and yeah I agree - you're a waste of effort.
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All you do mate, and it’s all you’ve ever done, is spew bile about the Conservatives, there is never any objectivity, or rational response to any topic that involves politics.
The frustration over the past 15 odd years will eventually do you a serious mischief, especially as it may last another 15. Nobody disagreeing are suckers, idiots, or Ill informed simply because you think it, the evidence is massively against that.
Accept that the majority have different opinions, based on experience and past outcomes, most don’t focus on politics every waking hour. We do on here, because it’s a laugh, and interesting, and have fuck all else to do at times, but nobody has changed anyone’s opinion one jot.
 
Rascal said:
The one undisputable truth in all of this is that the Tories have made a huge fucking mess of it. The lies have encouraged xenophobic behaviour and division, the untruths have caused bewilderment and the bluster has caused blunders. The Government typically of a Johnson led anything have been unprepared, complacent and have lied. A Govt. minister has just been on Ridge talking again about an Australia type deal, a Canada type deal, its all smoke and mirrors is being done to hide their incompetence. They don't have a clue, they know they are in a corner and need to find a way out and telling more lies to cover the lies they have already told is not the answer. I would rather they were truthful and stood up and said "look everyone, we have made a right bollox of all this, we are sorry, you the electorate voted to leave and we have let you down because we are a bunch of incompetent fuckwits and we promise we will stop lying and tell you the truth. The truth will hurt us and it will hurt you too, but you voted for it and we have to sort it out. So we will stop playing these silly games and start acting like grown ups and what ever will be will be and if you think we are all cunts then so be it. Vote us out at the next election. We are leaving though as democracy has to be honoured"

The more this charade goes on the more damage it is doing to our reputation as a nation, the more extremism gains traction and the greater the divisions grow, it has to be stopped for the good of the nation. So leave with no deal, wish the EU well and thank them for being so patient with a bunch of spoilt children who want to eat there cake and have it. The desperation of some to get a deal says to me that they have realised that without a deal they know that a Socialist state becomes a real possibility and the halfwits who wanted a neo-liberal wonderland of low regulation and free market utopianism have never considered that possibility. They now realise how stupid they have been, all this posturing and British exceptionalism may might just have all been in vain. Imagine how funny it would be for the ERG nutjobs to wake up and realise they are living in a true Socialist state and there pettiness and intractability has caused it.
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Nailed it. Thread over......please..............
 
Vic said:
You forget the misery of a deal as we will still have the cost and delays of customs red tape.
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You do need to get you head around the fact that we have left in name and are executing leaving in practice.

Given that is the reality perhaps you ought to start getting behind the UK team and being positive when something goes the UK's way
 
mcfc1632 said:
You do need to get you head around the fact that we have left in name and are executing leaving in practice.

Given that is the reality perhaps you ought to start getting behind the UK team and being positive when something goes the UK's way
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It appears that fact has not yet been noticed. I could accept some of the arguments if this was a ‘Rejoining the EU’ thread, but hey ho.
 
Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese said:
I'd have thought rather than the EU having an automatic right to fish in UK waters, us agreeing to some sort of periodically renewable specified amount of access and them agreeing to something we'd like in return would be the adult way to go about things? Them wanting access to the ex-wives fanny is about as sensible as us wanting our EU cake after brexit - let the mouthpieces of the EU and the Daily Mail etc spout their respective bile and meanwhile I'm sure these conversations (negotiations) will be taking place.
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That's a really bad idea, though. I think Barnier is smart enough not to go for that.
Would the EU offer permanent access to some part of the single market for a transient access to fishing? Why?
Would the UK want access to part of the EU market, say cars, to be eternally linked to fishing? Probably not.
Would either side want eternal Brexit negotiations, which is essentially what it would be?

Fishing is a trump card for the UK. Essentially the only one they have. It is the only thing the UK have, that the EU want and that they cannot get anywhere else.
But a trump card only has value when it's played. Holding it in your hand when the game is over is usually punished at the card table, and will be in the negotiations.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
All you do mate, and it’s all you’ve ever done, is spew bile about the Conservatives, there is never any objectivity, or rational response to any topic that involves politics.
The frustration over the past 15 odd years will eventually do you a serious mischief, especially as it may last another 15. Nobody disagreeing are suckers, idiots, or Ill informed simply because you think it, the evidence is massively against that.
Accept that the majority have different opinions, based on experience and past outcomes, most don’t focus on politics every waking hour. We do on here, because it’s a laugh, and interesting, and have fuck all else to do at times, but nobody has changed anyone’s opinion one jot.
Click to expand...

as long as you believe they are a collection of intellect, genius and political giants enjoy your own little bubble.

I dislike Tories so I have my POV. Just because it doesn't match yours doesn't make it incorrect nor diminish it despite what you think.
 
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