Another new Brexit thread

[BobKowalski]

I really don't think it is. The immigration that seems to be of most concern is from non-EU countries. Certainly no asylum seekers or illegal immigrants are EU citizens. Therefore brexit has no effect whatsoever upon how these people are treated under international law. I think some people want to make the brexit debate about immigration for reasons best known to themselves.

Narrator: It really was.

 

[BobKowalski]

Sad, so very, very sad...

‘PM makes clear he wants to talk to other EU leaders’ @BBC

 

[west didsblue]

I think you answered your own question :)

I think I might.

 

[west didsblue]

Sad, so very, very sad...

‘PM makes clear he wants to talk to other EU leaders’ @BBC

And desperate.
It’s never a good look.

 

[Vic]

EU facts behind the claims: UK influence – Full Fact

In partnership with experts at the UK in a Changing Europe project, we've taken a look at the facts behind the claims on the UK's influence in the EU.

fullfact.org

Go nuts, but do be sure to read the WHOLE thing before responding, so as to understand the context of the point being made. ( I can already tell which paragraphs you'll quote and which you'll ignore, you see. You need to read the whole article)

I assume you're looking at the increase in cases lost - under a Tory government (supported by the LibDems). Is that your argument? We had to get out of the EU because the Tories were already choosing to be stupid about the EU?

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Narrator: It really was.

Why? We have an ageing population and clearly rely on immigration and will need even more in future. Sometimes it appears there is a desire to connect brexit and immigration in order to frame brexit as anti-immigration and therefore racist. Attempting to hijack the immigration debate in this way is in itself a demonisation/weaponisation of the issue and therefore cynical if not actually racist.
Keep brexit about the EU and stop using vulnerable people to prop up a failed argument for remain (please).

 

[Vic]

France have said they don’t want a bad deal for their fishermen, but with a no deal they might have no access at all. I think the eu needed to compromise on some of these issues. They can’t expect to basically have full access to our waters for instance

I think the majority of the British public will be on boris’s side if he stands up for us.

We've already conceded at least a three year transition, so I doubt that fishing is now the main stumbling block. They need our waters, we need their market.

I'd leave it to Dutch trawlermen and Scottish shellfish specialists to negotiate an equitable deal.

 

[Vic]

Iain Duncan Smith on the prospect of a disorderly exit with no deal: "This isn't going to be complete Armageddon."

So, just a bit of Armageddon.

Arf.

Armageddon in a limited and specific way.

 

[Uncle Wally One Ball]

I think you need to pay less heed to Farage and ukip tbh. Like the SNP they are single issue flag wavers that have been drifting aimlessly for four years since the vote did them out of a reason to exist. Ukip are now just a tweed-clad EDL light, and Farage is lurching from issue to issue desperate for relevance.

Yes they are now but at the time of the referendum they were full force and their message was a very significant reason why people voted to leave. That and the NHS lie.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

So another hard deadline passes and both sides want to continue to talk.

I think the reality of issues with no deal on both sides is kicking in and they may get there.

interestingly the only new deadline to this new extension is the real deadline of 31/12.

 

[Vic]

Must admit at the time given the vote was indicitive I fully expected Cameron to go back with his mandate to renegotiate then put that to the people in a binding vote.

That was Johnson's original idea.

 

[Gray]

How about having a trade deal with Europe without being involved in a political alliance. That was the original aim of the Common Market if I am not mistaken.

 

[Metal Biker]

How about having a trade deal with Europe without being involved in a political alliance. That was the original aim of the Common Market if I am not mistaken.

You mean like the EFTA?

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Yes they are now but at the time of the referendum they were full force and their message was a very significant reason why people voted to leave. That and the NHS lie.

Tbh, if we are going down the rabbit hole of projecting our own assumptions into other people's heads four years ago I'll bow out gracefully and leave you to it.

 

[Gray]

You mean like the EFTA?

Yes that as well.

 

[bluethrunthru]

Armageddon in a limited and specific way.

They are following the recipe -

"lose your main international hope of a US trade deal with the electoral defeat of the madman in chief
Add a huge amount of a global pandemic
and just a pinch of Armageddon - remember if you haven't added enough you can always add some more Armageddon
Now whisk......"

 

[Metal Biker]

Yes that as well.

Been an advocate for years.

 

[Uncle Wally One Ball]

Tbh, if we are going down the rabbit hole of projecting our own assumptions into other people's heads four years ago I'll bow out gracefully and leave you to it.

One only had to listen to the endless phone ins, news reports, interviews, Question Times, message boards and all other available information to form this opinion. Dont have to get into anyone's heads 4 years ago, just listen. It was abundantly clear that the framing of Brexit with immigration is what brought out the huge turnout and swung it to leave. Those people espousing those views dont normally go anywhere near a polling station do they? It isnt a rabbit hole it is a fact.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

One only had to listen to the endless phone ins, news reports, interviews, Question Times, message boards and all other available information to form this opinion. Dont have to get into anyone's heads 4 years ago, just listen. It was abundantly clear that the framing of Brexit with immigration is what brought out the huge turnout and swung it to leave. Those people espousing those views dont normally go anywhere near a polling station do they? It isnt a rabbit hole it is a fact.

You left out Facebook and Russia....

 

[west didsblue]

One only had to listen to the endless phone ins, news reports, interviews, Question Times, message boards and all other available information to form this opinion. Dont have to get into anyone's heads 4 years ago, just listen. It was abundantly clear that the framing of Brexit with immigration is what brought out the huge turnout and swung it to leave. Those people espousing those views dont normally go anywhere near a polling station do they? It isnt a rabbit hole it is a fact.

It’s ironic that those that say that you can’t make assumptions about the motivations of Brexit voters are more than happy to project their own opinions on these matters to the whole of the Brexit voting demographic.