Arsenal (A) | PL | Post Match Thread

[Manc in London]

I dispute it's 'now or never' btw. Arsenal will be far stronger next season than this. Dippers arguably weaker and City will be better but also in transition. You'll have Rodri back but you've got a bunch of new players to bed in. We have some world class youngsters coming through, Saka back plus at some stage the board will actually buy someone who can stick the ball in the net. Then have Zubimendi coming in (allegedly). So we will be more than competitive for the foreseeable future.

Arsenal fans: arrogant and deluded to their core. They should learn to be humble.

Word class youngsters? Name them. Now if they are world class, they should be able to walk into any side in world football and would be named in many peoples choices of their dream XI.

'City will not be good because they will have players to bed in' but Arsenal will be fine as they 'have world class youngsters coming through'. So, Arsenal youngsters will be great straightaway but our new players will need to bed in. On what basis do you come up with this? Your response should take account of Pep being a much better manager than Arteta.

 

[Lord Blue]

It's a major trophy for clubs that can't win the PL and CL, teams like Arsenal, Spuds and Newcastle.

At least Newcastle and Spuds acknowledge and know their place in the present pecking order.

I beg to differ. I think it's arrogant and self entitled to dismiss the Carabou Cup as a major trophy or to say it's important to some clubs but not others. Not calling you a rag but your comment sounds like something the rags of yesteryear would say so i'm very much distancing myself from it. No offence meant.

 

[decmancity]

That's a really bizarre reply.

That Arsenal squad doesn’t have many medals between them, They've also never won a trophy as a group, The likes of the League Cup can give players and a team collectively a taste for the bigger and better trophies, Having a winning mentality changes everything and a League Cup can kick-start winning trophies.

Pep has spoken a lot about how he liked winning the carabao which is why we did it 4 times in a row. It sets a standard, its an early trophy that you can use to kick on and motor down the final few months of the season.

 

[youngbob]

The point is that isn't what all the investment has been about - winning the Carabao. Like if we won that and nothing for the next 3 years that would be fine? No.

Since 2005 you've won four trophies, all of them FA Cups (and four Community Shields).

Not a bad record compared to the rest of the English football pyramid, but Arsenal's ambitions are much greater than that. For a team that's won so little over the last generation, you shouldn't be getting sniffy at something like the League Cup. It's a big chance for your players to win something together and show each other that they can get a job done.

In that same time (since 2005), City have won 20 major trophies, Chelsea have won 13, Liverpool have won 10 and are about to win number 11 (possibly 12), and even United have managed five major trophies since Ferguson left (15 in total since 2005). All four of City, Chelsea, Liverpool, and United have won the European Cup since 2005.

City, Chelsea, Liverpool, and United have all won the League Cup since 2005 as well.

At the end of the day, winners win and get to celebrating while losers argue with themselves over how much the loss really mattered. It's not even a case of Arsenal having bigger fish to fry - barring a Liverpool collapse this will now be five consecutive seasons without a major trophy despite having the third highest net spend in that time.

Since winning the FA Cup in 2020, Arsenal's record in cups has been a major disappointment. The 2023 Europa League run ending with that Sporting game especially. This is what we mean about all the "Stay humble eh" carry on - Arsenal have to prove they won't shit the bed every year before they can start lording it over other teams.

Especially teams like City who've won everything in sight since 2011 while Arsenal have been going out of cups to teams they should be beating, and falling short in no less than four title races (soon to be five). If you want to start giving it large then you've got to start delivering, and getting your hands on major trophies is the only way to start.

 

[supercity88]

Absolutely no chance. Carabao isn't a priority - league is and if we are unlikely to win it we still view City as Top 4 rivals so to create a 9 point gap is important.

In their wisdom our board neglected to sign a single player in the transfer window- we already have crap up front, Martinelli has done his hamstring so until Saka comes back sometime in March we are running on fumes. Not inconceivable an injury to Havertz/Trossard etc means we're having Sterling as an out and out striker in which case we'd plummet down the table so we will take the league points happily for now.

The league cup has always been a great stepping stone for teams to go on and win bigger honours. The FA Cup win didn't really lead to anything, it was a trophy for Arteta but the squad has changed significantly. Get the first cup under your belt and it boosts confidence and can lead to more. I think you should have been targeting the league cup over a petty rivalry with us that means nothing. If you're worried about top 4 then that's quite revealing as to where you stand.

If Arteta didn't want the league cup he should have sacked if off from the start rather than use so many of your first team players in games. Play the kids, concentrate on the big three. You're now left with the CL and league. The league is unlikely, but not impossible but he's burnt the players out, you've got more injuries and you've probably screwed your chances up further. And this group of players is never winning the CL based on your performances against Newcastle over two legs and loss to the rags in the cup.

 

[supercity88]

The point is that isn't what all the investment has been about - winning the Carabao. Like if we won that and nothing for the next 3 years that would be fine? No.

It's the stepping stone. It's a huge boost ahead of the title run in. It buries any doubts about your manager and players. Gets the drought out the system. It has to be used for more. A Carabao cup on its own isn't enough. But I reckon come then end of the season your players will be wishing they buried their grudge against City and used that energy to go and beat Newcastle and go on to win the league cup.

 

[bridgeno1]

In that same time (since 2005), City have won 20 major trophies, Chelsea have won 13, Liverpool have won 10 and are about to win number 11 (possibly 12), and even United have managed five major trophies since Ferguson left (15 in total since 2005). All four of City, Chelsea, Liverpool, and United have won the European Cup since 2005.

City, Chelsea, Liverpool, and United have all won the League Cup since 2005 as well.

At the end of the day, winners win and get to celebrating while losers argue with themselves over how much the loss really mattered. It's not even a case of Arsenal having bigger fish to fry - barring a Liverpool collapse this will now be five consecutive seasons without a major trophy despite having the third highest net spend in that time.

Since winning the FA Cup in 2020, Arsenal's record in cups has been a major disappointment. The 2023 Europa League run ending with that Sporting game especially. This is what we mean about all the "Stay humble eh" carry on - Arsenal have to prove they won't shit the bed every year before they can start lording it over other teams.

Especially teams like City who've won everything in sight since 2011 while Arsenal have been going out of cups to teams they should be beating, and falling short in no less than four title races (soon to be five). If you want to start giving it large then you've got to start delivering, and getting your hands on major trophies is the only way to start

It's me getting sniffy not Arsenal. Arsenal played their 1st team for the semis so it was taken seriously up until 2-0 then we took players off and the game petered out.

I'm just saying from my personal perspective if we'd won the Carabao I'd not have classified it as a successful season.

 

[mancboy]

It's me getting sniffy not Arsenal. Arsenal played their 1st team for the semis so it was taken seriously up until 2-0 then we took players off and the game petered out.

I'm just saying from my personal perspective if we'd won the Carabao I'd not have classified it as a successful season.

then you really need to get your ego in check, as has been discussed at length here, your trophy haul is meagre at best and you nor your fans are in a position to turn your nose up at anything

 

[bridgeno1]

The league cup has always been a great stepping stone for teams to go on and win bigger honours. The FA Cup win didn't really lead to anything, it was a trophy for Arteta but the squad has changed significantly. Get the first cup under your belt and it boosts confidence and can lead to more. I think you should have been targeting the league cup over a petty rivalry with us that means nothing. If you're worried about top 4 then that's quite revealing as to where you stand.

If Arteta didn't want the league cup he should have sacked if off from the start rather than use so many of your first team players in games. Play the kids, concentrate on the big three. You're now left with the CL and league. The league is unlikely, but not impossible but he's burnt the players out, you've got more injuries and you've probably screwed your chances up further. And this group of players is never winning the CL based on your performances against Newcastle over two legs and loss to the rags in the cup.

We're not winning the league or the CL. Ironically in the CL I reckon we could get past a Real or a Barca - it would be a really savvy side like Inter or Atletico that would tactically outmanouver us.

That being said it's clear (to me at least) that the foundations of a title-winning level side are there - take that Arsenal defence and midfield and add a top quality striker to it and that's a team that will challenge for everything. The fact I'm typing this as something that's fairly obvious and yet Arteta somehow didn't see it is a subject for another day - basically we could have not signed Calafiori and Merino and instead spent £100m on a ninja up front and I reckon we'd be in a much better place.

 

[bridgeno1]

Since 2005 you've won four trophies, all of them FA Cups (and four Community Shields).

Not a bad record compared to the rest of the English football pyramid, but Arsenal's ambitions are much greater than that. For a team that's won so little over the last generation, you shouldn't be getting sniffy at something like the League Cup. It's a big chance for your players to win something together and show each other that they can get a job done.

In that same time (since 2005), City have won 20 major trophies, Chelsea have won 13, Liverpool have won 10 and are about to win number 11 (possibly 12), and even United have managed five major trophies since Ferguson left (15 in total since 2005). All four of City, Chelsea, Liverpool, and United have won the European Cup since 2005.

City, Chelsea, Liverpool, and United have all won the League Cup since 2005 as well.

At the end of the day, winners win and get to celebrating while losers argue with themselves over how much the loss really mattered. It's not even a case of Arsenal having bigger fish to fry - barring a Liverpool collapse this will now be five consecutive seasons without a major trophy despite having the third highest net spend in that time.

Since winning the FA Cup in 2020, Arsenal's record in cups has been a major disappointment. The 2023 Europa League run ending with that Sporting game especially. This is what we mean about all the "Stay humble eh" carry on - Arsenal have to prove they won't shit the bed every year before they can start lording it over other teams.

Especially teams like City who've won everything in sight since 2011 while Arsenal have been going out of cups to teams they should be beating, and falling short in no less than four title races (soon to be five). If you want to start giving it large then you've got to start delivering, and getting your hands on major trophies is the only way to start.

I don't like what you've written but I don't disagree with any of it either - all are very valid points.

 

[Keeper!]

I beg to differ. I think it's arrogant and self entitled to dismiss the Carabou Cup as a major trophy or to say it's important to some clubs but not others. Not calling you a rag but your comment sounds like something the rags of yesteryear would say so i'm very much distancing myself from it. No offence meant.

Non taken, for clubs genuinely chasing the title and CL for me it's a serious distraction.

 

[wagonman]

I never thought I would EVER prefer the Bin Dipping Scousers to win the title over any other team but this season I would rather they win it over the arrogant losers Arsenal.

A message for any lurking Arsenal fans...

Your constant whining and complaining and excuses (which start with your "won very little as manager" Arteta) don't do you any favours.

You haven't won the title for years and you are not going to win it this year either. "Title Chasers" my arse!

You will not win any cups this year... in fact you won't win anything this year.

Arsenal = Losers.

Now do me a favour and fuck off...

JJ

PS. We are the Champions... you are NOT.

 

[Bluemoon dan]

A weird trend I have noticed this season is teams going on really bad runs after they have beaten us. Arsenal obviously lost last night after Sunday but going back through the results over the past few months shows it's not unusual.
Going back to November, Brighton beat us and then only won 1 of their next 10, Spurs lost their next 5 after beating us. The rags didn't win any of their next 7 and both Villa and Bournemouth both lost their next 2. Even Liverpool didn't win either of their next 2 league games after turning us over!
A cross that clubs we are due to play over the next few weeks need to be aware of!

 

[Lovebitesandeveryfing]

Pep has spoken a lot about how he liked winning the carabao which is why we did it 4 times in a row. It sets a standard, its an early trophy that you can use to kick on and motor down the final few months of the season.

And that is so true. If you've got the squad — and yes, it's vital to be able to rotate at all stages of the League Cup, and bring in good players, not just makeweights — it creates a significant feel good factor. Incidentally, this is something Pellegrini discovered in his first season.
This is why I'll always say that, for me, winning the domestic treble was just about as important as winning the European one. Given that you can be knocked out of one trophy as early as September, you've got to be on it, right through the season. Sure, it doesn't have anything like the prestige of the European treble, or the global visibility. But the fact that it's only ever been done by one club tells you something.
Let's keep our fingers crossed that a second club doesn't join us in that, this season. Or a third club in the European version. We'd never hear the bloody end of it…

 

[youngbob]

It's me getting sniffy not Arsenal. Arsenal played their 1st team for the semis so it was taken seriously up until 2-0 then we took players off and the game petered out.

I'm just saying from my personal perspective if we'd won the Carabao I'd not have classified it as a successful season.

But it should be considered a successful season. Money doesn't guarantee you trophies, it just puts you in a better position to win them. A top four finish and a major cup is a fantastic achievement for any team, regardless of the money spent. Football's about collecting happy memories you can look back on when you're old and dying and a day out at Wembley and seeing your team lift a pot is just about the best memory you can get your hands on.

 

[TonyColemansbagofapples]

I don't know what you want me to say. Should I start crying that we are out of a cup that was like 5th priority? Our priorities in order at start of season were (in my opinion)
1. Beat Manchester City
2. PL
3. Cl
4. Top 4
5. FA Cup
6. EFL Cup.

Maybe other Arsenal fans are miffed - it is what it is, Newcastle deserve to be in the final, best of luck to them against whichever of the 2 nasty mofo clubs they play against.

Arsenal struggle against Newcastle - they have our number. It doesn't correlate with how other teams fare against us though as Newcastle have a specific player set that works against us but other teams don't play that way and can't replicate it. If we played City next week we'd beat you probably. If we played Newcastle next week they'd probably beat us. Other teams find it less difficult against them. At the end of the season the table settles it and we will finish above them based on how they did against other teams and how we did against other teams.

I think you've missed one

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

But it should be considered a successful season. Money doesn't guarantee you trophies, it just puts you in a better position to win them. A top four finish and a major cup is a fantastic achievement for any team, regardless of the money spent. Football's about collecting happy memories you can look back on when you're old and dying and a day out at Wembley and seeing your team lift a pot is just about the best memory you can get your hands on.

So true. I have enjoyed all our League Cup wins. In fact the atmosphere at those finals was better than the FA Cup Final because more local fans get tickets.

 

[Mr Grumpy]

I'm now annoyed that we lost the way we did to an Arsenal side beaten 2-0 in what is their last realistic chance of silverware by the Geordies.

How far we have fallen.

 

[TonyColemansbagofapples]

The League Cup was the first trophy I saw us win , 1970 v West Brom. Always loved the competition.

 

[Rochdale Blue]

Absolutely no chance. Carabao isn't a priority - league is and if we are unlikely to win it we still view City as Top 4 rivals so to create a 9 point gap is important.

In their wisdom our board neglected to sign a single player in the transfer window- we already have crap up front, Martinelli has done his hamstring so until Saka comes back sometime in March we are running on fumes. Not inconceivable an injury to Havertz/Trossard etc means we're having Sterling as an out and out striker in which case we'd plummet down the table so we will take the league points happily for now.

I suppose it wasn't a priority when the only full part of your ground contained City supporters just days after we beat you in the league cup.