Another new Brexit thread

[Cheesy]

Diane Abbot hates the deal and will vote against it.

That alone should convince most right minded people that it's probably not too bad

 

[squirtyflower]

Diane Abbot hates the deal and will vote against it.

That alone should convince most right minded people that it's probably not too bad

Too many numbers in it.

 

[Saddleworth2]

Same as now really. Striking paralels with the recent courting of Brussels, except of course the the EU are not quite the same as the folk the SNP were forming an alliance with back then.

wow. So the present day SNP would be Nazi supporters.
Not that it will trouble you much but you have really plummeted in my estimation. Fucking hell.

 

[BobKowalski]

Welcome to the next few years...’the EU made us do it, Miss!’ :)

"So may of those extra barriers and checks are being imposed by the EU as their choice."

 

[BobKowalski]

wow. So the present day SNP would be Nazi supporters.
Not that it will trouble you much but you have really plummeted in my estimation. Fucking hell.

I find it helps to put some posters on such a low bar there is nothing really to plummet from.

 

[Saddleworth2]

I find it helps to put some posters on such a low bar there is nothing really to plummet from.

I quite liked him too. Shame, hopefully he will come back and say he was joking/I have misinterpreted/sorry.

 

[BobKowalski]

Recall Barnier talking about the energy market last month...

Britain faces dearer electricity and occasional black-outs if it bans EU fishing boats from its waters after 2026. This de facto power over the UK power market is handed to the EU in the post-Brexit deal which MP’s will wave almost unread through parliament today.

The energy part of the agreement allows the UK virtually unchanged access to the continental electricity and gas markets. But that expires on exactly the same date as the fish deal - 30 June, 2026. After that (guess what?) there are “annual negotiations". @johnlichfield

 

[Metal Biker]

Too many numbers in it.

At least twenty-ten-thousand-hundred pages.

 

[hgblue]

Not too fussed? Sound like you’ve got a hard on at the prospect of division in the EU, you and a few others. Bit of a sad outlook given you’ve got the Brexit you wanted. Do you think we benefit from a divided Europe?

If I believed that taking 27 disparate nations with their own culture, history, language and political outlooks, and plonking then together in a political and economic union, was a recipe for success I wouldn’t have voted for Brexit would I? Expecting countries like Greece and Italy to have the same economic and political needs as countries like Germany and France is a spectacularly stupid idea and is doomed to fail. I suspect that far from preventing nationalism this approach will promote it and this is what we are going to see over the next few years. Unfortunately the proponents of the EU are too arrogant to recognise the error of their ways and a great deal of damage may well occur before the penny drops. However, we are out so I can watch events unfold with a certain amount of neutrality.

 

[Vic]

At least twenty-ten-thousand-hundred pages.

That was Priti Patel.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

wow. So the present day SNP would be Nazi supporters.
Not that it will trouble you much but you have really plummeted in my estimation. Fucking hell.

No, not suggesting that. More a point about their transient allegiances being driven by their slightly narrow view of their national interest. As you say, not so different to some of the royals, and elements within Ireland at the time.

 

[Saddleworth2]

No, not suggesting that. More a point about their transient allegiances being driven by their slightly narrow view of their national interest. As you say, not so different to some of the royals, and elements within Ireland at the time.

Thanks for clarifying. I can see what you are getting at by the comparison now you have explained. In that case, I still like you :-)
Ignore all my previous insults.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Thanks for clarifying. I can see what you are getting at by the comparison now you have explained. In that case, I still like you :-)
Ignore all my previous insults.

It's OK, I quite like them.x

 

[mcfc1632]

Go for it mate. Maybe in response I should call out the Whigs handling of the Irish famine. You can use history for all sorts. On second thoughts lets not either of us bother.

Whether you two bother of not - is of course up to you.

Just pointing out though that if you bring up the potato famine - it will not be the first (or even second) time that a Remain supporter has ;-)

 

[BobKowalski]

Interesting that a lot of the Tory rhetoric, or bollocks if you prefer, is largely emotional fluff about freedom or Brexit bongs rather than the substance or detail of the deal.

But then why ruin a good party with facts and reality when you can cosplay ’Braveheart’?

 

[BobKowalski]

UVL talking about China. Interesting to see how this pans out and how it fits in with the Biden Administration‘s strategy on China.

 

[bugsyblue]

Here’s something I still can’t get my head around. If a good amount of leavers feel this deal will leave us worse off and all remainers (as they’ve stated from the beginning) feel this deal will leave us worse off... why the fuck are we still proceeding?

 

[Metal Biker]

Here’s something I still can’t get my head around. If a good amount of leavers feel this deal will leave us worse off and all remainers (as they’ve stated from the beginning) feel this deal will leave us worse off... why the fuck are we still proceeding?

Where are you getting this assumption from?
And proceed with what? Leaving? We already have. The UK is officially no longer a member of the European Union. It is not recognised as such by the EU itself. So the next step is negotiating a trade deal between the UK and EU, same as Canada or Japan or Turkey have done.

If we don't proceed, we won't have a trade deal with the EU going forward. We're not 'leaving with a deal', we've already left the EU.

Is that what you want?

 

[blueparrot]

Here’s something I still can’t get my head around. If a good amount of leavers feel this deal will leave us worse off and all remainers (as they’ve stated from the beginning) feel this deal will leave us worse off... why the fuck are we still proceeding?

Freedom and sovreignty are worth more to them than jobs and a conveniences in real life. Any casualties in business are a price worth paying for that illusion of control over our laws and borders.

 

[mcfc1632]

Recall Barnier talking about the energy market last month...

Britain faces dearer electricity and occasional black-outs if it bans EU fishing boats from its waters after 2026. This de facto power over the UK power market is handed to the EU in the post-Brexit deal which MP’s will wave almost unread through parliament today.

The energy part of the agreement allows the UK virtually unchanged access to the continental electricity and gas markets. But that expires on exactly the same date as the fish deal - 30 June, 2026. After that (guess what?) there are “annual negotiations". @johnlichfield

Hmmmm - that prospect seems to give you a bit of a hard on

But the reality is that it simply proves the approach to negotiating required to deal with the EU now and in the future.

It also shows the value of a deal which provides for a transition period with regards to fishing - some on here could not get their heads around the strategic role of 'fishing' could have in negotiations - they were too busy using the limitations of the current fishing capability to demean the UK.

I would point out that I have said since 2016 that we needed to have started preparations for leaving the EU in 2016 - including a No-Deal if necessary. May lost the UK most of that window - I am hopeful that a pro-Brexit government will not lose the next 4 years.

It is straight-forward - I agree that the EU will act disproportionately - in some 'flying pickets' manner - if that is in their interests. So we just need to make sure that we use these years to prepare for how we would deal with that - and that can drive our strategy on investments.

BTW - the EU behaviour that you raise is nothing new or surprising - it was the 'attitudes' that they used with May and which made her run for cover - it has taken the prospect of a No-Deal outcome to make them modify their approach.

We need to be prepared to face them down again in 5 years - and that is why having the ability to exploit the EU's dependency on fishing is going to be helpful - but we need to prepare other strings to the bow.